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MY MEMORIES OF 
EIGHTY YEARS 




From a photograph /cvbyvifhted- iu fTndevwood and Underwood 



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(]/li, ^cAcuA 



On His#8G™ Birth dav 




MY MEMORIES OF 
EIGHTY YEARS 



BY 

CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 



NEW YORK 
CHARLES SCRIBNER'S SONS 

1922 



• 6 (c 



Copyright, 1921, 1922. by 
CHARLES SCRIBNER'S SONS 



Published March, 1922 



22 - 7S18 



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PRINTED AT 

THE SCRIBNER PRESS 
NEW YORK, U. S. A. 



MAR 27 1922 
©CI.A659417 



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TO MY WIFE 

MAY PALMER DEPEW 

THIS BOOK GREW FROM HER 
ENCOURAGEMENT 



FOREWORD 

For many years my friends have insisted upon my 
putting in permanent form the incidents in my life which 
have interested them. It has been my good fortune to 
take part in history-making meetings and to know more 
or less intimately people prominent in world affairs in 
many countries. Every one so situated has a flood of 
recollections which pour out when occasion stirs the 
memory. Often the listeners wish these transcribed for 
their own use. 

My classmate at Yale in the class of 1856, John D. 
Champlin, a man of letters and an accomplished editor, 
rescued from my own scattered records and newspaper 
files material for eight volumes. My secretary has 
selected and compiled for publication two volumes since. 
These are principally speeches, addresses, and contribu- 
tions which have appeared in public. Several writers, 
without my knowledge, have selected special matter 
from these volumes and made books. 

Andrew D. White, Senator Hoar, and Senator Foraker, 
with whom I w r as associated for years, have published 
full and valuable autobiographies. I do not attempt 
anything so elaborate or complete. Never having kept 
a diary, I am dependent upon a good memory. I have 

vii 



viii FOREWORD 

discarded the stories which could not well be published 

until long after I have joined the majority. 

I trust and earnestly hope there is nothing in these 

recollections which can offend anybody. It has been 

my object so to picture events and narrate stories as to 

illumine the periods through which I have passed for 

eighty-eight years, and the people whom I have known 

and mightily enjoyed. 

C. M. D. 



CONTENTS 



PAGE 



I. Childhood and Youth 3 

II. In Public Life 17 

III. Abraham Lincoln 52 

IV. General Grant 67 

V. ROSCOE CONKLING 75 

VI. Horace Greeley 87 

VII. Rutherford B. Hayes and William M. Evarts 99 

VIII. General Garfield 107 

IX. Chester A. Arthur 116 

X. Grover Cleveland 124 

XI. Benjamin Harrison 129 

XII. James G. Blaine 141 

XIII. William McKinley 147 

XIV. Theodore Roosevelt 158 

XV. United States Senate 17 5 

XVI. Ambassadors and Ministers 19 1 

XVII. Governors of New York State 209 

iz 



x CONTENTS 



PAGE 



XVIII. Fifty-six Years with the New York Central 

Railroad Company 225 

XIX. Recollections from Abroad 256 

XX. Orators and Campaign Speakers 313 

XXI. National Republican Conventions .... 339 

XXII. Journalists and Financiers 344 

XXIII. Actors and Men of Letters 358 

XXIV. Societies and Public Banquets 374 

Index 411 



MY MEMORIES OF 
EIGHTY YEARS 



CHILDHOOD AND YOUTH 

It has occurred to me that some reminiscences of a 
long life would be of interest to my family and friends. 

My memory goes back for more than eighty years. I 
recall distinctly when about five years old my mother 
took me to the school of Mrs. Westbrook, wife of the 
well-known pastor of the Dutch Reformed church, who 
had a school in her house, within a few doors. The lady 
was a highly educated woman, and her husband, Doctor 
Westbrook, a man of letters as well as a preacher. He 
specialized in ancient history, and the interest he aroused 
in Roman and Greek culture and achievements has con- 
tinued with me ever since. 

The village of Peekskill at that time had between two 
and three thousand inhabitants. Its people were nearly 
all Revolutionary families who had settled there in 
colonial times. There had been very little immigration 
either from other States or abroad; acquaintance was 
universal, and in the activities of the churches there was 
general co-operation among the members. Church at- 
tendance was so unanimous that people, young or old, 
who failed to be in their accustomed places on Sunday 
felt the disapproval of the community. 

Social activities of the village were very simple, but 
very delightful and healthful. There were no very rich 
nor very poor. Nearly every family owned its own 
house or was on the way to acquire one. Misfortune of 
any kind aroused common interest and sympathy. A 

3 



4 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

helping hand of neighborliness was always extended to 
those in trouble or distress. Peekskill was a happy 
community and presented conditions of life and living of 
common interest, endeavor, and sympathy not possible 
in these days of restless crowds and fierce competition. 

The Peekskill Academy was the dominant educational 
institution, and drew students not only from the village 
but from a distance. It fitted them for college, and I 
was a student there for about twelve years. The acad- 
emy was a character-making institution, though it 
lacked the thoroughness of the New England preparatory 
schools. Its graduates entering into the professions or 
business had an unusual record of success in life. I do 
not mean that they accumulated great fortunes, but 
they acquired independence and were prominent and 
useful citizens in all localities where they settled. 

I graduated from the Peekskill Academy in 1852. I 
find on the programme of the exercises of that day, 
which some old student preserved, that I was down for 
several original speeches, while the other boys had 
mainly recitations. Apparently my teachers had de- 
cided to develop any oratorical talent I might possess. 

I entered Yale in 1852 and graduated in 1856. The 
college of that period was very primitive compared with 
the university to which it has grown. Our class of 
ninety-seven was regarded as unusually large. The 
classics and mathematics, Greek and Latin, were the 
dominant features of instruction. Athletics had not yet 
appeared, though rowing and boat-racing came in dur- 
ing my term. The outstanding feature of the institu- 
tion was the literary societies: the Linonia and the 
Brothers of Unity. The debates at the weekly meetings 
were kept up and maintained upon a high and efficient 



CHILDHOOD AND YOUTH 5 

plane. Both societies were practically deliberative bod- 
ies and discussed with vigor the current questions of the 
day. Under this training Yale sent out an unusual 
number of men who became eloquent preachers, distin- 
guished physicians, and famous lawyers. While the ma- 
jority of students now on leaving college enter business 
or professions like engineering, which is allied to busi- 
ness, at that time nearly every young man was destined 
for the ministry, law, or medicine. My own class fur- 
nished two of the nine judges of the Supreme Court of 
the United States, and a large majority of those who 
were admitted to the bar attained judicial honors. It is 
a singular commentary on the education of that time 
that the students who won the highest honors and car- 
ried off the college prizes, which could only be done by 
excelling in Latin, Greek, and mathematics, were far 
outstripped in after-life by their classmates who fell 
below their high standard of collegiate scholarship but 
were distinguished for an all-around interest in subjects 
not features in the college curriculum. 

My classmates, Justice David J. Brewer and Justice 
Henry Billings Brown, were both eminent members of 
the Supreme Court of the United States. Brewer was 
distinguished for the wide range of his learning and 
illuminating addresses on public occasions. He was bi- 
centennial orator of the college and a most acceptable 
one. Wayne MacVeagh, afterwards attorney-general of 
the United States, one of the leaders of the bar, also 
one of the most brilliant orators of his time, was in col- 
lege with me, though not a classmate. Andrew D. 
White, whose genius, scholarship, and organization en- 
abled Ezra Cornell to found Cornell University, was 
another of my college mates. He became one of the 



6 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

most famous of our diplomats and the author of many 
books of permanent value. My friendship with Mac- 
Veagh and White continued during their lives, that is, 
for nearly sixty years. MacVeagh was one of the readi- 
est and most attractive of speakers I ever knew. He 
had a very sharp and caustic wit, which made him 
exceedingly popular as an after-dinner speaker and as a 
host in his own house. He made every evening when he 
entertained, for those who were fortunate enough to be 
his guests, an occasion memorable in their experience. 

John Mason Brown, of Kentucky, became afterwards 
the leader of the bar in his State, and was about to 
receive from President Harrison an appointment as jus- 
tice of the Supreme Court when he died suddenly. If he 
had been appointed it would have been a remarkable 
circumstance that three out of nine judges of the great- 
est of courts, an honor which is sought by every one of 
the hundreds of thousands of lawyers in the United 
States, should have been from the same college and the 
same class. 

The faculty lingers in my memory, and I have the 
same reverence and affection for its members, though 
sixty-five years out of college, that I had the day I grad- 
uated. Our president, Theodore D. Woolsey, was a 
wonderful scholar and a most inspiring teacher. Yale 
has always been fortunate in her presidents, and pecu- 
liarly so in Professor Woolsey. He had personal distinc- 
tion, and there was about him an air of authority and 
reserved power which awed the most radical and rebel- 
lious student, and at the same time he had the respect 
and affection of all. In his historical lectures he had a 
standard joke on the Chinese, the narration of which 
amused him the more with each repetition. It was that 



CHILDHOOD AND YOUTH 7 

when a Chinese army was beleaguered and besieged in a 
fortress their provisions gave out and they decided to 
escape. They selected a very dark night, threw open 
the gates, and as they marched out each soldier carried 
a lighted lantern. 

In the faculty were several professors of remarkable 
force and originality. The professor of Greek, Mr. 
Hadley, father of the distinguished ex-president of Yale, 
was more than his colleagues in the thought and talk 
of the undergraduates. His learning and pre-eminence 
in his department were universally admitted. He had a 
caustic wit and his sayings were the current talk of the 
campus. He maintained discipline, which was quite lax 
in those days, by the exercise of this ability. Some of 
the boys once drove a calf into the recitation-room. 
Professor Hadley quietly remarked: "You will take out 
that animal. We will get along to-day with our usual 
number." It is needless to say that no such experiment 
was ever repeated. 

At one time there was brought up in the faculty meet- 
ing a report that one of the secret societies was about to 
bore an artesian well in the cellar of their club house. 
It was suggested that such an extraordinary expense 
should be prohibited. Professor Hadley closed the dis- 
cussion and laughed out the subject by saying from what 
he knew of the society, if it would hold a few sessions 
over the place where the artesian well was projected, the 
boring would be accomplished without cost. The pro- 
fessor was a sympathetic and very wise adviser to the 
students. If any one was in trouble he would always 
go to him and give most helpful relief. 

Professor Larned inspired among the students a dis- 
criminating taste for the best English literature and an 



8 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

ardent love for its classics. Professor Thacher was one 
of the most robust and vigorous thinkers and teachers of 
his period. He was a born leader of men, and genera- 
tion after generation of students who graduated carried 
into after-life the effects of his teaching and personality. 
We all loved Professor Olmstead, though we were not 
vitally interested in his department of physics and biol- 
ogy. He was a purist in his department, and so confi- 
dent of his principles that he thought it unnecessary to 
submit them to practical tests. One of the students, 
whose room was immediately over that of the professor, 
took up a plank from the flooring, and by boring a very 
small hole in the ceiling found that he could read the 
examination papers on the professor's desk. The in- 
formation of this reaching the faculty, the professor was 
asked if he had examined the ceiling. He said that was 
unnecessary, because he had measured the distance be- 
tween the ceiling and the surface of his desk and found 
that the line of vision connected so far above that noth- 
ing could be read on the desk. 

Timothy Dwight, afterwards president, was then a 
tutor. Learning, common sense, magnetism, and all- 
around good-fellowship were wonderfully united in Presi- 
dent Dwight. He was the most popular instructor and 
best loved by the boys. He had a remarkable talent for 
organization, which made him an ideal president. He 
possessed the rare faculty of commanding and convincing 
not only the students but his associates in the faculty 
and the members of the corporation when discussing and 
deciding upon business propositions and questions of 
policy. 

The final examinations over, commencement day 
arrived. The literary exercises and the conferring of de- 



CHILDHOOD AND YOUTH 9 

grees took place in the old Center Church. I was one of 
the speakers and selected for my subject "The Hudson 
River and Its Traditions." I was saturated from early- 
association and close investigation and reading with the 
crises of the Revolutionary War, which were successfully 
decided on the patriots' side on the banks of the Hudson. 
I lived near Washington Irving, and his works I knew 
by heart, especially the tales which gave to the Hudson 
a romance like the Rhine's. The subject was new for 
an academic stage, and the speech made a hit. Never- 
theless, it was the saddest and most regretful day of my 
life when I left Yale. 

My education, according to the standard of the time, 
was completed, and my diploma was its evidence. It 
has been a very interesting question with me how much 
the academy and the college contributed to that educa- 
tion. Their discipline was necessary and their training 
essential. Four years of association with the faculty, 
learned, finely equipped, and sympathetic, was a won- 
derful help. The free associations of the secret and de- 
bating societies, the campus, and the sports were invalu- 
able, and the friendships formed with congenial spirits 
added immensely to the pleasures and compensations of 
a long life. 

In connection with this I may add that, as it has been 
my lot in the peculiar position which I have occupied for 
more than half a century as counsel and adviser for a 
great corporation and its creators and the many suc- 
cessful men of business who have surrounded them, I 
have learned to know how men who have been denied 
in their youth the opportunities for education feel when 
they are in possession of fortunes, and the world seems 
at their feet. Then they painfully recognize their Iimi- 



io CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

tations, then they know their weakness, then they under- 
stand that there are things which money cannot buy, 
and that there are gratifications and triumphs which no 
fortune can secure. The one lament of all those men 
has been: "Oh, if I had been educated! I would sacri- 
fice all that I have to obtain the opportunities of the 
college, to be able to sustain not only conversation and 
discussion with the educated men with whom I come in 
contact, but competent also to enjoy what I see is a 
delight to them beyond anything which I know." 

But I recall gratefully other influences quite as impor- 
tant to one's education. My father was a typical busi- 
ness man, one of the pioneers of river transportation be- 
tween our village and New York, and also a farmer and 
a merchant. He was a stern man devoted to his family, 
and, while a strict disciplinarian, very fond of his 
children. 

My mother was a woman of unusual intellect border- 
ing upon genius. There were no means of higher educa- 
tion at that period, but her father, who was an eminent 
lawyer, and her grandfather, a judge, finding her so 
receptive, educated her with the care that was given to 
boys who were intended for a professional life. She was 
well versed in the literature of the time of Queen Eliza- 
beth and Queen Anne, and, with a retentive memory, 
knew by heart many of the English classics. She wrote 
well, but never for publication. Added to these accom- 
plishments were rare good sense and prophetic vision. 
The foundation and much of the superstructure of all 
that I have and all that I am were her work. She was a 
rigid Calvinist, and one of her many lessons has been of 
inestimable comfort to me. Several times in my life I 
have met with heavy misfortunes and what seemed irrep- 



CHILDHOOD AND YOUTH u 

arable losses. I have returned home to find my mother 
with wise advice and suggestions ready to devote her- 
- self to the reconstruction of my fortune, and to brace me 
up. She always said what she thoroughly believed: 
"My son, this which you think so great a calamity is 
really divine discipline. The Lord has sent it to you 
for your own good, because in His infinite wisdom He 
saw that you needed it. I am absolutely certain that if 
you submit instead of repining and protesting, if you 
will ask with faith and proper spirit for guidance and 
help, they both will come to you and with greater bless- 
ings than you ever had before." That faith of my 
mother inspired and intensified my efforts and in every 
instance her predictions proved true. 

Every community has a public-spirited citizen who 
unselfishly devotes himself or herself to the public good. 
That citizen of Peekskill in those early days was Doctor 
James Brewer. He had accumulated a modest compe- 
tence sufficient for his simple needs as bachelor. He was 
either the promoter or among the leaders of all the 
movements for betterment of the town. He established 
a circulating library upon most liberal terms, and it 
became an educational institution of benefit. The books 
were admirably selected, and the doctor's advice to read- 
ers was always available. His taste ran to the English 
classics, and he had all the standard authors in poetry, 
history, fiction, and essay. 

No pleasure derived in reading in after-years gave me 
such delight as the Waverley Novels. I think I read 
through that library and some of it several times over. 

The excitement as the novels of Dickens and Thack- 
eray began to appear equalled almost the enthusiasm of 
a political campaign. Each one of those authors had 



12 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

ardent admirers and partisans. The characters of Dick- 
ens became household companions. Every one was 
looking for the counterpart of Micawber or Sam Weller, 
Pecksniff or David Copperfield, and had little trouble 
in finding them either in the family circle or among the 
neighbors. 

Dickens's lectures in New York, which consisted of 
readings from his novels, were an event which has rarely 
been duplicated for interest. With high dramatic ability 
he brought out before the audience the characters from 
his novels with whom all were familiar. Every one in 
the crowd had an idealistic picture in his mind of the 
actors of the story. It was curious to note that the 
presentation which the author gave coincided with the 
idea of the majority of his audience. I was fresh from 
the country but had with me that evening a rather ultra- 
fashionable young lady. She said she was not inter- 
ested in the lecture because it represented the sort of 
people she did not know and never expected to meet; 
they were a very common lot. In her subsequent career 
in this country and abroad she had to her credit three 
matrimonial adventures and two divorces, but none of 
her husbands were of the common lot. 

Speaking of Dickens, one picture remains indelibly 
pressed upon my memory. It was the banquet given 
him at which Horace Greeley presided. Everybody was 
as familiar with Mr. Pickwick and his portrait by Cruik- 
shank in Dickens's works as with one's father. When 
Mr. Greeley arose to make the opening speech and in- 
troduce the guest of the evening, his likeness to this 
portrait of Pickwick was so remarkable that the whole 
audience, including Mr. Dickens, shouted their delight 
in greeting an old and well-beloved friend. 



CHILDHOOD AND YOUTH 13 

Another educational opportunity came in my way be- 
cause one of my uncles was postmaster of the village. 
Through his post-office came several high-class maga- 
zines and foreign reviews. There was no rural delivery 
in those days, and the mail could only be had on per- 
sonal application, and the result was that the subscribers 
of these periodicals frequently left them a long time be- 
fore they were called for. I was an omnivorous reader 
of everything available, and as a result these publica- 
tions, especially the foreign reviews, became a fascinat- 
ing source of information and culture. They gave from 
the first minds of the century criticisms of current litera- 
ture and expositions of political movements and public 
men which became of infinite value in after-years. 

Another unincorporated and yet valuable school was 
the frequent sessions at the drug store of the elder states- 
men of the village. On certain evenings these men, rep- 
resenting most of the activities of the village, would 
avail themselves of the hospitable chairs about the stove 
and discuss not only local matters but the general con- 
ditions of the country, some of them revolving about 
the constitutionality of various measures which had 
been proposed and enacted into laws. They nearly all 
related to slavery, the compromise measures, the intro- 
duction of slaves into new territories, the fugitive slave 
law, and were discussed with much intelligence and in- 
formation. The boys heard them talked about in their 
homes and were eager listeners on the outskirts of this 
village congress. Such institutions are not possible ex- 
cept in the universal acquaintance, fellowship, and con- 
fidences of village and country life. They were the 
most important factors in forming that public opinion, 
especially among the young, which supported Mr. Lincoln 



i 4 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

in his successful efforts to save the Union at whatever 
cost. 

A few days after returning home from Yale I entered 
the office of Edward Wells, a lawyer of the village, as a 
student. Mr. Wells had attained high rank in his pro- 
fession, was a profound student of the law, and had a 
number of young men, fitting them for the bar under 
his direction. 

I was admitted to the bar in 1858, and immediately 
opened an office in the village. My first client was a 
prosperous farmer who wanted an opinion on a rather 
complicated question. I prepared the case with great 
care. He asked me what my fee was, and I told him 
five dollars. He said: "A dollar and seventy-five is 
enough for a young lawyer like you.*' Subsequently he 
submitted the case to one of the most eminent lawyers in 
New York, who came to the same conclusion and charged 
him five hundred dollars. On account of this gentle- 
man's national reputation the farmer thought that fee 
was very reasonable. In subsequent years I have re- 
ceived several very large retainers, but none of them 
gave so much satisfaction as that dollar and seventy-five 
cents, which I had actually earned after having been so 
long dependent on my father. 

After some years of private practice Commodore Van- 
derbilt sent for me and offered the attorneyship for the 
New York and Harlem Railroad. I had just been nomi- 
nated and confirmed United States minister to Japan. 
The appointment was a complete surprise to me, as I 
was not an applicant for any federal position. The sal- 
ary was seven thousand five hundred dollars and an out- 
fit of nine thousand. The commodore's offer of the 
attorneyship for the Harlem Railroad, which was his 



CHILDHOOD AND YOUTH i 5 

first venture in railroading, was far less than the salary 
as minister. When I said this to the commodore, he 
remarked: 'Railroads are the career for a young man; 
there is nothing in politics. Don't be a damned fool." 
That decided me, and on the ist of January, 1921, I 
rounded out fifty-five years in the railway service of this 
corporation and its allied lines. 

Nothing has impressed me more than little things, and 
apparently immaterial ones, which have influenced the 
careers of many people. My father and his brothers, 
all active business men, were also deeply interested in 
politics, not on the practical side but in policies and gov- 
ernmental measures. They were uncompromising Dem- 
ocrats of the most conservative type; they believed that 
interference with slavery of any kind imperilled the 
union of the States, and that the union of the States was 
the sole salvation of the perpetuity of the republic and 
its liberties. I went to Yale saturated with these ideas. 
Yale was a favorite college for Southern people. There 
was a large element from the slaveholding States among 
the students. It was so considerable that these South- 
erners withdrew from the great debating societies of the 
college and formed a society of their own, which they 
called the Calliopean. Outside of these Southerners 
there were very few Democrats among the students, and 
I came very near being drawn into the Calliopean, but 
happily escaped. 

The slavery question in all its phases of fugitive slave 
law and its enforcement, the extension of slavery into 
the new territories, or its prohibition, and of the aboli- 
tion of the institution by purchase or confiscation were 
subjects of discussion on the campus, in the literary 
societies, and in frequent lectures in the halls in New 



16 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

Haven by the most prominent and gifted speakers and 
advocates. 

That was a period when even in the most liberal 
churches the pulpit was not permitted to preach politics, 
and slavery was pre-eminently politics. But according 
to an old New England custom, the pastor was given a 
free hand on Thanksgiving Day to unburden his mind 
of everything which had been bubbling and seething 
there for a year. One of the most eminent and eloquent 
of New England preachers was the Reverend Doctor 
Bacon, of Center Church, New Haven. His Thanks- 
giving sermon was an event eagerly anticipated by the 
whole college community. He was violently anti- 
slavery. His sermons were not only intently listened 
to but widely read, and their effect in promoting anti- 
slavery sentiment was very great. 

The result of several years of these associations and 
discussions converted me, and I became a Republican on 
the principles enunciated in the first platform of the 
party in 1856. When I came home from Yale the situa- 
tion in the family became very painful, because my 
father was an intense partisan. He had for his party 
both faith and love, and was shocked and grieved at his 
son's change of principles. He could not avoid con- 
stantly discussing the question, and was equally hurt 
either by opposition or silence. 



II 

IN PUBLIC LIFE 

The campaign of 1856 created an excitement in our 
village which had never been known since the Revo- 
lutionary War. The old families who had been settled 
there since colonial days were mainly pro-slavery and 
Democratic, while the Republican party was recruited 
very largely from New England men and in a minority. 

Several times in our national political campaigns there 
has been one orator who drew audiences and received 
public attention and reports in the newspapers beyond 
all other speakers. On the Democratic side during that 
period Horatio Seymour was pre-eminent. On the Re- 
publican side in the State of New York the attractive 
figure was George William Curtis. His books were very 
popular, his charming personality, the culture and the 
elevation of his speeches put him in a class by himself. 

The Republicans of the village were highly elated 
when they had secured the promise of Mr. Curtis to 
speak at their most important mass meeting. The occa- 
sion drew together the largest audience the village had 
known, composed not only of residents but many from 
a distance. The committee of arrangements finally re- 
ported to the waiting audience that the last train had 
arrived, but Mr. Curtis had not come. 

It suddenly occurred to the committee that it would 
be a good thing to call a young recruit from a well- 
known Democratic family and publicly commit him. 
First came the invitation, then the shouting, and when I 

17 



18 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

arose they cried "platform," and I was escorted to the 
platform, but had no idea of making a speech. My 
experience for years at college and at home had saturated 
me with the questions at issue in all their aspects. From 
a full heart, and a sore one, I poured out a confession of 
faith. I thought I had spoken only a few minutes, but 
found afterwards that it was over an hour. The local 
committee wrote to the State committee about the meet- 
ing, and in a few days I received a letter from the chair- 
man of the State committee inviting me to fill a series of 
engagements covering the whole State of New York. 

The campaign of 1856 differed from all others in mem- 
ory of men then living. The issues between the parties 
appealed on the Republican side to the young. There 
had grown up among the young voters an intense hos- 
tility to slavery. The moral force of the arguments 
against the institution captured them. They had no 
hostility to the South, nor to the Southern slaveholders; 
they regarded their position as an inheritance, and were 
willing to help on the lines of Mr. Lincoln's original idea 
of purchasing the slaves and freeing them. But the 
suggestion had no friends among the slaveholders. 
These young men believed that any extension or 
strengthening of the institution would be disastrous to 
the country. The threatened dissolution of the Union, 
secession, or rebellion did not frighten them. 

Political conventions are the most interesting of popu- 
lar gatherings. The members have been delegated by 
their fellow citizens to represent them, and they are 
above the average in intelligence, political information of 
conditions in the State and nation, as the convention 
represents the State or the republic. The belief that 
they are generally boss-governed is a mistake. The 



IN PUBLIC LIFE i 9 

party leader, sometimes designated as boss, invariably 
consults with the strongest men there are in the conven- 
tion before he arrives at a decision. He is generally 
successful, because he has so well prepared the way, and 
his own judgment is always modified and frequently 
changed in these conferences. 

In 1858 I had the first sensation of the responsibility 
of public office. I was not an applicant for the place; 
in fact, knew nothing about it until I was elected a dele- 
gate to the Republican State convention from the third 
assembly district of Westchester County. The conven- 
tion was held at Syracuse. The Westchester delegates 
arrived late at night or, rather, early in the morning, 
and we came to the hotel with large numbers of other 
delegates from different sections who had arrived on the 
same train. It was two o'clock, but the State leader, 
Thurlow Weed, was in the lobby of the hotel to greet 
the delegates. He said to me: "You are from Peeks- 
kill. With whom are you studying law?" I answered: 
"With Judge William Nelson." "Oh," he remarked, "I 
remember Judge Nelson well. He was very active in 
the campaign of 1828." It was a feat of memory to 
thus recall the usefulness of a local politician thirty 
years before. I noticed, as each delegate was intro- 
duced, that Mr. Weed had some neighborhood recollec- 
tions of the man which put a tag on him. 

The next day, as we met the leader, he recalled us by 
name, the places where we lived, and the districts rep- 
resented. Mr. Blaine was the only other man I ever 
met or knew who possessed this extraordinary gift for 
party leadership. 

There was a revolt in the convention among the young 
members, who had a candidate of their own. Mr. 



20 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

Weed's candidate for governor was Edwin D. Morgan, a 
successful New York merchant, who had made a good 
record as a State senator. I remember one of Mr. 
Weed's arguments was that the Democrats were in 
power everywhere and could assess their office-holders, 
while the Republicans would have to rely for campaign 
funds upon voluntary contributions, which would come 
nowhere so freely as from Mr. Morgan and his friends. 
When the convention met Mr. Weed had won over a 
large majority of the delegates for his candidate. It 
was a triumph not only of his skill but of his magnetism, 
which were always successfully exerted upon a doubtful 
member. 

I was elected to the assembly, the popular branch of 
the New York Legislature, in 1861. I was nominated 
during an absence from the State, without being a candi- 
date or knowing of it until my return. Of course, I 
could expect nothing from my father, and my own earn- 
ings were not large, so I had to rely upon a personal 
canvass of a district which had been largely spoiled by 
rich candidates running against each other and spend- 
ing large amounts of money. I made a hot canvass, 
speaking every day, and with an investment of less than 
one hundred dollars for travel and other expenses I was 
triumphantly elected. 

By far the most interesting member of the legislature 
was the speaker, Henry J. Raymond. He was one of 
the most remarkable men I ever met. During the ses- 
sion I became intimate with him, and the better I knew 
him the more I became impressed with his genius, the 
variety of his attainments, the perfection of his equip- 
ment, and his ready command of all his powers and 
resources. Raymond was then editor of the New York 



IN PUBLIC LIFE 21 

Times and contributed a leading article every day. He 
was the best debater we had and the most convincing. 
I have seen him often, when some other member was in 
the chair of the committee of the whole, and we were 
discussing a critical question, take his seat on the floor 
and commence writing an editorial. As the debate pro- 
gressed, he would rise and participate. When he had 
made his point, which he always did with directness and 
lucidity, he would resume writing his editorial. The 
debate would usually end with Mr. Raymond carrying 
his point and also finishing his editorial, an example 
which seems to refute the statement of metaphysicians 
that two parts of the mind cannot work at the same 
time. 

Two years afterwards, when I was secretary of state, 
I passed much of my time at Saratoga, because it was 
so near Albany. Mr. Raymond was also there writing 
the "Life of Abraham Lincoln." I breakfasted with 
him frequently and found that he had written for an 
hour or more before breakfast. He said to me in ex- 
planation that if one would take an hour before break- 
fast every morning and concentrate his mind upon his 
subject, he would soon fill a library. 

Mr. Raymond had been as a young man a reporter in 
the United States Senate. He told me that, while at 
that time there was no system of shorthand or stenogra- 
phy, he had devised a crude one for himself, by which 
he could take down accurately any address of a delib- 
erate speaker. 

Daniel Webster, the most famous orator our country 
has ever produced, was very deliberate in his utter- 
ances. He soon discovered Raymond's ability, and for 
several years he always had Raymond with him, and 



22 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

once said to him: "Except for you, the world would 
have very few of my speeches. Your reports have pre- 
served them." 

Mr. Raymond told me this story of Mr. Webster's 
remarkable memory. Once he said to Mr. Webster: 
"You never use notes and apparently have made no 
preparation, yet you are the only speaker I report whose 
speeches are perfect in structure, language, and rhetoric. 
How is this possible?" Webster replied: "It is my 
memory. I can prepare a speech, revise and correct it 
in my memory, and then deliver the corrected speech 
exactly as finished." I have known most of the great 
orators of the world, but none had any approach to a 
faculty like this, though several could repeat after second 
reading the speech which they had prepared. 

In 1862 I was candidate for re-election to the assem- 
bly. Political conditions had so changed that they were 
almost reversed. The enthusiasm of the war which had 
carried the Republicans into power the year before had 
been succeeded by general unrest. Our armies had been 
defeated, and industrial and commercial depression was 
general. 

The leader of the Democratic party in the State was 
Dean Richmond. He was one of those original men of 
great brain-power, force, and character, knowledge of 
men, and executive ability, of which that period had a 
number. From the humblest beginning he had worked 
his way in politics to the leadership of his party, to the 
presidency of the greatest corporation in the State, the 
New York Central Railroad Company, and in his many 
and successful, adventures had accumulated a fortune. 
His foresight was almost a gift of prophecy, and his judg- 
ment was rarely wrong. He believed that the disasters 



IN PUBLIC LIFE 23 

in the field and the bad times at home could be charged 
up to the Lincoln administration and lead to a Demo- 
cratic victory. He also believed that there was only 
one man in the party whose leadership would surely 
win, and that man was Horatio Seymour. But Seymour 
had higher ambitions than the governorship of New 
York and was very reluctant to run. Nevertheless, he 
could not resist Richmond's insistence that he must sac- 
rifice himself, if necessary, to save the party. 

The Republicans nominated General James W. Wads- 
worth for governor. Wadsworth had enlisted at the be- 
ginning of the war and made a most brilliant record, 
both as a fighting soldier and administrator. The Re- 
publican party was sharply divided between radicals 
who insisted on immediate emancipation of the slaves, 
and conservatives who thought the time had not yet 
arrived for such a revolution. The radicals were led by 
Horace Greeley, and the conservatives by Thurlow Weed 
and Henry J. Raymond. 

Horatio Seymour made a brilliant canvass. He had 
no equal in the State in either party in charm of person- 
ality and attractive oratory. He united his party and 
brought to its ranks all the elements of unrest and 
dissatisfaction with conditions, military and financial. 
While General Wadsworth was an ideal candidate, he 
failed to get the cordial and united support of his party. 
He represented its progressive tendencies as expressed 
and believed by President Lincoln, and was hostile to 
reaction. Under these conditions Governor Seymour 
carried the State. 

The election had reversed the overwhelming Republi- 
can majority in the legislature of the year before by 
making the assembly a tie. I was re-elected, but by 



24 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

reduced majority. The assembly being a tie, it was 
several weeks before it could organize. I was the can- 
didate in the caucus of the Republican members for 
speaker, but after the nomination one of the members, 
named Bemus, threatened to bolt and vote for the 
Democratic candidate unless his candidate, Sherwood, 
was made the nominee. So many believed that Bemus 
would carry out his threat, which would give the organ- 
ization of the House to the Democrats by one majority, 
that I withdrew in favor of Sherwood. After voting 
hopelessly in a deadlock, day after day for a long period, 
a caucus of the Republican members was called, at 
which Sherwood withdrew, and on his motion I was 
nominated as the party candidate for speaker. 

During the night a Democratic member, T. C. Calli- 
cot, of Kings County, came to my bedroom and said: 
"My ambition in life is to be speaker of the assembly. 
Under the law the legislature cannot elect the United 
States senator unless each House has first made a nom- 
ination, then the Senate and the House can go into joint 
convention, and a majority of that convention elect a 
senator. You Republicans have a majority in the Sen- 
ate, so that if the House nominates, the legislature can 
go into joint convention and elect a Republican senator. 
As long as the House remains a tie this cannot be done. 
Now, what I propose is just this: Before we meet to- 
morrow morning, if you will call your members together 
and nominate me for speaker, the vote of your party and 
I voting for myself will elect me. Then I will agree to 
name General Dix, a Democrat, for United States sen- 
ator, and if your people will all vote with me for him he 
will be the assembly nominee. The Senate has already 
nominated Governor Morgan. So the next day the 



IN PUBLIC LIFE 25 

legislature can go into joint convention and, having a 
Republican majority, elect Governor Morgan United 
States senator." I told Mr. Callicot that I would pre- 
sent the matter to my party associates. 

In the early morning Saxton Smith and Colonel John 
Van Buren, two of the most eminent Democrats in the 
State and members of the legislature, came to me and 
said: "We know what Callicot has proposed. Now, if 
you will reject that proposition we will elect you speaker 
practically unanimously." 

This assured my election for the speakership. I had 
a great ambition to be on that roll of honor, and as I 
would have been the youngest man ever elected to the 
position, my youth added to the distinction. On the 
other hand, the government at Washington needed an 
experienced senator of its own party, like Edwin D. 
Morgan, who had been one of the ablest and most effi- 
cient of war governors, both in furnishing troops and 
helping the credit of the country. I finally decided to 
surrender the speakership for myself to gain the senator- 
ship for my party. I had difficulty in persuading my 
associates, but they finally agreed. Callicot was elected 
speaker and Edwin D. Morgan United States senator. 

The event was so important and excited so much in- 
terest, both in the State and in the country, that rep- 
resentative men came to Albany in great numbers. The 
rejoicing and enthusiasm were intense at having secured 
so unexpectedly a United States Senator for the support 
of Mr. Lincoln's administration. 

That night they all united in giving me a reception in 
the ballroom of the hotel. There was a flood of eulogis- 
tic and prophetic oratory. I was overwhelmed with 
every form of flattery and applause, for distinguished 



26 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

service to the party. By midnight I had been nomi- 
nated and elected Governor of the State, and an hour 
later I was already a United States senator. Before the 
morning hour the presidency of the United States was 
impatiently waiting for the time when I would be old 
enough to be eligible. All this was soon forgotten. It 
is a common experience of the instability of promises 
and hopes which come from gratified and happy enthu- 
siasts, and how soon they are dissipated like a dream ! I 
have seen many such instances, and from this early ex- 
perience deeply sympathize with the disillusionized hero. 

The Democrats of the assembly and also of the State 
were determined that Mr. Callicot should not enjoy the 
speakership. They started investigations in the House 
and movements in the courts to prevent him from tak- 
ing his seat. The result was that I became acting 
speaker and continued as such until Mr. Callicot had 
defeated his enemies and taken his place as speaker in 
the latter part of the session. 

I was also chairman of the committee of ways and 
means and the leader of the House. The budget of my 
committee was larger than usual on account of the ex- 
penses of the war. It was about seven million dollars. 
It created much more excitement and general discussion 
than does the present budget of one hundred and forty 
millions. The reason is the difference in conditions and 
public necessities of the State of New York in the winter 
of 1863 and now. It is also partly accounted for by the 
fact that the expenses of the State had then to be met 
by a real-estate tax which affected everybody, while now 
an income tax has been adopted which is capable of un- 
limited expansion and invites limitless extravagance be- 
cause of the comparatively few interested. 



IN PUBLIC LIFE 27 

Eighteen hundred and sixty-three was an eventful 
year; the early part was full of gloom and unrest. 
Horatio Seymour, as governor, violently antagonized 
President Lincoln and his policies. Seymour was patri- 
otic and very able, but he was so saturated with State 
rights and strict construction of the Constitution that 
it marred his judgment and clouded his usually clear 
vision. In the critical situation of the country Mr. 
Lincoln saw the necessity of support of the State of 
New York. The president said: "The governor has 
greater power just now for good than any other man 
in the country. He can wheel the Democratic party 
into line, put down the rebellion and preserve the govern- 
ment. Tell him from me that if he will render this ser- 
vice to his country, I shall cheerfully make way for him 
as my successor." To this message, sent through Thur- 
Iow Weed, Governor Seymour made no reply. He did 
not believe that the South could be defeated and the 
Union preserved. 

Later President Lincoln sent a personal letter to the 
governor. It was a very human epistle. The president 
wrote: "You and I are substantially strangers, and I 
write this that we may become better acquainted. In 
the performance of duty the co-operation of your State 
is needed and is indispensable. This alone is sufficient 
reason why I should wish to be on a good understanding 
with you. Please write me at least as long a letter as 
this, of course saying in it just what you think fit." 

Governor Seymour made no reply. He and the other 
Democratic leaders thought the president uncouth, un- 
lettered, and very weak. The phrase "please write me 
at least as long a letter as this" produced an impression 
upon the scholarly, cultured, cautious, and diplomatic 



28 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

Seymour which was most unfavorable to its author. 
Seymour acknowledged the receipt of the letter and 
promised to make a reply, but never did. 

Seymour's resentment was raised to fever heat when 
General Burnside, in May, 1863, arrested Clement L. 
Vallandigham. The enemies of the war and peace at 
any price people, and those who were discouraged, called 
mass meetings all over the country to protest this arrest 
as an outrage. A mass meeting was called in Albany 
on the 1 6th of May. Erastus Corning, one of the most 
eminent Democrats in the State, presided. 

I was in Albany at the time and learned this incident. 
One of Governor Seymour's intimate friends, his adviser 
and confidant in personal business affairs was Charles 
Cook, who had been comptroller of the State and a 
State senator. Cook was an active Republican, a very 
shrewd and able man. He called on the governor and 
tried to persuade him not to write a letter to the Val- 
landigham meeting, but if he felt he must say some- 
thing, attend the meeting and make a speech. Cook 
said: "Governor, the country is going to sustain ulti- 
mately the arrest of Vallandigham. It will be proved 
that he is a traitor to the government and a very dan- 
gerous man to be at large. Whatever is said at the 
meeting will seriously injure the political future of the 
authors. If you write a letter it will be on record, so I 
beg you, if you must participate, attend the meeting 
and make a speech. A letter cannot be denied; it can 
always be claimed that a speech has been misreported." 

The Governor wrote the letter, one of the most violent 
of his utterances, and it was used against him with 
fatal effect when he ran for governor, and also when a 
candidate for president. 



IN PUBLIC LIFE 



29 



On July nth the draft began in New York City. It 
had been denounced as unconstitutional by every shade 
of opposition to Mr. Lincoln's administration and to the 
prosecution of the war. The attempt to enforce it led 
to one of the most serious riots in the history of the 
city, and the rage of the rioters was against the officers 
of the law, the headquarters of the draft authorities, and 
principally against the negroes. Every negro who was 
caught was hung or burned, and the negro orphan asy- 
lum was destroyed by fire. The governor did his best 
to stop the rioting. He issued a proclamation declaring 
the city in a state of insurrection, and commanded obedi- 
ence to the law and the authorities. 

In this incident again the governor permitted his 
opposition to the war to lead him into political indis- 
cretion. He made a speech from the steps of the City 
Hall to the rioters. He began by addressing them as 
"My friends." The governor's object was to quiet the 
mob and send them to their homes. So instead of 
saying "fellow citizens" he used the fatal words "my 
friends." No two words were ever used against a pub- 
lic man with such fatal effect. Every newspaper op- 
posed to the governor and every orator would describe 
the horrors, murders, and destruction of property by 
the mob and then say: "These are the people whom 
Governor Seymour in his speech from the steps of the 
City Hall addressed as 'my friends.'" 

The Vallandigham letter and this single utterance did 
more harm to Governor Seymour's future ambitions than 
all his many eloquent speeches against Lincoln's ad- 
ministration and the conduct of the war. 

The political situation, which had been so desperate 
for the national administration, changed rapidly for the 



3 o CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

better with the victory at Gettysburg, which forced Gen- 
eral Lee out of Pennsylvania and back into Virginia, and 
also by General Grant's wonderful series of victories at 
Vicksburg and other places which liberated the Missis- 
sippi River. 

Under these favorable conditions the Republicans 
entered upon the canvass in the fall of 1863 to reverse, 
if possible, the Democratic victory the year before. The 
Republican State ticket was: 

Secretary of State Chauncey M. Depew. 

Comptroller Lucius Robinson. 

Canal Commissioner Benjamin F. Bruce. 

Treasurer George W. Schuyler. 

State Engineer William B. Taylor. 

Prison Inspector James K. Bates. 

Judge of the Court of Appeals Henry S. Selden. 

Attorney-General John Cochran. 

The canvass was one of the most interesting of politi- 
cal campaigns. The president was unusually active, and 
his series of letters were remarkable documents. He had 
the ear of the public; he commanded the front page of 
the press, and he defended his administration and its 
acts and replied to his enemies with skill, tact, and ex- 
treme moderation. 

Public opinion was peculiar. Military disasters and 
increasing taxation had made the position of the ad- 
ministration very critical, but the victories which came 
during the summer changed the situation. I have never 
known in any canvass any one incident which had 
greater effect than Sheridan's victory in the Shenan- 
doah Valley, and never an adventure which so captured 
the popular imagination as his ride from Washington to 
the front; his rallying the retreating and routed troops, 



IN PUBLIC LIFE 31 

reforming them and turning defeat into victory. The 
poem, "Sheridan's Ride," was recited in every audi- 
ence, from every platform, and from the stage in many 
theatres and created the wildest enthusiasm. 

My friend, Wayne MacVeagh, who was at Yale Col- 
lege with me, had succeeded as a radical leader in de- 
feating his brother-in-law, Don Cameron, and getting 
control for the first time in a generation against the 
Cameron dynasty of the Republican State organization 
of Pennsylvania. He had nominated a radical ticket, 
with Andrew G. Curtin as a candidate for governor. 

MacVeagh wrote to me, saying: "You are running at 
the head of the Republican ticket in New York. Your 
battle is to be won in Pennsylvania, and unless we suc- 
ceed you cannot. Come over and help us." 

I accepted the invitation and spent several most ex- 
citing and delightful weeks campaigning with Governor 
Curtin and his party. The meetings were phenomenal 
in the multitudes which attended and their interest in 
the speeches. I remember one dramatic occasion at the 
city of Reading. This was a Democratic stronghold; 
there was not a single Republican office-holder in the 
county. The only compensation for a Republican ac- 
cepting a nomination and conducting a canvass, with its 
large expenses and certain defeat, was that for the rest 
of his life he was given as an evidence of honor the title 
of the office for which he ran, and so the county was full 
of "judges, Mr. District Attorneys, State Senators, and 
Congressmen" who had never been elected. 

We arrived at Reading after midday. The leading 
street, a very broad one, was also on certain days the 
market-place. A friend of the governor, who had a 
handsome house on this street, had the whole party for 



32 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

luncheon. The luncheon was an elaborate banquet. 
Governor Curtin came to me and said: "You go out 
and entertain the crowd, which is getting very impa- 
tient, and in about twenty minutes I will send some one 
to relieve you." It was raining in torrents; the crowd 
shouted to me encouragingly: "Never mind the rain; we 
are used to that, but we never heard you." As I would 
try to stop they would shout: "Go ahead!" In the 
meantime the banquet had turned into a festive occa- 
sion, with toasts and speeches. I had been speaking 
over two hours before the governor and his party ap- 
peared. They had been dining, and the Eighteenth 
Amendment had not been dreamed of. I was drenched 
to the skin, but waited until the governor had delivered 
his twenty-minute speech; then, without stopping for 
the other orators, I went over to the house, stripped, 
dried myself, and went to bed. 

Utterly exhausted with successive days and nights of 
this experience, I did not wake until about eight o'clock 
in the evening. Then I wandered out in the street, 
found the crowd still there, and the famous John W. 
Forney making a speech. They told me that he had 
been speaking for four hours, delivering an historical 
address, but had only reached the administration of 
General Jackson. I never knew how long he kept at it, 
but there was a tradition with our party that he was 
still speaking when the train left the next morning. 

Governor Curtin was an ideal party leader and can- 
didate. He was one of the handsomest men of his time, 
six feet four inches in height, perfectly proportioned and a 
superb figure. He never spoke over twenty minutes, 
but it was the talk in the familiar way of an expert to 
his neighbors. He had a cordial and captivating manner, 
which speedily made him the idol of the crowd and a 



IN PUBLIC LIFE 33 

most agreeable companion in social circles. When he 
was minister to Russia, the Czar, who was of the same 
height and build, was at once attracted to him, and he 
took a first place among the diplomats in influence. 

When I returned to New York to enter upon my own 
canvass, the State and national committees imposed 
upon me a heavy burden. Speakers of State reputation 
were few, while the people were clamoring for meetings. 
Fortunately I had learned how to protect my voice. In 
the course of the campaign every one who spoke with 
me lost his voice and had to return home for treatment. 
When I was a student at Yale the professor in elocution 
was an eccentric old gentleman named North. The 
boys paid little attention to him and were disposed to 
ridicule his peculiarities. He saw that I was specially 
anxious to learn and said: "The principal thing about 
oratory is to use your diaphragm instead of your throat. " 
His lesson on that subject has been of infinite benefit to 
me all my life. 

The programme laid out called upon me to speak on 
an average between six and seven hours a day. The 
speeches were from ten to thirty minutes at different 
railway stations, and wound up with at least two meet- 
ings at some important towns in the evening, and each 
meeting demanded about an hour. These meetings were 
so arranged that they covered the whole State. It took 
about four weeks, but the result of the campaign, due 
to the efforts of the orators and other favorable con- 
ditions, ended in the reversal of the Democratic victory 
of the year before, a Republican majority of thirty 
thousand and the control of the legislature. 

In 1864 the political conditions were very unfavor- 
able for the Republican party, owing to the bitter hos- 



34 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

tility between the conservative and radical elements. 
Led by such distinguished men as Thurlow Weed and 
Henry J. Raymond, on the one side, and Horace Greeley, 
with an exceedingly capable body of earnest lieutenants 
on the other, the question of success or defeat depended 
upon the harmonizing of the two factions. 

Without having been recognized by the politicians or 
press of the State, Reuben E. Fenton, who had been for 
ten years a congressman from the Chatauqua district, 
had developed in Congress remarkable ability as an 
organizer. He had succeeded in making Galusha A. 
Grow speaker of the House of Representatives, and had 
become a power in that body. He had behind him 
the earnest friendship and support of the New York 
delegation in the House of Representatives and had 
not incurred the enmity of either faction in his own 
State. His nomination saved the party in that cam- 
paign. 

As an illustration how dangerous was the situation, 
though the soldiers' vote in the field was over one hun- 
dred thousand and almost unanimously for the Republi- 
can ticket, the presidential and gubernatorial candi- 
dates received less than eight thousand majority, the 
governor leading the president. 

The re-election of Mr. Lincoln and the election of 
Reuben E. Fenton over Governor Seymour made our 
State solidly Republican, and Governor Fenton became 
at once both chief executive and party leader. He had 
every quality for political leadership, was a shrewd judge 
of character, and rarely made mistakes in the selection 
of his lieutenants. He was a master of all current politi- 
cal questions and in close touch with public opinion. 
My official relations with him as secretary of state be- 



IN PUBLIC LIFE 35 

came at once intimate and gratifying. It required in 
after-years all the masterful genius of Roscoe Conkling 
and the control of federal patronage granted to him by 
President Grant to break Fenton's hold upon his party. 

Governor Fenton was blessed with a daughter of won- 
derful executive ability, singular charm, and knowledge 
of public affairs. She made the Executive Mansion in 
Albany one of the most charming and hospitable homes 
in the State. Its influence radiated everywhere, cap- 
tured visitors, legislators, and judges, and was a power- 
ful factor in the growing popularity and influence of the 
governor. 

One of the most interesting of political gatherings was 
the Democratic convention, which met at Tredwell 
Hall in Albany in the fall of 1864, to select a successor to 
Governor Seymour. The governor had declared pub- 
licly that he was not a candidate, and that under no 
conditions would he accept a renomination. He said 
that his health was seriously impaired, and his private 
affairs had been neglected so long by his absorption in 
public duties that they were in an embarrassing condi- 
tion and needed attention. 

The leaders of the convention met in Dean Richmond's 
office and selected a candidate for governor and a full 
State ticket. When the convention met the next day I 
was invited to be present as a spectator. It was sup- 
posed by everybody that the proceedings would be very 
formal and brief, as the candidates and the platform had 
been agreed upon. The day was intensely hot, and 
most of the delegates discarded their coats, vests, and 
collars, especially those from New York City. 

When the time came for the nomination, the platform 
was taken by one of the most plausible and smooth 



36 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

talkers I ever heard. He delivered a eulogy upon Gov- 
ernor Seymour and described in glowing terms the debt 
the party owed him for his wonderful public services, 
and the deep regret all must have that he felt it neces- 
sary to retire to private life. He continued by saying 
that he acquiesced in that decision, but felt it was due 
to a great patriot and the benefactor of the party that 
he should be tendered a renomination. Of course, they 
all knew it would be merely a compliment, as the gov- 
ernor's position had been emphatically stated by him- 
self. So he moved that the governor be nominated by 
acclamation and a committee appointed to wait upon 
him at the Executive Mansion and ascertain his wishes. 

When Mr. Richmond was informed of this action, he 
said it was all right but unnecessary, because the situa- 
tion was too serious to indulge in compliments. 

In an hour the delegation returned, and the chairman, 
who was the same gentleman who made the speech and 
the motion, stepped to the front of the platform to 
report. He said that the governor was very grateful for 
the confidence reposed in him by the convention, and 
especially for its approval of his official actions as gov- 
ernor of the State and the representative of his party at 
the national convention, that in his long and intense 
application to public duties he had impaired his health 
and greatly embarrassed his private affairs, but, but, he 
continued with emphasis . . . He never got any fur- 
ther. Senator Shafer, of Albany, who was unfriendly to 
the governor, jumped up and shouted: "Damn him, he 
has accepted !" 

The convention, when finally brought to order, re- 
affirmed its complimentary nomination as a real one, 
with great enthusiasm and wild acclaim. 



IN PUBLIC LIFE 37 

When the result was reported to Mr. Richmond at his 
office, I was told by one who was present that Rich- 
mond's picturesque vocabulary of indignation and de- 
nunciation was enriched to such a degree as to astonish 
and shock even the hardened Democrats who listened to 
the outburst. 

A committee was appointed to wait on the governor 
and request him to appear before the convention. In a 
little while there stepped upon the platform the finest 
figure in the State or country. Horatio Seymour was 
not only a handsome man, with a highly intellectual and 
expressive face of mobile features, which added to the 
effect of his oratory, but he never appeared unless per- 
fectly dressed and in the costume which was then uni- 
versally regarded as the statesman's apparel. His pat- 
ent-leather boots, his Prince Albert suit, his. perfectly 
correct collar and tie were evidently new, and this was 
their first appearance. From head to foot he looked 
the aristocrat. In a few minutes he became the idol of 
that wild and overheated throng. His speech was a 
model of tact, diplomacy, and eloquence, with just that 
measure of restraint which increased the enthusiasm of 
the hearers. The convention, which had gathered for 
another purpose, another candidate, and a new policy, 
hailed with delight its old and splendid leader. 

Commodore Vanderbilt had a great admiration for 
Dean Richmond. The commodore disliked boasters and 
braggarts intensely. Those who wished to gain his 
favor made the mistake, as a rule, of boasting about 
what they had done, and were generally met by the 
remark: "That amounts to nothing." Mr. Tillinghast, 
a western New York man and a friend of Richmond, 
was in the commodore's office one day, soon after Rich- 



38 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

mond died. Tillinghast was general superintendent of 
the New York Central and had been a sufferer from 
being stepped on by the commodore when he was laud- 
ing his own achievements and so took the opposite line 
of extreme moderation. The commodore asked Tilling- 
hast, after praising Mr. Richmond very highly, "How 
much did he leave?" "Oh," said Tillinghast, "his 
estate is a great disappointment, and compared with 
what it was thought to be it is very little." "I am sur- 
prised," remarked the commodore, "but how much?" 
"Oh, between five or six millions," Tillinghast answered. 
For the first time in his life the commodore was thrown 
off his guard and said: "Tillinghast, if five or six millions 
of dollars is a disappointment, what do you expect in 
western New York?" At that time there were few 
men who were worth that amount of money. 

Governor Seymour made a thorough canvass of the 
State, and I was appointed by our State committee to 
follow him. It was a singular experience to speak and 
reply to the candidate the day after his address. The 
local committee meets you with a very complete report 
of his speech. The trouble is that, except you are under 
great restraint, the urgency of the local committee and 
the inevitable temptations of the reply under such condi- 
tions, when your adversary is not present, will lead you 
to expressions and personalities which you deeply regret. 

When the canvass was over and the governor was 
beaten, I feared that the pleasant relations which had 
existed between us were broken. But he was a thorough 
sportsman. He sent for and received me with the great- 
est cordiality, and invited me to spend a week-end with 
him at his home in Utica. There he was the most de- 
lightful of hosts and very interesting as a gentleman 



IN PUBLIC LIFE 39 

farmer. In the costume of a veteran agriculturist and 
in the farm wagon he drove me out mornings to his 
farm, which was so located that it could command a 
fine view of the Mohawk Valley. After the inspection 
of the stock, the crops, and buildings, the governor 
would spend the day discoursing eloquently and most 
optimistically upon the prosperity possible for the 
farmer. To his mind then the food of the future was 
to be cheese. There was more food value in cheese than 
in any known edible article, animal or vegetable. It 
could sustain life more agreeably and do more for lon- 
gevity and health. 

No one could have imagined, who did not know the 
governor and was privileged to listen to his seemingly 
most practical and highly imaginative discourse, that 
the speaker was one of the ablest party managers, 
shrewdest of politicians, and most eloquent advocates in 
the country, whose whole time and mind apparently 
were absorbed in the success of his party and the fruition 
of his own ambitions. 

As we were returning home he said to me: "You have 
risen higher than any young man in the country of your 
age. You have a talent and taste for public life, but 
let me advise you to drop it and devote yourself to your 
profession. Public life is full of disappointments, has an 
unusual share of ingratitude, and its compensations are 
not equal to its failures. The country is full of men who 
have made brilliant careers in the public service and 
then been suddenly dropped and forgotten. The num- 
ber of such men who have climbed the hill up State 
Street to the capitol in Albany, with the applause of 
admiring crowds whom none now can recall, would make 
a great army." 



4 o CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

He continued by telling this story: "In the war of 
1 812 the governor and the legislature decided to bring 
from Canada to Albany the remains of a hero whose 
deeds had excited the admiration of the whole State. 
There was an imposing and continuous procession, with 
local celebrations all along the route, from the frontier 
to the capital. The ceremonies in Albany were attended 
by the governor, State officers, legislature, and judges, 
and the remains were buried in the capitol park. No 
monument was erected. The incident is entirely forgot- 
ten, no one remembers who the hero was, what were his 
deeds, nor the spot where he rests." 

Years afterwards, when the State was building a new 
capitol and I was one of the commissioners, in excavating 
the grounds a skeleton was found. It was undoubtedly 
the forgotten hero of Governor Seymour's story. 

When my term was about expiring with the year 1865 
I decided to leave public life and resume the practice of 
my profession. I was at the crossroads of a political or 
a professional career. So, while there was a general 
assent to my renomination, I emphatically stated the 
conclusion at which I had arrived. 

The Republican convention nominated for my suc- 
cessor as secretary of state General Francis C. Barlow, a 
very brilliant soldier in the Civil War. The Democratic 
convention adopted a patriotic platform of advanced 
and progressive views, and nominated at the head of 
their ticket for secretary of state General Henry W. 
Slocum. General Slocum had been a corps commander 
in General Sherman's army, and came out of the war 
among the first in reputation and achievement of the 
great commanders. It was a master stroke on the part 



IN PUBLIC LIFE 41 

of the Democratic leaders to place him at the head of 
their ticket. He was the greatest soldier of our State 
and very popular with the people. In addition to being 
a great commander, he had a charming personality, 
which fitted him for success in public life. 

The Democrats also on the same ticket nominated for 
attorney-general John Van Buren. He was a son of 
President Van Buren and a man of genius. Although he 
was very erratic, his ability was so great that when 
serious he captured not only the attention but the judg- 
ment of people. He was an eloquent speaker and had a 
faculty of entrancing the crowd with his wit and of char- 
acterization of his opponent which was fatal. I have 
seen crowds, when he was elaborately explaining details 
necessary for the vindication of his position, or that of 
his party which did not interest them, to remain with 
close attention, hoping for what was certain to come, 
namely, one of those sallies of wit, which made a speech 
of Van Buren a memorable thing to have listened to. 

Van Buren was noted for a reckless disregard of the 
confidences of private conversation. Once I was with 
him on the train for several hours, and in the intimacy 
which exists among political opponents who know and 
trust each other we exchanged views in regard to public 
measures and especially public men. I was very indis- 
creet in talking with him in my criticism of the leaders 
of my own party, and he equally frank and delightful in 
flaying alive the leaders of his party, especially Gov- 
ernor Seymour. 

A few days afterwards he made a speech in which he 
detailed what I had said, causing me the greatest embar- 
rassment and trouble. In retaliation I wrote a letter to 
the public, stating what he had said about Governor 



42 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

Seymour. The Democratic ticket was beaten by fifteen 
thousand in a very heavy vote, and Van Buren always 
charged it to the resentment of Governor Seymour and 
his friends. 

In our country public life is a most uncertain career 
for a young man. Its duties and activities remove him 
from his profession or business and impose habits of 
work and thought which unfit him for ordinary pursuits, 
especially if he remains long in public service. With a 
change of administration or of party popularity, he may 
be at any time dropped and left hopelessly stranded. 
On the other hand, if his party is in power he has in it a 
position of influence and popularity. He has a host of 
friends, with many people dependent upon him for their 
own places, and it is no easy thing for him to retire. 

When I had decided not to remain any longer in pub- 
lic life and return home, the convention of my old dis- 
trict, which I had represented in the legislature, renomi- 
nated me for the old position with such earnestness and 
affection that it was very difficult to refuse and to per- 
suade them that it was absolutely necessary for me to 
resume actively my profession. 

Our village of Peekskill, which has since grown into 
the largest village in the State, with many manufacturing 
and other interests, was then comparatively small. A 
large number of people gathered at the post-office every 
morning. On one occasion when I arrived I found them 
studying a large envelope addressed to me, which the 
postmaster had passed around. It was a letter from 
William H. Seward, secretary of state, announcing that 
the president had appointed me United States minister 
to Japan, and that the appointment had been sent to 



IN PUBLIC LIFE 43 

the Senate and confirmed by that body, and directing 
that I appear at the earliest possible moment at his 
office to receive instructions and go to my post. A few- 
days afterwards I received a beautiful letter from Henry 
J. Raymond, then in Congress, urging my acceptance. 

On arriving in Washington I went to see Mr. Seward, 
who said to me: "I have special reasons for securing your 
appointment from the president. He is rewarding 
friends of his by putting them in diplomatic positions 
for which they are wholly unfit. I regard the opening 
of Japan to commerce and our relations to that new and 
promising country so important, that I asked the privi- 
lege to select one whom I thought fitted for the position. 
Your youth, familiarity with public life, and ability seem 
to me ideal for this position, and I have no doubt you 
will accept." 

I stated to him how necessary it was that after long 
neglect in public life of my private affairs I should 
return to my profession, if I was to make a career, but 
Mr. Seward brushed that aside by reciting his own suc- 
cess, notwithstanding his long service in our State and 
in Washington. " However," he continued, "I feared 
that this might be your attitude, so I have made an 
appointment for you to see Mr. Burlingame, who has 
been our minister to China, and is now here at the head 
of a mission from China to the different nations of the 
world." 

Anson Burlingame's career had been most picturesque 
and had attracted the attention of not only the United 
States but of Europe. As a member of the House of 
Representatives he had accepted the challenge of a "fire- 
eater," who had sent it under the general view that no 
Northern man would fight. As minister to China he 



44 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

had so gained the confidence of the Chinese Government 
that he persuaded them to open diplomatic relations 
with the Western world, and at their request he had 
resigned his position from the United States and ac- 
cepted the place of ambassador to the great powers, and 
was at the head of a large delegation, composed of the 
most important, influential, and representative man- 
darins of the old empire. 

When I sent up my card to his room at the hotel his 
answer was: "Come up immediately." He was shaving 
and had on the minimum of clothes permissible to receive 
a visitor. He was expecting me and started in at once 
with an eloquent description of the attractions and im- 
portance of the mission to Japan. With the shaving 
brush in one hand and the razor in the other he delivered 
an oration. In order to emphasize it and have time to 
think and enforce a new idea, he would apply the brush 
and the razor vigorously, then pause and resume. I 
cannot remember his exact words, but have a keen rec- 
ollection of the general trend of his argument. 

He said: "I am surprised that a young man like you, 
unmarried and with no social obligations, should hesi- 
tate for a moment to accept this most important and 
attractive position. If you think these people are bar- 
barians, I can assure you that they had a civilization and 
a highly developed literature when our forefathers were 
painted savages. The western nations of Europe, in 
order to secure advantages in this newly opened country 
for commerce, have sent their ablest representatives. 
You will meet there with the diplomats of all the great 
western nations, and your intimacy with them will be a 
university of the largest opportunity. You will come in 
contact with the best minds of Europe. You can make 



IN PUBLIC LIFE 45 

a great reputation in the keen rivalry of this situation 
by securing the best of the trade of Japan for your own 
country to its western coasts over the waters of the 
Pacific. You will be welcomed by the Japanese Govern- 
ment, and the minister of foreign affairs will assign you 
a palace to live in, with a garden attached so perfectly 
appointed and kept as to have been the envy of Shen- 
stone. You will be attended by hundreds of beautiful 
and accomplished Japanese maidens." 

When I repeated to a large body of waiting office- 
seekers who had assembled in my room what Mr. Bur- 
Iingame had said, they all became applicants for the 
place. 

There is no more striking evidence of the wonderful 
advance in every way of the Japanese Empire and its 
people than the conditions existing at that time and 
now. Then it took six months to reach Japan and a 
year for the round trip. Of course, there was no tele- 
graphic or cable communication, and so it required a 
year for a message to be sent and answered. The Jap- 
anese army at that time was mostly clad in armor and 
its navy were junks. 

In fifty years Japan has become one of the most ad- 
vanced nations of the world. It has adopted and assimi- 
lated all that is best of Western civilization, and acquired 
in half a century what required Europe one thousand 
years to achieve. Its army is unexcelled in equipment 
and discipline, and its navy and mercantile marine are 
advancing rapidly to a foremost place. It demonstrated 
its prowess in the war with Russia, and its diplomacy 
and power in the recent war. 

Japan has installed popular education, with common 
schools, academies, and universities, much on the Ameri- 



46 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

can plan. It has adopted and installed every modern 
appliance developed by electricity — telegraph, cable, 
telephone, etc. 

While I was greatly tempted to reverse my decision 
and go, my mother, who was in delicate health, felt that 
an absence so long and at such distance would be fatal, 
and so on her account I declined. 

As I look back over the fifty years I can see plainly 
that four years, and probably eight, in that mission 
would have severed me entirely from all professional and 
business opportunities at home, and I might have of 
necessity become a place holder and a place seeker, with 
all its adventures and disappointments. 

If I had seriously wanted an office and gone in pursuit 
of one, my pathway would have had the usual difficul- 
ties, but fickle fortune seemed determined to defeat my 
return to private life by tempting offers. The collector- 
ship of the port of New York was vacant. It was a posi- 
tion of great political power because of its patronage. 
There being no civil service, the appointments were suffi- 
ciently numerous and important to largely control the 
party in the State of New York, and its political influ- 
ence reached into other commonwealths. It was an 
office whose fees were enormous, and the emoluments 
far larger than those of any position in the country. 

The party leaders had begun to doubt President John- 
son, and they wanted in the collectorship a man in 
whom they had entire confidence, and so the governor 
and State officers, who were all Republicans, the Repub- 
lican members of the legislature, the State committee, 
the two United States senators, and the Republican 
delegation of New York in the House of Representa- 



IN PUBLIC LIFE 47 

tives unanimously requested the president to appoint 
me. 

President Johnson said to me: "No such recommenda- 
tion and indorsement has ever been presented to me 
before." However, the breach between him and the 
party was widening, and he could not come to a decision. 

One day he suddenly sent for Senator Morgan, Henry 
J. Raymond, Thurlow Weed, and the secretary of the 
treasury for a consultation. He said to them: "I have 
decided to appoint Mr. Depew." The appointment was 
made out by the secretary of the treasury, and the 
president instructed him to send it to the Senate the 
next morning. There was great rejoicing among the 
Republicans, as this seemed to indicate a favorable turn 
in the president's mind. Days and weeks passed, how- 
ever, and when the veto of the Civil Rights Bill was 
overridden in the Senate and, with the help of the votes 
of the senators from New York, the breach between the 
president and his party became irreconcilable, the move- 
ment for his impeachment began, which ended in the 
most sensational and perilous trial in our political his- 
tory. 

On my way home to New York, after the vote of the 
New York senators had ended my hope for appoint- 
ment, I had as a fellow traveller my friend, Professor 
Davies, from West Point. He was a brother of that 
eminent jurist, Henry E. Davies, a great lawyer and 
chief justice of our New York State Court of Appeals. 
Professor Davies said to me: "I think I must tell you 
why your nomination for collector was not sent to the 
Senate. I was in Washington to persuade the president, 
with whom I am quite intimate, to make another ap- 
pointment. I was calling on Secretary Hugh McCuIIoch 



48 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

and his family in the evening of the day when the con- 
ference decided to appoint you. Secretary McCuIIoch 
said to me: 'The contest over the collectorship of the 
port of New York is settled, and Chauncey Depew's 
name will be sent to the Senate to-morrow morning.' I 
was at the White House," continued the professor, "the 
next morning before breakfast. The president received 
me at once because I said my mission was urgent and 
personal. I told him what the secretary of the treasury 
had told me and said: 'You are making a fatal mistake. 
You are going to break with your party and to have a 
party of your own. The collectorship of the port of New 
York is the key to your success. Depew is very capable 
and a partisan of his party. If you have any doubt, I 
beg of you to withhold the appointment until the ques- 
tion comes up in the Senate of sustaining or overriding 
of the veto of the Civil Rights Bill. The votes of the 
two New York senators will decide whether they are 
your friends or not/ The president thought that was 
reasonable, and you know the result." 

There was at least one satisfaction in the professor's 
amazingly frank revelation: it removed all doubt why I 
had lost a great office and, for my age and circumstances, 
a large fortune. 

President Andrew Johnson differed radically from any 
President of the United States whom it has been my 
good fortune to know. This refers to all from and in- 
cluding Mr. Lincoln to Mr. Harding. A great deal must 
be forgiven and a great deal taken by way of explana- 
tion when we consider his early environment and oppor- 
tunities. 

In the interviews I had with him he impressed me as 
a man of vigorous mentality, of obstinate wilfulness, and 



IN PUBLIC LIFE 



49 



overwhelming confidence in his own judgment and the 
courage of his convictions. His weakness was alcohol- 
ism. He made a fearful exhibition of himself at the 
time of his inauguration and during the presidency, and 
especially during his famous trip "around the circle" he 
was in a bad way. 

He was of humble origin and, in fact, very poor. It 
is said of him that he could neither read nor write until 
his wife taught him. He made a great career both as a 
member of the House of Representatives and a senator, 
and was of unquestionable influence in each branch. 
With reckless disregard for his life, he kept east Tennes- 
see in the Union during the Civil War. 

General Grant told me a story of his own experience 
with him. Johnson, he said, had always been treated 
with such contempt and ignored socially by the mem- 
bers of the old families and slave aristocracy of the 
South that his resentment against them was vindictive, 
and so after the surrender at Appomattox he was con- 
stantly proclaiming "Treason is odious and must be 
punished." He also wanted and, in fact, insisted upon 
ignoring Grant's parole to the Confederate officers, in 
order that they might be tried for treason. On this 
question of maintaining his parole and his military honor 
General Grant was inflexible, and said he would appeal 
not only to Congress but to the country. 

One day a delegation, consisting of the most eminent, 
politically, socially, and in family descent, of the South- 
ern leaders, went to the White House. They said: "Mr. 
President, we have never recognized you, as you belong 
to an entirely different class from ourselves, but it is the 
rule of all countries and in all ages that supreme power 
vested in the individual raises him, no matter what his 



50 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

origin, to supreme leadership. You are now President 
of the United States, and by virtue of your office our 
leader, and we recognize you as such." Then followed 
attention from these people whom he admired and 
envied, as well as hated, of hospitality and deference, of 
which they were past masters. It captivated him and 
changed his whole attitude towards them. 

He sent for General Grant and said to him: "The war 
is over and there should be forgiveness and reconcilia- 
tion. I propose to call upon all of the States recently in 
rebellion to send to Washington their United States sen- 
ators and members of the House, the same as they did 
before the war. If the present Congress will not admit 
them, a Congress can be formed of these Southern sen- 
ators and members of the House and of such Northern 
senators and representatives as will believe that I am 
right and acting under the Constitution. As President 
of the United States, I will recognize that Congress and 
communicate with them as such. As general of the 
army I want your support.'* General Grant replied: 
"That will create civil war, because the North will un- 
doubtedly recognize the Congress as it now exists, and 
that Congress will assert itself in every way possible." 
"In that case," said the president, "I want the army to 
support the constitutional Congress which I am recog- 
nizing." General Grant said: "On the contrary, so far 
as my authority goes, the army will support the Congress 
as it is now and disperse the other." President Johnson 
then ordered General Grant to Mexico on a mission, and 
as he had no power to send a general of the army out of 
the United States, Grant refused to go. 

Shortly afterwards Grant received a very confidential 
communication from General Sherman, stating that he 



IN PUBLIC LIFE 51 

had been ordered to Washington to take command of 
the army, and wanted to know what it meant. General 
Grant explained the situation, whereupon General Sher- 
man announced to the president that he would take 
exactly the same position as General Grant had. The 
president then dropped the whole subject. 



Ill 

ABRAHAM LINCOLN 

The secretaryship of the State of New York is a very 
delightful office. Its varied duties are agreeable, and 
the incumbent is brought in close contact with the 
State administration, the legislature, and the people. 

We had in the secretary of state's office at the time I 
held the office, about fifty-eight years ago, very interesting 
archives. The office had been the repository of these 
documents since the organization of the government. 
Many years afterwards they were removed to the State 
Library. Among these documents were ten volumes of 
autograph letters from General Washington to Governor 
Clinton and others, covering the campaign on the Hud- 
son in the effort by the enemy to capture West Point, 
the treason of Arnold, and nearly the whole of the Revo- 
lutionary War. In the course of years before these 
papers were removed to the State Library, a large part 
of them disappeared. It was not the fault of the admin- 
istration succeeding me, but it was because the legisla- 
ture, in its effort to economize, refused to make appro- 
priation for the proper care of these invaluable historic 
papers. Most of Washington's letters were written en- 
tirely in his own hand, and one wonders at the phe- 
nomenal industry which enabled him to do so much 
writing while continuously and laboriously engaged in 
active campaigning. 

In view of the approaching presidential election, the 

52 



ABRAHAM LINCOLN 53 

legislature passed a law, which was signed by the gov- 
ernor, providing machinery for the soldiers' vote. New 
York had at that time between three and four hundred 
thousand soldiers in the field, who were scattered in 
companies, regiments, brigades, and divisions all over 
the South. This law made it the duty of the secretary 
of state to provide ballots, to see that they reached every 
unit of a company, to gather the votes and transmit 
them to the home of each soldier. The State govern- 
ment had no machinery by which this work could be 
done. I applied to the express companies, but all refused 
on the ground that they were not equipped. I then sent 
for old John Butterfield, who was the founder of the 
express business but had retired and was living on his 
farm near Utica. He was intensely patriotic and ashamed 
of the lack of enterprise shown by the express compa- 
nies. He said to me: "If they cannot do this work they 
ought to retire." He at once organized what was practi- 
cally an express company, taking in all those in exist- 
ence and adding many new features for the sole purpose 
of distributing the ballots and gathering the soldiers' 
votes. It was a gigantic task and successfully executed 
by this patriotic old gentleman. 

Of course, the first thing was to find out where the 
New York troops were, and for that purpose I went to 
Washington, remaining there for several months before 
the War Department would give me the information. 
The secretary of war was Edwin M. Stanton. It was 
perhaps fortunate that the secretary of war should not 
only possess extraordinary executive ability, but be also 
practically devoid of human weakness; that he should 
be a rigid disciplinarian and administer justice without 
mercy. It was thought at the time that these qualities 



54 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

were necessary to counteract, as far as possible, the ten- 
der-heartedness of President Lincoln. If the boy con- 
demned to be shot, or his mother or father, could reach 
the president in time, he was never executed. The mili- 
tary authorities thought that this was a mistaken charity 
and weakened discipline. I was at a dinner after the 
war with a number of generals who had been in com- 
mand of armies. The question was asked one of the 
most famous of these generals: "How did you carry out 
the sentences of your courts martial and escape Lincoln's 
pardons?" The grim old warrior answered: "I shot 
them first." 

I took my weary way every day to the War Depart- 
ment, but could get no results. The interviews were 
brief and disagreeable and the secretary of war very 
brusque. The time was getting short. I said to the 
secretary: "If the ballots are to be distributed in time, 
I must have information at once." He very angrily 
refused and said: "New York troops are in every army, 
all over the enemy's territory. To state their location 
would be to give invaluable information to the enemy. 
How do I know if that information would be so safe- 
guarded as not to get out?" 

As I was walking down the long corridor, which was 
full of hurrying officers and soldiers returning from the 
field or departing for it, I met Elihu B. Washburne, who 
was a congressman from Illinois and an intimate friend 
of the president. He stopped me and said: 

"Hello, Mr. Secretary, you seem very much troubled. 
Can I help you?" I told him my story. 

'What are you going to do?" he asked. I answered: 

'To protect myself I must report to the people of New 

York that the provision for the soldiers' voting cannot 



ABRAHAM LINCOLN 55 

be carried out because the administration refuses to give 
information where the New York soldiers are located." 

"Why," said Mr. Washburne, "that would beat Mr. 
Lincoln. You don't know him. While he is a great 
statesman, he is also the keenest of politicians alive. If 
it could be done in no other way, the president would 
take a carpet-bag and go around and collect those votes 
himself. You remain here until you hear from me. I 
will go at once and see the president." 

In about an hour a staff officer stepped up to me and 
asked: "Are you the secretary of state of New York?" 
I answered "Yes." "The secretary of war wishes to see 
you at once," he said. I found the secretary most cor- 
dial and charming. 

"Mr. Secretary, what do you desire?" he asked. I 
stated the case as I had many times before, and he gave 
a peremptory order to one of his staff that I should re- 
ceive the documents in time for me to leave Washington 
on the midnight train. 

The magical transformation was the result of a per- 
sonal visit of President Lincoln to the secretary of war. 
Mr. Lincoln carried the State of New York by a ma- 
jority of only 6,749, and it was a soldiers' vote that gave 
him the Empire State. 

The compensations of my long delay in Washington 
trying to move the War Department were the oppor- 
tunity it gave me to see Mr. Lincoln, to meet the mem- 
bers of the Cabinet, to become intimate with the New 
York delegation in Congress, and to hear the wonderful 
adventures and stories so numerous in Washington. 

The White House of that time had no executive offices 
as now, and the machinery for executive business was 
very primitive. The east half of the second story had 



56 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

one large reception-room, in which the president could 
always be found, and a few rooms adjoining for his sec- 
retaries and clerks. The president had very little pro- 
tection or seclusion. In the reception-room, which was 
always crowded at certain hours, could be found mem- 
bers of Congress, office-seekers, and an anxious company 
of fathers and mothers seeking pardons for their sons 
condemned for military offenses, or asking permission to 
go to the front, where a soldier boy was wounded or sick. 
Every one wanted something and wanted it very bad. 
The patient president, wearied as he was with cares of 
state, with the situation on several hostile fronts, with 
the exigencies in Congress and jealousies in his Cabinet, 
patiently and sympathetically listened to these tales of 
want and woe. My position was unique. I was the 
only one in Washington who personally did not want 
anything, my mission being purely in the public interest. 

I was a devoted follower of Mr. Seward, the secretary 
of state, and through the intimacies with officers in his 
department I learned from day to day the troubles in 
the Cabinet, so graphically described in the diary of the 
secretary of the navy Gideon Welles. 

The antagonism between Mr. Seward and Mr. Chase, 
the secretary of the treasury, though rarely breaking out 
in the open, was nevertheless acute. Mr. Seward was 
devoted to the president and made every possible effort 
to secure his renomination and election. Mr. Chase was 
doing his best to prevent Mr. Lincoln's renomination 
and secure it for himself. 

No president ever had a Cabinet of which the mem- 
bers were so independent, had so large individual follow- 
ings, and were so inharmonious. The president's sole 
ambition was to secure the ablest men in the country for 



ABRAHAM LINCOLN 57 

the departments which he assigned to them without 
regard to their loyalty to himself. One of Mr. Seward's 
secretaries would frequently report to me the acts of dis- 
loyalty or personal hostility on the part of Mr. Chase 
with the lament: "The old man — meaning Lincoln — 
knows all about it and will not do a thing." 

I had a long and memorable interview with the presi- 
dent. As I stepped from the crowd in his reception- 
room, he said to me: "What do you want?" I an- 
swered: "Nothing, Mr. President, I only came to pay 
my respects and bid you good-by, as I am leaving Wash- 
ington." "It is such a luxury," he then remarked, "to 
find a man who does not want anything. I wish you 
would wait until I get rid of this crowd." 

When we were alone he threw himself wearily on a 
lounge and was evidently greatly exhausted. Then he 
indulged, rocking backward and forward, in a reminis- 
cent review of different crises in his administration, and 
how he had met them. In nearly every instance he had 
carried his point, and either captured or beaten his ad- 
versaries by a story so apt, so on all fours, and such 
complete answers that the controversy was over. I 
remember eleven of these stories, each of which was a 
victory. 

In regard to this story-telling, he said: "I am accused 
of telling a great many stories. They say that it lowers 
the dignity of the presidential office, but I have found 
that plain people (repeating with emphasis plain people), 
take them as you find them, are more easily influenced 
by a broad and humorous illustration than in any other 
way, and what the hypercritical few may think, I don't 
care. 

In speaking Mr. Lincoln had a peculiar cadence in his 



58 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

voice, caused by laying emphasis upon the key-word of 
the sentence. In answer to the question how he knew 
so many anecdotes, he answered: "I never invented a 
story, but I have a good memory and, I think, tell one 
tolerably well. My early life was passed among pioneers 
who had the courage and enterprise to break away from 
civilization and settle in the wilderness. The things 
which happened to these original people and among 
themselves in their primitive conditions were far more 
dramatic than anything invented by the professional 
story-tellers. For many years I travelled the circuit as 
a lawyer, and usually there was only one hotel in the 
county towns where court was held. The judge, the 
grand and petit juries, the lawyers, the clients, and 
witnesses would pass the night telling exciting or amus- 
ing occurrences, and these were of infinite variety and 
interest." He was always eager for a new story to add 
to his magazine of ammunition and weapons. 

One night when there was a reception at the executive 
mansion Rufus C. Andrews, surveyor of the port of New 
York, and I went there together. Andrews was a good 
lawyer and had been a correspondent in New York of 
Mr. Lincoln, while he was active at the bar in Illinois. 
He was a confidential adviser of the president on New 
York matters and frequently at the executive mansion. 
As the procession moved past the president he stopped 
Andrews and, leaning over, spoke very confidentially to 
him. The conversation delayed the procession for some 
time. When Andrews and I returned to the hotel, our 
rooms were crowded with newspaper men and politicians 
wanting to know what the confidential conversation was 
about. Andrews made a great mystery of it and so did 
the press. He explained to me when we were alone that 



ABRAHAM LINCOLN 59 

during his visit to the president the night before he told 
the president a new story. The president delayed him 
at the reception, saying: "Andrews, I forgot the point 
of that story you told me last night; repeat it now." 

While Mr. Lincoln had the most logical of minds and 
his letters and speeches on political controversies were 
the most convincing of any statesman of his period, he 
rarely would enter into a long discussion in conversa- 
tion; he either would end the argument by an apt story 
or illustration enforcing his ideas. 

John Ganson, of Buffalo, was the leader of the bar in 
western New York. Though elected to the House of 
Representatives as a Democrat, he supported the war 
measures of the administration. He was a gentleman 
of the old school, of great dignity, and always immacu- 
lately dressed. He was totally bald and his face also de- 
void of hair. It was a gloomy period of the war and the 
reports from the front very discouraging. Congressman 
Ganson felt it his duty to see the president about the 
state of the country. He made a formal call and said 
to Mr. Lincoln: "Though I am a Democrat, I imperil 
my political future by supporting your war measures. I 
can understand that secrecy may be necessary in mili- 
tary operations, but I think I am entitled to know the 
exact conditions, good or bad, at the front." 

Mr. Lincoln looked at him earnestly for a minute and 
then said: "Ganson, how clean you shave !" That ended 
the interview. 

The first national convention I ever attended was 
held in Baltimore in 1864, when Mr. Lincoln was re- 
nominated. I have since been four times a delegate- 
at-Iarge, representing the whole State, and many times 
a delegate representing a congressional district. Judge 



60 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

W. H. Robertson, of Westchester County, and I went to 
the convention together. We thought we would go by 
sea, but our ship had a collision, and we were rescued by 
a pilot boat. Returning to New York, we decided to 
accept the security of the railroad. Judge Robertson 
was one of the shrewdest and ablest of the Republican 
politicians in the State of New York. He had been 
repeatedly elected county judge, State senator, and 
member of Congress, and always overcoming a hostile 
Democratic majority. 

We went to Washington to see Mr. Seward first, had 
an interview with him at his office, and dined with him 
in the evening. To dine with Secretary Seward was an 
event which no one, and especially a young politician, 
ever forgot. He was the most charming of hosts and 
his conversation a liberal education. 

There was no division as to the renomination of Mr. 
Lincoln, but it was generally conceded that the vice- 
president should be a war Democrat. The candidacy of 
Daniel S. Dickinson, of New York, had been so ably 
managed that he was far and away the favorite. He 
had been all his life, up to the breaking out of the Civil 
War, one of the most pronounced extreme and radical 
Democrats in the State of New York. Mr. Seward took 
Judge Robertson and me into his confidence. He was 
hostile to the nomination of Mr. Dickinson, and said 
that the situation demanded the nomination for vice- 
president of a representative from the border States, 
whose loyalty had been demonstrated during the war. 
He eulogized Andrew Johnson, of Tennessee, and gave a 
glowing description of the courage and patriotism with 
which Johnson, at the risk of his life, had advocated the 
cause of the Union and kept his State partially loyal. 



ABRAHAM LINCOLN 61 

He said to us: "You can quote me to the delegates, and 
they will believe I express the opinion of the president. 
While the president wishes to take no part in the nomi- 
nation for vice-president, yet he favors Mr. Johnson." 

When we arrived at the convention this interview with 
Mr. Seward made us a centre of absorbing interest and 
at once changed the current of opinion, which before 
that had been almost unanimously for Mr. Dickinson. 
It was finally left to the New York delegation. 

The meeting of the delegates from New York was a 
stormy one and lasted until nearly morning. Mr. Dick- 
inson had many warm friends, especially among those of 
previous democratic affiliation, and the State pride to 
have a vice-president was in his favor. Upon the final 
vote Andrew Johnson had one majority. The decision 
of New York was accepted by the convention and he 
was nominated for vice-president. 

This is an instance of which I have met many in my 
life, where the course of history was changed on a very 
narrow margin. Political histories and the newspapers' 
discussions of the time assigned the success of Mr. John- 
son to the efforts of several well-known delegates, but 
really it was largely if not wholly due to the message of 
Mr. Seward, which was carried by Judge Robertson and 
myself to the delegates. 

The year of 1864 was full of changes of popular senti- 
ment and surprises. The North had become very tired 
of the war. The people wanted peace, and peace at 
almost any price. Jacob Thompson and Clement C. 
Clay, ex-United States senators from the South, appeared 
at Niagara Falls, on the Canadian side, and either they 
or their friends gave out that they were there to treat 
for peace. In reference to them Mr. Lincoln said to 



62 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

me: "This effort was to inflame the peace sentiment of 
the North, to embarrass the administration, and to de- 
moralize the army, and in a way it was successful. Mr. 
Greeley was hammering at me to take action for peace, 
and said that unless I met these men every drop of blood 
that was shed and every dollar that was spent I would 
be responsible for, that it would be a blot upon my con- 
science and soul. I wrote a letter to Mr. Greeley and 
said to him that those two ex-United States senators 
were Whigs and old friends of his, personally and politi- 
cally, and that I desired him to go to Niagara Falls and 
find out confidentially what their credentials were and 
let me know." 

The president stated that instead of Mr. Greeley doing 
it that way, he went there as an ambassador, and with 
an array of reporters established himself on the American 
side and opened negotiations with these two alleged 
envoys across the bridge. Continuing, Mr. Lincoln said : 
"I had reason to believe from confidential information 
which I had received from a man I trusted and who had 
interviewed Jefferson Davis, the president of the Confed- 
eracy, that these envoys were without authority, because 
President Davis had said to this friend of mine and of 
his that he would treat on no terms whatever but on 
absolute recognition of the independence of the Southern 
Confederacy. The attention of the whole country and 
of the army centred on these negotiations at Niagara 
Falls, and to stop the harm they were doing I recalled 
Mr. Greeley and issued my proclamation 'To Whom It 
May Concern,' in which I stated if there was anybody 
or any delegation at Niagara Falls, or anywhere else, 
authorized to represent the Southern Confederacy and 
to treat for peace, they had free conduct and safety to 



ABRAHAM LINCOLN 63 

Washington and return. Of course, they never came, 
because their mission was a subterfuge. But they made 
Greeley believe in them, and the result is that he is still 
attacking me for needlessly prolonging the war for pur- 
poses of my own." 

At a Cabinet meeting one of the members said to Mr. 
Lincoln: "Mr. President, why don't you write a letter 
to the public stating these facts, and that will end Mr. 
Greeley's attacks?" The president answered: "Mr. 
Greeley owns a daily newspaper, a very widely circu- 
lated and influential one. I have no newspaper. The 
press of the country would print my letter, and so would 
the New York Tribune. In a little while the public 
would forget all about it, and then Mr. Greeley would 
begin to prove from my own letter that he was right, 
and I, of course, would be helpless to reply." He 
brought the Cabinet around to unanimous agreement 
with him by telling one of his characteristic stories. 

This affair and the delays in the prosecution of the 
war had created a sentiment early in 1864 that the re- 
election of Mr. Lincoln was impossible. The leaders of 
both the conservative and the radical elements in the 
Republican party, Mr. Weed, on the one hand, and Mr. 
Greeley, on the other, frankly told the president that he 
could not be re-elected, and his intimate friend, Con- 
gressman Elihu B. Washburne, after a canvass of the 
country, gave him the same information. 

Then came the spectacular victory of Farragut at 
Mobile and the triumphant march of Sherman through 
Georgia, and the sentiment of the country entirely 
changed. There was an active movement on foot in the 
interest of the secretary of the treasury, Chase, and fos- 
tered by him, to hold an independent convention before 



64 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

the regular Republican convention as a protest against 
the renomination of Mr. Lincoln. It was supported by 
some of the most eminent and powerful members of the 
party, who threw into the effort their means and influ- 
ence. After these victories the effort was abandoned 
and Mr. Lincoln was nominated by acclamation. I 
recall as one of the excitements and pleasures of a life- 
time the enthusiastic confidence of that convention when 
they acclaimed Lincoln their nominee. 

Governor Seymour, who was the idol of his party, 
headed the New York delegation to the national Demo- 
cratic convention to nominate the president, and his 
journey to that convention was a triumphal march. 
There is no doubt that at the time he had with him not 
only the enthusiastic support of his own party but the 
confidence of the advocates of peace. His own nomina- 
tion and election seemed inevitable. However, in defer- 
ence to the war sentiment, General McCIellan was nomi- 
nated instead, and here occurred one of those little 
things which so often in our country have turned the 
tide. 

The platform committee, and the convention after- 
wards, permitted to go into the platform a phrase pro- 
posed by Clement C. Vallandigham, of Ohio, the phrase 
being, ''The war is a failure." Soon after the adjourn- 
ment of the convention, to the victories of Farragut and 
Sherman was added the spectacular campaign and vic- 
tory of Sheridan in the Valley of Shenandoah. The cam- 
paign at once took on a new phase. It was the opportu- 
nity for the orator. 

It is difficult now to recreate the scenes of that cam- 
paign. The people had been greatly disheartened. 
Every family was in bereavement, with a son lost and 



ABRAHAM LINCOLN 65 

others still in the service. Taxes were onerous and eco- 
nomic and business conditions very bad. Then came 
this reaction, which seemed to promise an early victory 
for the Union. The orator naturally picked up the 
phrase, "The war is a failure"; then he pictured Far- 
ragut tied to the shrouds of his flag-ship; then he por- 
trayed Grant's victories in the Mississippi campaign, 
Hooker's "battle above the clouds," the advance of the 
Army of Cumberland; then he enthusiastically described 
Sheridan leaving the War Department hearing of the 
battle in Shenandoah Valley, speeding on and rallying 
his defeated troops, reforming and leading them to vic- 
tory, and finished with reciting some of the stirring war 
poems. 

Mr. Lincoln's election under the conditions and cir- 
cumstances was probably more due to that unfortunate 
phrase in the Democratic platform than to any other 
cause. 

The tragedy of the assassination of Mr. Lincoln was 
followed by the most pathetic incident of American life 
— his funeral. After the ceremony at Washington the 
funeral train stopped at Philadelphia, New York, and 
Albany. In each of these cities was an opportunity for 
the people to view the remains. 

I had charge in my official capacity as secretary of 
state of the train after it left Albany. It was late in 
the evening when we started, and the train was running 
all night through central and western New York. Its 
schedule was well known along the route. Wherever the 
highway crossed the railway track the whole population 
of the neighborhood was assembled on the highway and 
in the fields. Huge bonfires lighted up the scene. Pas- 
tors of the local churches of all denominations had united 



66 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

in leading their congregations for greeting and farewell 
for their beloved president. As we would reach a cross- 
ing there sometimes would be hundreds and at others 
thousands of men, women, and children on their knees, 
praying and singing hymns. 

This continuous service of prayer and song and suppli- 
cation lasted over the three hundred miles between 
Albany and Buffalo, from midnight until dawn. 



IV 
GENERAL GRANT 

The fairies who distribute the prizes are practical 
jokers. I have known thousands who sought office, 
some for its distinction, some for its emoluments, and 
some for both; thousands who wanted promotion from 
places they held, and other thousands who wanted to 
regain positions they had lost, all of whom failed in their 
search. 

I probably would have been in one of those classes if I 
had been seeking an office. I was determined, however, 
upon a career in railroad work until, if possible, I had 
reached its highest rewards. During that period I was 
offered about a dozen political appointments, most of 
them of great moment and very tempting, all of which I 
declined. 

Near the close of President Grant's administration 
George Jones, at that time the proprietor and publisher 
of the New York Times, asked me to come and see him. 
Mr. Jones, in his association with the brilliant editor, 
Henry J. Raymond, had been a progressive and staying 
power of the financial side of this great journal. He was 
of Welsh descent, a very hardheaded, practical, and wise 
business man. He also had very definite views on poli- 
tics and parties, and several times nearly wrecked his 
paper by obstinately pursuing a course which was tem- 
porarily unpopular with its readers and subscribers. I 
was on excellent terms with Mr. Jones and admired him. 
The New York Times became under his management one 

67 



68 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

of the severest critics of General Grant's administration 
and of the president himself. 

I went to his house and during the conversation Jones 
said to me: "I was very much surprised to receive a let- 
ter from the president asking me to come and see him 
at the White House. Of course I went, anticipating a 
disagreeable interview, but it turned out absolutely the 
reverse. The president was most cordial, and his frank- 
ness most attractive. After a long and full discussion, 
the president said the Times had been his most unspar- 
ing critic, but he was forced to agree with much the 
Times said; that he had sent for me to make a request; 
that he had come to the presidency without any prep- 
aration whatever for its duties or for civic responsibili- 
ties; that he was compelled to take the best advice he 
could find and surround himself with men, many of 
whom he had never met before, and they were his guides 
and teachers; that he, however, assumed the entire 
responsibility for everything he had done. He knew per- 
fectly well, in the retrospect and with the larger experi- 
ence he had gained, that he had made many mistakes. 
'And now, Mr. Jones,' he continued, 'I have sent for you 
as the most powerful as well as, I think, the fairest of 
my critics, to ask that you will say in your final sum- 
ming up of my eight years that, however many my 
errors or mistakes, they were faults of judgment, and 
that I acted conscientiously and in any way I thought 
was right and best.' 

'I told the president I would be delighted to take 
that view in the Times. Then the president said that 
he would like to show his appreciation in some way 
which would be gratifying to me. I told him that I 
wanted nothing for myself, nor did any of my friends, in 



GENERAL GRANT 69 

the line of patronage. Then he said he wanted my 
assistance because he was looking for the best man for 
United States district attorney for the district of New 
York. With my large acquaintance he thought that I 
should be able to tell him whom among the lawyers 
would be best to appoint. After a little consideration I 
recommended you. 

"The president then said: 'Mr. Depew supported 
Greeley, and though he is back in the party and doing 
good service in the campaigns, I do not like those men. 
Nevertheless, you can tender him the office and ask for 
his immediate acceptance.'" 

I told Mr. Jones what my determination was in regard 
to a career, and while appreciating most highly both his 
own friendship and the compliment from the president, 
I must decline. 

General Grant's mistakes in his presidency arose from 
his possession of one of the greatest of virtues, and that 
is loyalty to one's friends. He had unlimited confidence 
in them and could not see, or be made to see, nor listen 
to any of their defects. He was himself of such trans- 
parent honesty and truthfulness that he gauged and 
judged others by his own standard. Scandals among a 
few of the officials of his administration were entirely 
due to this great quality. 

His intimacy among his party advisers fell among the 
most extreme of organization men and political machin- 
ists. When, under the advice of Senator Conkling, he 
appointed Thomas Murphy collector of the port of New 
York, it was charged in the press that the collector 
removed employees at the rate of several hundred per 
day and filled their places with loyal supporters of the 
organization. This policy, which was a direct reversal 



yo CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

of the ideas of civil-service reform which were then rap- 
idly gaining strength, incurred the active hostility of 
civil-service reformers, of whom George William Curtis 
was the most conspicuous. 

When General Grant came to reside in New York, 
after his tour around the world, he was overwhelmed with 
social attentions. I met him at dinners several times a 
week and was the victim of a characteristic coldness of 
manner which he had towards many people. 

One St. Patrick's Day, while in Washington, I received 
an earnest telegraphic request from Judge John T. Brady 
and his brother-in-law, Judge Charles P. Daly, president 
of the Society of the Friendly Sons of St. Patrick, saying: 
'The Sons are to have their greatest celebration because 
they are to be honored by the presence of General Grant, 
who will also speak, and it is imperative that you come 
and help us welcome him." 

I arrived at the dinner late and passed in front of the 
dai's to my seat at the other end, while General Grant 
was speaking. He was not easy on his feet at that time, 
though afterwards he became very felicitous in public 
speaking. He paused a moment until I was seated and 
then said: "If Chauncey Depew stood in my shoes, and 
I in his, I would be a much happier man." 

I immediately threw away the speech I had prepared 
during the six hours' trip from Washington, and pro- 
ceeded to make a speech on "Who can stand now or in 
the future in the shoes of General Grant?" I had 
plenty of time before my turn came to elaborate this 
idea, gradually eliminating contemporary celebrities until 
in the future the outstanding figure representing the 
period would be the hero of our Civil War and the resto- 
ration of the Union. 



GENERAL GRANT 71 

The enthusiasm of the audience, as the speech went 
on, surpassed anything I ever saw. They rushed over 
tables and tried to carry the general around the room. 
When the enthusiasm had subsided he came to me and 
with much feeling said: "Thank you for that speech; it 
is the greatest and most eloquent that I ever heard." 
He insisted upon my standing beside him when he re- 
ceived the families of the members, and took me home 
in his carriage. 

From that time until his death he was most cordial, 
and at many dinners would insist upon my being 
assigned to a chair next to him. 

Among strangers and in general conversation General 
Grant was the most reticent of men, but among those 
whom he knew a most entertaining conversationalist. 
He went over a wide field on such occasions and was 
interesting on all subjects, and especially instructive on 
military campaigns and commanders. He gave me as 
his judgment that among all the military geniuses of the 
world the greatest was General Philip Sheridan, and 
that Sheridan's grasp of a situation had no parallel in 
any great general of whom he knew. 

I was with General Grant at his home the day before 
he went from New York to Mount McGregor, near Sara- 
toga, where he died. I learned of the trip and went im- 
mediately to see him, and was met by his son, General 
Frederick D. Grant. I said to him: "I learn that your 
father is going to Mount McGregor to-morrow, and I 
have come to tender him a special train." 

After all the necessary arrangements had been made 
he asked me to go in and see the general. Before doing 
this I asked: "How is he?" "Well," he answered, "he 
is dying, but it is of infinite relief to him to see people 



72 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

whom he knows and likes, and I know he wants to see 
you. Our effort is to keep his mind off from himself 
and interest him with anything which we think will be 
of relief to him, and if you have any new incidents do 
not fail to tell him." 

When I entered the room the general was busy writing 
his "Memoirs." He greeted me very cordially, said he 
was glad to see me, and then remarked: "I see by the 
papers that you have been recently up at Hartford de- 
livering a lecture. Tell me about it." 

In reply I told him about a very interesting journey 
there; the lecture and supper afterwards, with Mark 
Twain as the presiding genius, concerning all of which 
he asked questions, wanting more particulars, and the 
whole story seemed to interest him. What seemed to 
specially please him was the incident when I arrived at 
the hotel, after the supper given me at the close of my 
lecture. It was about three o'clock in the morning, and 
I went immediately to bed, leaving a call for the early 
train to New York. At five o'clock there was violent 
rapping on the door and, upon opening it, an Irish waiter 
stood there with a tray on which were a bottle of cham- 
pagne and a goblet of ice. 

"You have made a mistake," I said to the waiter. 

"No, sir," he answered, "I could not make a mistake 
about you." 

"Who sent this?" I asked. 

"The committee, sir, with positive instructions that 
you should have it at five o'clock in the morning," he 
answered. 

"Well, my friend, I said, is it the habit of the good 
people of Hartford, when they have decided to go to 
New York on an early train to drink a bottle of cham- 
pagne at five o'clock in the morning?" 



GENERAL GRANT 73 

He answered: "Most of them do, sir." 

(Nobody at that time had dreamed of the Eighteenth 
Amendment and the Volstead law.) 

With a smile General Grant then said: "Well, there 
are some places in Connecticut where that could not be 
done, as local option prevails and the towns have gone 
dry. For instance, my friend, Senator Nye, of Nevada, 
spoke through Connecticut in my interest in the last 
campaign. Nye was a free liver, though not a dissipated 
man, and, as you know, a very excellent speaker. He 
told me that when he arrived at one of the principal 
manufacturing towns he was entertained by the lead- 
ing manufacturer at his big house and in magnificent 
style. The dinner was everything that could be de- 
sired, except that the only fluid was ice-water. After a 
long speech Nye, on returning to the house, had a recep- 
tion, and the supper was still dry, except plenty of ice- 
water. 

"Nye, completely exhausted, went to bed but could 
not sleep, nor could he find any stimulants. So, about 
six o'clock in the morning he dressed and wandered down 
to the dining-room. The head of the house came in 
and, seeing him, exclaimed: 'Why, senator, you are up 
early.' Nye replied: 'Yes, you know, out in Nevada we 
have a great deal of malaria, and I could not sleep.' 
'Well,' said the host, 'this is a temperance town. We 
find it an excellent thing for the working people, and 
especially for the young men, but we have some malaria 
here, also, and for that I have a private remedy.' 
Whereupon he went to a closet and pulled out a bottle of 
brandy. 

"After his host had left, Nye continued there in a 
refreshed and more enjoyable spirit. Soon his hostess 



74 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

came in and, much surprised, said: 'Why, senator, you 
are up early.' 'Yes,' he said, 'out in Nevada we have 
a great deal of malaria, and while I am on these speak- 
ing tours I have sharp attacks and cannot sleep. I had 
one last night.' 

"'Well,' she remarked, 'this is a temperance town, 
and it is a good thing for the working people and the 
young men, but I have a touch of malaria now and then 
myself.' Then she went to the tea-caddy and pulled 
out a bottle of brandy. The senator by this time was 
in perfect harmony with himself and the whole world. 

"When the boys came in (sons of the entertainer) they 
said: 'Senator, we hear that you are an expert on live 
stock, horses, cattle, etc. Won't you come out in the 
barn so we can show you some we regard as very fine 
specimens?' The boys took him out to the barn, shut 
the door, locked it, and whispered: 'Senator, we have 
no live stock, but we have a bottle here in the hay mow 
which we think will do you good.' And the senator 
wound up his narrative by saying: 'The wettest place 
that I know of is a dry town in Connecticut.'" 

The next day General Grant went to Mount Mc- 
Gregor and, as we all know, a few days afterwards he 
lost his voice completely. 



V 
ROSCOE CONKLING 

For a number of years, instead of taking my usual 
vacation in travel or at some resort, I spent a few weeks 
in the fall in the political canvass as a speaker. In the 
canvass of 1868 I was associated with Senator Roscoe 
Conkling, who desired an assistant, as the mass meet- 
ings usually wanted at least two and probably three 
hours of speaking, and he limited himself to an hour. 
General Grant was at the height of his popularity and 
the audiences were enormous. As we had to speak 
every day and sometimes several times a day, Mr. Conk- 
ling notified the committees that he would not speak 
out of doors, and that they must in all cases provide a 
hall. 

When we arrived at Lockport, N. Y., the chairman 
of the committee, Burt Van Horn, who was the congress- 
man from the district, told the senator that at least 
twenty thousand people from the town, and others com- 
ing from the country on excursion trains, had filled the 
Fair Grounds. Conkling became very angry and told 
the congressman that he knew perfectly well the condi- 
tions under which he came to Lockport, and that he 
would not speak at the Fair Grounds. A compromise 
was finally effected by which the senator was to appear 
upon the platform, the audience be informed that he 
would speak in the Opera House, and I was to be left 
to take care of the crowd. The departure of the senator 

75 



76 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

from the grounds was very dramatic. He was enthu- 
siastically applauded and a band preceded his carriage. 

For some reason I never had such a success as in 
addressing that audience. Commencing with a story 
which was new and effective, I continued for two hours 
without apparently losing an auditor. 

Upon my return to the hotel I found the senator very 
indignant. He said that he had gone to the Opera 
House with the committee; that, of course, no meeting 
had been advertised there, but a band had been placed 
on the balcony to play, as if it were a dime museum 
attraction inside; that a few farmers' wives had straggled 
in to have an opportunity to partake from their baskets 
their luncheons, and that he had left the Opera House 
and returned to the hotel. The committee coming in 
and narrating what had occurred at the Fair Grounds, 
did not help his imperious temper. The committee 
begged for a large meeting, which was to be held in the 
evening, but Conkling refused and ordered me to do the 
same, and we left on the first train. The cordial rela- 
tions which had existed up to that time were somehow 
severed and he became very hostile. 

General Grant, as president, of course, never had had 
experience or opportunity to know anything of practical 
politics. It was said that prior to his election he had 
never voted but once, and that was before the war, 
when he voted the Democratic ticket for James Bu- 
chanan. 

All the senators, representatives, and public men who 
began to press around him, seeking the appointment to 
office of their friends, were unknown to him personally. 
He decided rapidly whom among them he could trust, 
and once having arrived at that conclusion, his decision 



ROSCOE CONKLING 77 

was irrevocable. He would stand by a friend, without 
regard to its effect upon himself, to the last ditch. 

Of course, each of the two United States senators, 
Conkling and Fenton, wanted his exclusive favor. It is 
impossible to conceive of two men so totally different in 
every characteristic. Grant liked Conkling as much as 
he disliked Fenton. The result was that he transferred 
the federal patronage of the State to Senator Conkling. 

Conkling was a born leader, very autocratic and dic- 
tatorial. He immediately began to remove Fenton offi- 
cials and to replace them with members of his own organ- 
ization. As there was no civil service at that time and 
public officers were necessarily active politicians, Senator 
Conkling in a few years destroyed the organization which 
Fenton had built up as governor, and became master of 
the Republican party in the State. 

The test came at the State convention at Saratoga. 
Senator Conkling at that time had become hostile to 
me, why I do not know, nor could his friends, who were 
most of them mine also, find out. He directed that I 
must not be elected a delegate to the convention. The 
collector of the port of New York, in order to make that 
decree effective, filled my district in Westchester County 
with appointees from the Custom House. 

Patronage, when its control is subject to a popular 
vote, is a boomerang. The appointment of a citizen in 
a town arouses the anger of many others who think they 
are more deserving. I appealed to the farmers with the 
simple question whether old Westchester should be con- 
trolled by federal authority in a purely State matter of 
their own. The result of the appeal was overwhelming, 
and when the district convention met, the Custom 
House did not have a single delegate. 



78 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

The leader of the Custom House crowd came to me 
and said: "This is a matter of bread-and-butter and liv- 
ing with us. It is nothing to you. These delegates are 
against us and for you at the convention. Now, we 
have devised a plan to save our lives. It is that the 
three delegates elected shall all be friends of yours. You 
shall apparently be defeated. A resolution will be 
passed that if either delegate fails to attend or resigns, 
the other two may fill the vacancy. One of these will 
resign when the convention meets and you will be sub- 
stituted in his place. In the meantime we will send 
out through the Associated Press that you have been 
defeated." I did not have the heart to see these poor 
fellows dismissed from their employment, and I assented 
to the proposition. 

When we arrived at the convention Governor Cornell, 
then State chairman, called it to order. I arose to make 
a motion, when he announced: "You, sir, are not a 
member of this convention." My credentials, however, 
under the arrangement made in Westchester, convinced 
him that he was misinformed. The Conkling side 
selected for their chairman Andrew D. White, and the 
other side selected me. Upon careful canvass of the 
votes we had a clear majority. 

There were several delegations which were controlled 
by federal office-holders. It is at this point that patron- 
age becomes overwhelmingly effective. Several of those 
office-holders were shown telegrams from Washington, 
which meant their removal unless they did as directed 
by Senator Conkling. When the convention met the 
next day, the office-holders kept their heads on their 
shoulders, and my dear and valued old friend, Andrew 
D. White, was elected chairman of the convention. 



ROSCOE CONKLING 79 

I asked the leader of the federal crowd from West- 
chester how he explained my getting into the conven- 
tion. "Oh," he said, "that was easy. Our people 
gained so many delegates by offers of patronage and 
threats of removal that when I told them you had 
bought my delegates away from me, they believed it 
without question, and we are all safe in our places in the 
Custom House." My success was entirely due to the 
farmers' indignation at federal dictation, and the cam- 
paign did not cost me a dollar. 

Roscoe Conkling was created by nature for a great 
career. That he missed it was entirely his own fault. 
Physically he was the handsomest man of his time. His 
mental equipment nearly approached genius. He was 
industrious to a degree. His oratorical gifts were of the 
highest order, and he was a debater of rare power and 
resources. But his intolerable egotism deprived him of 
vision necessary for supreme leadership. With all his 
oratorical power and his talent in debate, he made little 
impression upon the country and none upon posterity. 
His position in the Senate was a masterful one, and on 
the platform most attractive, but none of his speeches 
appear in the schoolbooks or in the collections of great 
orations. The reason was that his wonderful gifts were 
wholly devoted to partisan discussions and local issues. 

His friends regarded his philippic against George W. 
Curtis at the Republican State convention at Rochester 
as the high-water mark of his oratory. I sat in the seat 
next to Mr. Curtis when Conkling delivered his famous 
attack. His admirers thought this the best speech he 
ever made, and it certainly was a fine effort, emphasized 
by oratory of a high order, and it was received by them 
with the wildest enthusiasm and applause. 



80 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

The assault upon Mr. Curtis was exceedingly bitter, 
the denunciation very severe, and every resource of sar- 
casm, of which Mr. Conkling was past master, was poured 
upon the victim. His bitterness was caused by Mr. 
Curtis's free criticism of him on various occasions. The 
speech lasted two hours, and it was curious to note its 
effect upon Mr. Curtis. Under the rules which the con- 
vention had adopted, he could not reply, so he had to 
sit and take it. The only feeling or evidence of being 
hurt by his punishment was in exclamations at different 
points made by his assailant. They were: "Remark- 
able!" "Extraordinary!" "What an exhibition!" "Bad 
temper!" "Very bad temper!" 

In the long controversy between them Mr. Curtis had 
the advantages which the journalist always possesses. 
The orator has one opportunity on the platform and the 
publication the next day in the press. The editor — and 
Mr. Curtis was at that time editor of Harper s Weekly — 
can return every Saturday and have an exclusive hear- 
ing by an audience limited only by the circulation of his 
newspaper and the quotations from it by journalistic 
friends. 

The speech illustrated Conkling's methods of prepara- 
tion. I used to hear from the senator's friends very fre- 
quently that he had added another phrase to his char- 
acterization of Curtis. While he was a ready debater, 
yet for an effort of this kind he would sometimes devote 
a year to going frequently over the ground, and in each 
repetition produce new epigrams, quotable phrases, and 
characterizations. 

There used to be an employee of the State committee 
named Lawrence. He was a man of a good deal of 
receptive intelligence and worshipped the senator. Mr. 



ROSCOE CONKLING 81 

Conkling discovered this quality and used Lawrence as 
a target or listening-post. I have often had Lawrence 
come to my office and say: "I had a great night. The 
senator talked to me or made speeches to me until nearly 
morning." He told me that he had heard every word 
of the Curtis philippic many times. 

Lawrence told me of another instance of Conkling's 
preparation for a great effort. When he was preparing 
the speech, which was to bring his friends who had been 
disappointed at the convention to the support of General 
Garfield, he summoned Lawrence for clerical work at his 
home. Lawrence said that the senator would write or 
dictate, and then correct until he was satisfied with the 
effort, and that this took considerable time. When it 
was completed he would take long walks into the coun- 
try, and in these walks recite the whole or part of his 
speech until he was perfect master of it. 

This speech took four hours in delivery in New York, 
and he held the audience throughout this long period. 
John Reed, one of the editors of the New York Times, 
told me that he sat on the stage near Conkling and had 
in his hands the proofs which had been set up in advance 
and which filled ten columns of his paper. He said that 
the senator neither omitted nor interpolated a word 
from the beginning to the end. He would frequently 
refer apparently to notes on his cuffs, or little memo- 
randa, not that he needed them, but it was the orator's 
always successful effort to create impression that his 
speech is extemporaneous, and the audience much prefer 
a speech which they think is such. 

Senator Conkling held an important position in a criti- 
cal period of our country's history. If his great powers 
had been devoted in the largest way to the national con- 



82 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

structive problems of the time, he would have been the 
leader of the dominant party and president of the United 
States. Instead, he became the leader of a faction in 
his own State only, and by the merciless use of federal 
patronage absolutely controlled for twelve years the 
action of the State organization. 

All the young men who appeared in the legislature or 
in county offices who displayed talent for leadership, 
independence, and ambition were set aside. The result 
was remarkable. While prior to his time there were 
many men in public life in the State with national repu- 
tation and influence, this process of elimination drove 
young men from politics into the professions or business, 
and at the close of Senator Conkling's career there was 
hardly an active member of the Republican party in 
New York of national reputation, unless he had secured 
it before Mr. Conkling became the autocrat of New York 
politics. The political machine in the Republican party 
in his Congressional district early in his career became 
jealous of his growing popularity and influence, both at 
home and in Congress. By machine methods they de- 
feated him and thought they had retired him perma- 
nently from public life. 

When I was elected secretary of state I received a note 
from Mr. Conkling, asking if I would meet him. I an- 
swered: "Yes, immediately, and at Albany." He came 
there with Ward Hunt, afterwards one of the associate 
justices of the Supreme Court of the United States. He 
delivered an intense attack upon machine methods and 
machine politics, and said they would end in the elimina- 
tion of all independent thought, in the crushing of all 
ambition in promising young men, and ultimate infinite 
damage to the State and nation. "You," he said, "are 



ROSCOE CONKLING 83 

a very young man for your present position, but you will 
soon be marked for destruction." 

Then he stated what he wanted, saying: "I was de- 
feated by the machine in the last election. They can 
defeat me now only by using one man of great talent 
and popularity in my district. I want you to make that 
man your deputy secretary of state. It is the best office 
in your gift, and he will be entirely satisfied." 

I answered him: "I have already received from the 
chiefs of the State organization designations for every 
place in my office, and especially for that one, but the 
appointment is yours and you may announce it at once." 

Mr. Conkling arose as if addressing an audience, and 
as he stood there in the little parlor of Congress Hall in 
Albany he was certainly a majestic figure. He said: 
"Sir, a thing that is quickly done is doubly done. Here- 
after, as long as you and I both live, there never will be 
a deposit in any bank, personally, politically, or finan- 
cially to my credit which will not be subject to your 
draft." 

The gentleman whom he named became my deputy. 
His name was Erastus Clark. He was a man of ability 
and very broad culture, and was not only efficient in the 
performance of his duties, but one of the most delightful 
of companions. His health was bad, and his friends 
were always alarmed, and justifiably so, about him. 
Nevertheless, I met him years afterwards in Washington, 
when he was past eighty-four. 

At Mr. Conkling's request Mr. Clark made an ap- 
pointment for a mutual visit to Trenton Falls, a charm- 
ing resort near Utica. We spent the week-end there, 
and I saw Mr. Conkling at his best. He was charming 
in reminiscence, in discussion, in his characterization of 



84 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

the leading actors upon the public stage, and in varying 
views of ambitions and careers. 

When the patronage all fell into his hands after the 
election of General Grant, he pressed upon me the ap- 
pointment of postmaster of the city of New York. It 
was difficult for him to understand that, while I enjoyed 
politics and took an active part in campaigns, I would 
not accept any office whatever. He then appointed one 
of the best of postmasters, who afterwards became post- 
master-general, but who was also one of the most effi- 
cient of his lieutenants, General Thomas L. James. 

When Mr. Conkling was a candidate for United States 
senator I was regarded as a confidential friend of Gov- 
ernor Fenton. The governor was one of the most secre- 
tive of men, and, therefore, I did not know his views as 
to the candidate, or whether he had preferences. I think 
he had no preferences but wished Conkling defeated, 
and at the same time did not want to take a position 
which would incur the enmity of him or his friends. 

One night there was a great public demonstration, 
and, being called upon, I made a speech to the crowd, 
which included the legislature, to the effect that we had 
been voiceless in the United States Senate too long; that 
the greatest State in the Union should be represented 
by a man who had demonstrated his ability to all, and 
that man was Mr. Conkling. This created an impres- 
sion that I was speaking for the governor as well as 
myself, and the effect upon the election was great. Mr. 
Conkling thought so, and that led to his pressing upon 
me official recognition. 

How the breach came between us, why he became 
persistently hostile during the rest of his life, I never 
knew. President Arthur, Governor Cornell, and other 



ROSCOE CONKLING 85 

of his intimate friends told me that they tried often to 
find out, but their efforts only irritated him and never 
received any response. 

Senator Conkling's peculiar temperament was a source 
of great trouble to his lieutenants. They were all able 
and loyal, but he was intolerant of any exercise on their 
part of independent judgment. This led to the breaking 
off of all relations with the two most distinguished of 
them — President Arthur and Governor Cornell. 

A breach once made could not be healed. A bitter 
controversy in debate with Mr. Blaine assumed a per- 
sonal character. In the exchanges common in the heat 
of such debates Blaine ridiculed Conkling's manner and 
called him a turkey-cock. Mutual friends tried many 
times to bring them together. Blaine was always will- 
ing, but Conkling never. 

Conkling had a controversy which was never healed 
with Senator Piatt, who had served him long and faith- 
fully and with great efficiency. During the twenty years 
in which Piatt was leader, following Senator Conkling, 
he displayed the reverse qualities. He was always ready 
for consultation, he sought advice, and was tolerant of 
large liberty of individual judgment among his associ- 
ates. He was always forgiving, and taking back into 
confidence those with whom he had quarrelled. 

One summer I was taking for a vacation a trip to 
Europe and had to go aboard the steamer the night 
before, as she sailed very early in the morning. One of 
my staff appeared and informed me that a very serious 
attack upon the New York Central had been started 
in the courts and that the law department needed out- 
side counsel and asked whom he should employ. I 
said: "Senator Conkling." With amazement he replied: 



86 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

"Why, he has been bitterly denouncing you for months." 
"Yes, but that was politics," I said. "You know the 
most brilliant lawyer in the United States might come 
to New York, and unless he formed advantageous asso- 
ciations with some of the older firms he could get no 
practice. Now, this suit will be very conspicuous, and 
the fact that Senator Conkling is chief counsel for the 
Central will give him at once a standing and draw to 
him clients." His appearance in the case gave him im- 
mediate prominence and a large fee. 

Senator Conkling's career at the bar was most suc- 
cessful, and there was universal sorrow when his life 
ended in the tragedy of the great blizzard. 



VI 

HORACE GREELEY 

While secretary of state of New York, the decennial 
State census was taken, and the appointment of three 
thousand census takers involved as much pressure from 
congressmen, State senators, assemblymen, and local 
leaders as if the places had been very remunerative and 
permanent. I discovered what a power political patron- 
age is in party organization, because it developed that 
the appointment of this large number of men, located in 
every town in the State, could easily have been utilized 
for the formation of a personal organization within the 
party. 

I was exceedingly fond, as I am still and always have 
been, of political questions, issues affecting the general 
government, the State, or localities, party organizations, 
and political leaders. So, while devoted to my profes- 
sion and its work and increasingly enjoying its labor 
and activities, politics became an interesting recreation. 
With no desire for and with a determination not to take 
any public office, to be called into party councils, to be 
at an occasional meeting of the State committee and a 
delegate to conventions were happy relief and excur- 
sions from the routine of professional work, as golf is to 
a tired business man or lawyer. 

The nomination of General Grant for president by 
the Republicans and of Horatio Seymour by the Demo- 
crats had made New York the pivotal State in the 

87 



88 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

national election. John T. Hoffman, the most popular 
among the younger Democrats, was their nominee for 
governor. The Republicans, with great unanimity, 
agreed upon John A. Griswold, a congressman from the 
Troy district. Griswold was the idol of his colleagues 
in the New York delegation in Congress, and his attrac- 
tive personality and demonstrated business ability had 
made him a great favorite with politicians, business 
men, and labor. The canvass for his nomination had 
been conducted with great ardor by enthusiastic friends 
in all parts of the State, and the delegations were nearly 
all practically pledged to his nomination. No one 
dreamed that there would be an opposition candidate. 

On the train to the convention John Russell Young, 
then managing editor of the New York Tribune under 
Mr. Greeley, came to me and said: "Mr. Greeley has 
decided to be a candidate at the convention for the 
nomination for governor. You are his friend, he lives 
in your assembly district in Westchester County, and 
wishes you to make the nomination speech." 

I tried to argue the question with Young by portray- 
ing to him the situation and the utter hopelessness of 
any attempt to break the slate. He, however, insisted 
upon it, saying that all pledges and preferences would 
disappear because of Greeley's services to the party for 
so many years. 

When we arrived at Syracuse and stated our determi- 
nation to present Mr. Greeley's name, it was hilariously 
received as a joke. Efforts were made by friends of Mr. 
Greeley to persuade him not to undertake such an im- 
possible task, but they could produce no effect. 

Mr. Griswold was put in nomination by Mr. Demers, 
one of the most eloquent young men in the ministry of 



HORACE GREELEY 89 

the State, and afterwards an editor of power, and his 
speech filled every requirement. 

Then I presented Mr. Greeley. At first the audience 
was hostile, but as the recital of the great editor's 
achievements grew in intensity and heat, the convention 
began to applaud and then to cheer. A delegate hurled 
at me the question: "How about Greeley signing the 
bail of Jefferson Davis?" The sentiment seemed to 
change at once and cheers were followed by hisses. 
Then there was supreme silence, and I immediately 
shouted: "There are spots on the sun." 

The effect was electrical. Delegates were on their 
feet, standing on chairs, the air was full of hats, and the 
cheers deafening for Greeley for some minutes. Mr. 
Demers, the preacher delegate, lost his equilibrium, 
rushed up to me, shaking his fist excitedly, and shouted : 
"Damn you! you have nominated him and beaten 
Griswold." 

A recess was taken, and when the convention recon- 
vened the ballot demonstrated that if the organization 
is given time it can always reform its shattered lines and 
show the efficiency of discipline. 

When I met Mr. Greeley soon after, he said: "I cannot 
understand why I desired the nomination for governor, 
nor why anybody should want the office. There is noth- 
ing in it. No man now can name the ten last governors 
of the State of New York." 

Having tried that proposition many times since on the 
average citizen, I have found that Mr. Greeley was abso- 
lutely right. Any one who does not think so can try to 
solve that problem himself. 

The meeting of the Electoral College at the Capitol at 
Albany in 1864 was one of the most picturesque and 



9 o CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

interesting gatherings ever held in the State. People 
came from all parts of the country to witness the formal- 
ity of the casting of the vote of New York for Abraham 
Lincoln. The members of the college were, most of 
them, men of great distinction in our public and civic 
life. 

Horace Greeley was elected president of the college. 
The meeting was held in the Senate chamber. When 
Mr. Greeley took the chair, the desk in front of him 
made only his bust visible, and with his wonderfully in- 
tellectual face, his long gray hair brushed back, and his 
solemn and earnest expression, he was one of the most 
impressive figures I ever saw occupying the chair as a 
presiding officer. 

One of the electors had failed to appear. Most of us 
knew that under pressure of great excitement he was 
unable to resist his convivial tendencies, but no one 
supposed that Mr. Greeley could by any possibility 
know of his weakness. After waiting some time one of 
the electors moved that the college take a recess for 
half a day. Mr. Greeley turned very pale and, before 
putting the question, made a little speech, something 
like this, in a voice full of emotion, I might almost say 
tears: "My brethren, we are met here upon the most 
solemn occasion of our lives in this crisis of the republic. 
Upon the regularity of what we do here this day may 
depend whether the republic lives or dies. I would, 
therefore, suggest that we sit here in silence until our 
absent brother, who is doubtless kept from us by some 
good reason, shall appear and take his seat." 

The effect of this address upon the Electoral College 
and the surrounding audience was great. Many were 
in tears, and the women spectators, most of whom were 



HORACE GREELEY 91 

in mourning for those lost during the war, were all 
crying. 

As secretary of state it was my duty to have the 
papers all prepared for execution as soon as the college 
had voted, and to attach to them the great seal of the 
State, and then they were sent by special messenger to 
Washington to be delivered to the House of Representa- 
tives. Mr. Greeley, at the opening of the session, said 
to me: "Chauncey, as I am not very familiar with par- 
liamentary law, I wish you would take a seat on the 
steps beside me here, so that I can consult you if neces- 
sary." After this effective and affecting speech he 
leaned down until he was close to my ear, and said: 
"Chauncey, how long do you think it will be before that 

d drunken fool will be able to return and take his 

seat?" 

General Grant's administration soon aroused great 
opposition. Carl Schurz, Charles Francis Adams, and 
other leaders became very hostile to the administration 
and to a second term. The country was longing for 
peace. The "carpet-bag" governments of the South 
were full of corruption and incompetence and imposed 
upon the Southern States intolerable burdens of debt. 
The feeling was becoming general that there should be 
universal amnesty in order that the best and most capa- 
ble people of the South could return to the management 
of their own affairs. 

This led to the calling of a convention of the Repub- 
licans, which nominated Horace Greeley for president. 
I had no desire nor the slightest intention of being in- 
volved in this controversy, but was happily pursuing 
my profession, with increasing fondness for private life. 

One day Commodore Vanderbilt, who had a strong 



92 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

friendship for Mr. Greeley, but took no interest in poli- 
tics, said to me: "Mr. Greeley has been to see me and 
is very anxious for you to assist him. If you can aid 
him in any way I wish you would." 

Afterwards Mr. Greeley called at my house. "Chaun- 
cey," he said (he always called me Chauncey), "as you 
know, I have been nominated by the Liberal Republican 
convention for President of the United States. If I can 
get the indorsement of the Democratic party my elec- 
tion is assured. My Democratic friends tell me that in 
order to accomplish that I must demonstrate that I have 
a substantial Republican following. So we have called 
a meeting at Rochester, which is the capital of the 
strongest Republican counties of the State. It is neces- 
sary to have for the principal speaker some Republican 
of State and national reputation. I have selected you 
for that purpose." 

To my protest that I did not wish to enter into the 
contest nor to take any part in active politics, he said 
very indignantly: "I have supported you in my paper 
and personally during the whole of your career. I 
thought that if anybody was capable of gratitude it is 
you, and I have had unfortunate experiences with 
many." I never was able to resist an appeal of this 
kind, so I said impulsively: "Mr. Greeley, I will go." 

The meeting was a marvellous success for the purpose 
for which it was called. It was purely a Republican 
gathering. The crowd was several times larger than the 
hall could accommodate. Henry R. Selden, one of the 
judges of the Court of Appeals and one of the most emi- 
nent and respected Republicans of the State, presided. 
The two hundred vice-presidents and secretaries upon 
the platform I had known intimately for years as Repub- 



HORACE GREELEY 93 

Iican leaders of their counties and districts. The dem- 
onstration so impressed the Democratic State leaders 
that at the national Democratic convention Mr. Greeley 
was indorsed. 

There were two State conventions held simultaneously 
that year, one Democratic and one Liberal Republican. 
In the division of offices the Democratic party, being the 
larger, was given the governorship and the Liberal Re- 
publicans had the lieutenant-governorship. I was 
elected as the presiding officer of the Liberal Republican 
convention and also was made unanimously its nominee 
for lieutenant-governor. The Democratic convention 
nominated Francis Kernan, one of the most distinguished 
lawyers of the State, and afterwards United States 
senator. 

If the election had been held early in the canvass 
there is little doubt but that Mr. Greeley would have 
carried the State by an overwhelming majority. His 
difficulty was that for a quarter of a century, as editor 
of the New York Tribune, he had been the most merci- 
less, bitter, and formidable critic and opponent of the 
Democratic party. The deep-seated animosity against 
him was fully aroused as the campaign proceeded by a 
propaganda which placed in the hands of every Democrat 
these former slashing editorials of the New York Tribune. 
Their effect upon the Democratic voters was evident 
after a while, and when in the September election North 
Carolina went Republican, a great mass of Republicans, 
who had made up their minds to support Mr. Greeley, 
went back to their party, and he was overwhelmingly 
defeated. 

In the early part of his canvass Mr. Greeley made a 
tour of the country. There have been many such 



94 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

travels by presidential candidates, but none like this. 
His march was a triumphal procession, and his audiences 
enormous and most enthusiastic. The whole country 
marvelled at his intellectual versatility. He spoke every 
day, and often several times a day, and each speech was 
absolutely new. There seemed to be no limit to his 
originality, his freshness, or the new angles from which 
to present the issues of the canvass. No candidate was 
ever so bitterly abused and so slandered. 

A veteran speaker has in the course of his career origi- 
nal experiences. The cordiality and responsiveness of 
his audience is not always an index of their agreement 
with his argument. During the campaign Mr. Greeley 
came to me and said: "I have received encouraging 
accounts from the State of Maine. I have a letter from 
such a place" — naming it — "from the principal of the 
academy there. He writes me that the Congregational 
minister, who has the largest church in town, the bank 
president, the manufacturer, the principal lawyer, and 
himself are lifelong readers of the Tribune, and those 
steadfast Republicans intend to support me. He thinks 
if they can have a public meeting with a speaker of 
national reputation, the result might be an overturn in 
my favor in this community, which is almost unani- 
mously Republican, that it may influence the whole 
State, and," continued Mr. Greeley, "he suggests you 
as the speaker, and I earnestly ask you to go." 

When I arrived at the place I was entertained by the 
manufacturer. The audience crowded the largest hall 
in the town. The principal of the academy presided, 
the Congregational minister opened the exercises with a 
prayer, and I was introduced and received with great 
cordiality. 



HORACE GREELEY 95 

For such an audience my line of talk was praising 
General Grant as the greatest general of modern times, 
and how largely the preservation of the Union depended 
upon his military genius. Then to picture the tremen- 
dous responsibilities of the presidency and the impossi- 
bility of a man, however great as a soldier, with a life- 
time of military education, environment, and experi- 
ences, succeeding in civil office, especially as great a one 
as the presidency of the United States. Then came, 
naturally, a eulogium of Horace Greeley, the maker of 
public opinion, the moulder of national policies, the 
most eloquent and resourceful leader of the Republican 
party since its formation. The audience cheered with 
great enthusiasm all these allusions to General Grant, 
and responded with equal fervor to my praise of Horace 
Greeley. 

When I concluded they stood up and gave me cordial 
cheers, and the presiding officer came forward and said: 
"I now suggest that we close this meeting with three 
rousing cheers for Horace Greeley." The principal of 
the academy, the manufacturer, the minister, the law- 
yer, a very few of the audience, and several women 
responded. After this frost a farmer rose gradually, 
and as he began to let out link after link of his body, 
which seemed about seven feet tall, he reached his full 
height, and then in a voice which could be heard a mile 
shouted: "Three cheers for General Grant!" The re- 
sponse nearly took the roof off the house. I left the 
State the next morning and told Mr. Greeley that he 
could not carry Maine. 

Among the amusing episodes of the campaign was one 
which occurred at an open-door mass meeting at Water- 
town, N. Y. John A. Dix had been nominated for gov- 



96 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

ernor on the Republican ticket, and I was speaking of 
him and his career. He had changed from one party to 
the other five or six times in the course of his long career, 
and each time received an office. There was great doubt 
as to his age, because in the American Encyclopaedia the 
date of his birth was given as of a certain year, and in 
the French Encyclopaedia, which published his biography 
when he was minister to France, a widely different date 
was given. In the full tide of partisan oratory I went 
over these changes of political activity, and how each 
one had been rewarded, also the doubt as to his age, and 
then I shouted: "I have discovered among the records 
of the Pilgrim Fathers that when they landed on Plym- 
outh Rock they found John A. Dix standing on the 
rock and announcing that unless they made him justice 
of the peace he would join the Indians." An indignant 
farmer, who could not hold his wrath any longer, shouted : 
"That's a lie ! The Pilgrims landed more than two hun- 
dred and fifty years ago. " I saw that my interrupter had 
swallowed my bait, hook, and line, bob and sinker, pole 
and all, and shouted with great indignation: "Sir, I have 
narrated that historical incident throughout the State, 
from Montauk Point to Niagara Falls, and you are the 
first man who has had the audacity to question it." 

Another farmer stepped up to the heckler and said: 
"Here is my hat, neighbor. You can keep it. I am 
going bareheaded for the rest of my life." In his up- 
roarious laughter the crowd all joined. It was years 
before the questioning farmer could visit Watertown 
without encountering innumerable questions as to when 
the Pilgrims landed on Plymouth Rock. 

The last meeting of the campaign was held at Mr. 
Greeley's home at Chappaqua in Westchester County. 



HORACE GREELEY 97 

We all knew that the contest was hopeless and defeat 
sure. I was one of the speakers, both as his neighbor 
and friend, and accompanied him to New York. A 
rough crowd on the train jeered him as we rode along. 
We went to his office, and there he spoke of the lies that 
had been told about him, and which had been believed 
by the public; of the cartoons which had misrepresented 
him, especially those of Tom Nast, and of which there 
were many lying about. Leaning upon his desk, a dis- 
couraged and hopeless man, he said: "I have given my 
life to the freeing of the slaves, and yet they have been 
made to believe that I was a slave driver. It has been 
made to appear, and people have been made to believe, 
that I was wrong or faithless, or on the other side of the 
reforms which I have advocated all my life. I will be 
beaten in the campaign and I am ruined for life." He 
was overcome with emotion, and it was the saddest in- 
terview I ever had with any one. It was really the 
breaking of a great heart. He died before the votes 
were counted. 

There was instantly a tremendous revulsion of popu- 
lar feeling in the country. He had lost his wife during 
the campaign, and the people woke up suddenly to the 
sorrows under which he had labored, to his genius as a 
journalist, to his activity as a reformer, and to a useful- 
ness that had no parallel among his contemporaries. 
The president-elect, General Grant, and the vice-presi- 
dent-elect, Schuyler Colfax, attended the funeral, and 
without distinction of party his death was universally 
mourned. 

After the election, in consultation on railroad affairs, 
Commodore Vanderbilt said to me, 'I was very glad 
you were defeated," which was his way of saying that 



98 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

he did not want me either to leave the railroad or to 
have other duties which would impair my efficiency. 

With the tragic death of Mr. Greeley the Liberal Re- 
publican movement ended. Most of us who had fol- 
lowed him resumed at once our Republican party re- 
lations and entered actively into its work in the next 
campaign. The revolt was forgiven, except in very few 
instances, and the Greeley men went back to their old 
positions in their various localities and became promi- 
nent in the official life of the State. I, as usual, in the 
fall took my vacation on the platform for the party. 



VII 

RUTHERFORD B. HAYES AND WILLIAM M. EVARTS 

It is one of the tragedies of history that in the proces- 
sion of events, the accumulation of incidents, year by 
year and generation by generation, famous men of any 
period so rapidly disappear. 

At the close of the Civil War there were at least a 
score of generals in the North, and as many in the South, 
whose names were household words. About fifty-five 
years have passed since the war closed, and the average 
citizen knows only two of them — Grant and Lee. 

One of the last acts of General Grant was to tender to 
Senator Conkling the position of chief justice of the 
Supreme Court of the United States. Conkling had 
gained from the senatorship and the leadership of his 
party a great reputation, to which subsequent service 
in the Senate could add little or nothing. He was in his 
early forties, in the prime of his powers, and he would 
have had before him, as chief justice of this great court, 
a long life of usefulness and distinction. 

Conkling was essentially an advocate, and as an advo- 
cate not possessing the judicial temperament. While 
there was a great surprise that he declined this wonder- 
ful opportunity, we can see now that the environment 
and restrictions of the position would have made it im- 
possible for this fiery and ambitious spirit. It was well 
known that General Grant, so far as he could influence 
the actions of the national Republican convention, was 

99 



ioo CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

in favor of Senator Conkling as his successor. The sen- 
ator's friends believed, and they made him believe, that 
the presidency was within his grasp. 

When the national convention met it was discovered 
that the bitterness between the two leaders, Blaine and 
Conkling, made harmony impossible. The bitterness by 
that time was on Conkling's side against Blaine. With 
the Iatter's make-up, resentment could not last very long. 
It is an interesting speculation what might have hap- 
pened if these two leaders had become friends. It is 
among the possibilities that both might have achieved 
the great object of their ambitions and been presidents 
of the United States. 

The outstanding feature of that convention in the his- 
tory of those interesting gatherings was the speech of 
Colonel Robert G. IngersoII, nominating Mr. Blaine. 
In its effect upon the audience, in its reception by the 
country, and by itself as an effort of that kind, it stands 
unprecedented and unequalled. 

As usual in popular conventions, where the antago- 
nism of the leaders and the bitterness of their partisan- 
ship threatens the unity of the party, the result was the 
nomination of a "dark horse," and the convention closed 
its labors by presenting to the country General Ruther- 
ford B. Hayes. 

President Hayes, although one of the most amiable, 
genial, and companionable of our presidents, with every 
quality to attach men to him and make warm friend- 
ships, was, nevertheless, one of the most isolated. He 
inherited all the business troubles, economic disorganiza- 
tion, and currency disturbances which grew out of the 
panic of 1873. He was met with more bankruptcy than 
had ever occurred in our business history. 



R. B. HAYES AND W. M. EVARTS 101 

With rare courage and the most perfect good nature, 
he installed essential reforms, which, in the then condi- 
tion of party organization and public sentiment, practi- 
cally offended everybody. He threw the extreme radi- 
cals of his party into a frenzy of rage by wiping out the 
"carpet-bag'' governments and restoring self-govern- 
ment for the South. He inaugurated civil-service re- 
form, but in doing so antagonized most of the senators 
and members of the House. 

When he found that the collector of the port of New 
York, Chester A. Arthur, and the surveyor, Alonzo B. 
Cornell, were running their offices with their vast pat- 
ronage on strictly machine lines, and that this had the 
general approval of party leaders, he removed them and 
appointed for their successors General Edwin A. Merritt 
and Silas W. Burt, with instructions to remove no one 
on account of politics, and to appoint no one except for 
demonstrated efficiency for the place. He pursued the 
same policy in the Internal Revenue and Post-Office 
Departments. This policy threatened the primacy of 
the Conkling machine. 

President Hayes had a very strong Cabinet. The sec- 
retary of state, William M. Evarts, and the secretary of 
the treasury, John Sherman, were two of the ablest men 
in the country. Evarts was the leader of the national 
bar, and in crystallized mentality had no equal in the 
profession or outside of it. Sherman was the foremost 
and best-informed economist, and also a great statesman. 

In close consultation with Sherman, Hayes brought 
about the resumption of specie payment. The "green- 
backers," who were for unlimited paper, and the silver 
men, who were for unlimited coinage of silver, and who 
were very numerous, joined the insurgent brigade. 



102 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

While Mr. Hayes retired from the presidency by what 
might be called unanimous consent, he had created con- 
ditions which made possible the success of his party in 
1880. 

It was a refreshing experience to meet the president 
during these troublous times. While everybody else 
was excited, he was perfectly calm. While most of the 
great men at the Capitol were raging, he, at the other 
end of the avenue, was placid and serene. He said once 
to me: "It is a novel experience when you do what you 
think right and best for the country to have it so gen- 
erally criticised and disapproved. But the compensa- 
tion is that you expect antagonism and disapproval and 
would think something was the matter with your deci- 
sions if you did not receive them." 

The general abuse to which he was subjected from so 
many sources affected the public's view of him. After 
he had left the presidency he told me that he thought it 
was the duty of an ex-president to utilize the prestige 
which belonged to the office in the aid of education. "I 
have found," he said, "that it helps enormously in col- 
leges and schools to have lectures, lessons, etc., in his- 
tory and patriotism, and behind them the personality of 
an ex-president of the United States." 

As an illustration of how distinguished men, when out 
of power, no longer interest our people, I remember I 
met Mr. Hayes one day in front of a fruit display of 
a well-known grocery establishment, and after cordial 
greeting said to the grocery man: "That is ex- President 
Hayes. Don't you want to meet him?" The grocery- 
man replied: "I am not interested in him, but I have 
the finest collection of pears in the city and want to sell 
you some." 



R. B. HAYES AND W. M. EVARTS 103 

The Capitol was full of the rich and racy characteriza- 
tions, epigrams, and sarcasms which Senator Conkling 
was daily pouring out upon President Hayes, and espe- 
cially Secretary Evarts. By all the rules of senatorial 
courtesy in those machine days, a member of the Cabi- 
net from New York should have been a friend of its 
United States senator. Mr. Evarts was too big a man 
to be counted in any other class or category except his 
own. Of course, all these criticisms were carried to both 
the president and the secretary of state. The president 
never mentioned them, and I never heard Evarts, though 
I met him frequently, make any reply but once. 

Dining with Mr. Evarts, who entertained charmingly, 
a very distinguished English jurist among the guests, 
here on a special mission, said: "Mr. Secretary, I was 
at the Senate to-day and heard Senator Conkling speak- 
ing. His magnificent personal appearance, added to his 
fine oratory, must make him one of the most formidable 
advocates at your bar and in your courts." The English 
judge thought, of course, that Mr. Evarts, as the leader 
of the American Bar and always in the courts, would 
know every lawyer of distinction. Mr. Evarts dryly 
replied: "I never saw Mr. Conkling in court." 

It is always dangerous to comment or narrate a racy 
story which involves the personal affliction of anybody. 
Dining with Mr. Evarts one night was also a very dis- 
tinguished general of our Civil War, who had been an 
important figure in national politics. He was very curi- 
ous to know about Mr. Tilden, and especially as to the 
truth of a report that Mr. Tilden had a stroke of paraly- 
sis, and appealed to me, as I was just from New York. 
I narrated a story which was current at the time that 
Mr. Tilden had denied the report by saying to a friend: 



104 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

"They say I cannot lift my left hand to my head." He 
then put his right hand under the left elbow and shot 
the left one easily up to his face and said: "See there, 
my left has reached its goal." 

I saw that Mr. Evarts was embarrassed at the anec- 
dote and discovered afterwards that the distinguished 
guest had recently had a similar stroke on his left side 
and could propel his left arm and hand only with the 
assistance of his right. 

My old bogie of being put into office arose again in 
the senatorial election of 1882. The legislature, for the 
first time in a generation, was entirely Ieaderless. The 
old organization had disappeared and a new one had not 
yet crystallized. 

Mr. Evarts was anxious to be senator, and I pledged 
him my support. Evarts was totally devoid of the arts 
of popular appeal. He was the greatest of lawyers and 
the most delightful of men, but he could not canvass for 
votes. Besides, he was entirely independent in his ideas 
of any organization dictation or control, and resented 
both. He did not believe that a public man should go 
into public office under any obligations, and resented 
such suggestions. 

A large body of representative men thought it would 
be a good thing for the country if New York could have 
this most accomplished, capable, and brilliant man in 
the United States Senate. They urged him strongly 
upon the legislature, none of whose members knew him 
personally, and Mr. Evarts would not go to Albany. 

The members selected a committee to come down to 
New York and see Mr. Evarts. They went with the 
idea of ascertaining how far he would remember with 
gratitude those who elected him. Their visit was a 



R. B. HAYES AND W. M. EVARTS 105 

miserable failure. They came in hot indignation to my 
office and said they did not propose to send such a cold 
and unsympathetic man as their representative to Wash- 
ington and earnestly requested my consent to their 
nominating me at the caucus the next morning. 

The committee telephoned to Albany and received the 
assent of every faction of their party to this proposition. 
Then they proposed that when the caucus met, Mr. 
Evarts, of course, should receive complimentary speeches 
from his friends. Meanwhile others would be nomi- 
nated, and then a veteran member, whom they desig- 
nated, should propose me in the interest of harmony and 
the union of the party, whereat the sponsors of the other 
candidate would withdraw their man, and I be nomi- 
nated by acclamation. My answer was a most earnest 
appeal for Mr. Evarts. Then Mr. Evarts's friends ral- 
lied to his support and he was elected. 

I place Mr. Evarts in the foremost rank as a lawyer, 
a wit, and a diplomat. He tried successfully the most 
famous cases of his time and repeatedly demonstrated 
his remarkable genius. As a general railway counsel 
and, therefore, as an administrator in the retaining of 
distinguished counsels, I met with many of the best men 
at the bar, but never any with such a complete and clari- 
fied intellect as William M. Evarts. The mysteries of 
the most complicated cases seemed simple, the legal 
difficulties plain, and the solution comprehensible to 
everybody under his analysis. 

Mr. Evarts was the wittiest man I ever met. It is 
difficult to rehabilitate in the sayings of a wit the com- 
plete flavor of the utterance. It is easier with a man of 
humor. Evarts was very proud of his efforts as a farmer 
on his large estate in Vermont. Among his prizes was a 



106 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

drove of pigs. He sent to Chief Justice Morrison R. 
Waite a copy of his eulogy on Chief Justice Salmon P. 
Chase, Wake's predecessor, and at the same time a ham, 
saying in his letter: "My dear Chief Justice, I send you 
to-day one of my prize hams and also my eulogy on 
Chief Justice Chase, both the products of my pen." 

The good things Mr. Evarts said would be talked of 
long after a dinner. I remember on one occasion his 
famous partner, Mr. Choate, who was a Harvard man, 
while Evarts was a graduate from Yale, introduced Mr. 
Evarts by saying that he was surprised that a Yale man, 
with all the prejudices of that institution against the 
superior advantages of Harvard, should have risked the 
coats of his stomach at a Harvard dinner. Mr. Evarts 
replied: "When I go to a Harvard dinner I always leave 
the coats of my stomach at home." 

Mr. Evarts once told me when I was visiting him at 
his country place that an old man whom he pointed out, 
and who was sawing wood, was the most sensible philos- 
opher in the neighborhood. Mr. Evarts said: "He is 
always talking to himself, and I asked him why." His 
answer was: "I always talk to myself in preference to 
talking to anybody else, because I like to talk to a sensi- 
ble man and to hear a man of sense talk." 



VIII 
GENERAL GARFIELD 

The triumph of the Democrats in Maine in the Sep- 
tember election, 1880, had a most depressing effect upon 
the Republicans and an equally exhilarating one upon 
the Democrats. The paralyzing effect of the simple 
utterances in popular elections almost makes one think 
that every candidate should follow Matthew Quay's 
famous advice to his candidate for governor: "Beaver, 
keep your mouth shut." 

In the campaign when General Winfield Scott ran for 
the presidency, he began an important communication 
by stating that he would answer as soon as he had taken 
a hasty plate of soup. That "hasty plate of soup" ap- 
peared in cartoons, was pictured on walls, etc., in every 
form of ridicule, and was one of the chief elements of his 
defeat. 

When towards the close of the canvass Garfield had 
succeeded in making the tariff the leading issue, General 
Hancock was asked what were his views on the tariff. 
(You must remember that the general was a soldier and 
had never been in politics.) The general answered: 
"The tariff was a purely local issue in Pennsylvania." 
The whole country burst into a gale of laughter, and 
Hancock's campaign had a crack which was never 
mended. 

There never were two more picturesque opponents 

than General Garfield and General Hancock. Hancock 

107 



io8 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

was the idol of the Army of the Potomac, and everybody 
remembered McCIellan's despatch after one of the bloodi- 
est battles of the Peninsula campaign: "Hancock was 
superb to-day." He was an exceedingly handsome man 
and one of the finest figures in uniform in the whole 
country. 

General Garfield also presented a very fine appear- 
ance. He was a large man, well-proportioned, and with 
very engaging manners. He also had an unusual faculty 
for attractive public addresses, not only on politics, but 
many subjects, especially education and patriotism. 

I never can forget when the news of Lincoln's assassi- 
nation reached New York. The angry and dangerous 
crowd which surged up and down Broadway and through 
Wall Street threatened to wreck the banking and busi- 
ness houses which were supposed to be sympathetic with 
the Confederates. 

Garfield suddenly appeared on the balcony of the Cus- 
tom House in Wall Street and succeeded in stilling the 
crowd. With a voice that reached up to Trinity Church 
he urged calmness in thought and action, deprecated any 
violence, and then, in an impassioned appeal to hopeful- 
ness notwithstanding the tragedy, exclaimed impulsively: 
"God reigns and the Republic still lives." 

I was requested by some friends to visit General Gar- 
field and see how he felt on the political situation, which 
during the campaign of 1880 did not look hopeful. I 
took the next train, spent the day with him, and was 
back in New York the following day. 

When I left the train at Cleveland in the morning the 
newsboys pushed at me a Cleveland Democratic daily, 
with a rooster's picture covering the whole front page, 
and the announcement that the Democrats had carried 



GENERAL GARFIELD 109 

Maine. The belief was universal then that "as Maine 
goes so goes the Union," and whichever party carried 
that State in the September election, the country would 
follow in the presidential contest in November. 

I took the next train to Mentor, the residence of Gen- 
eral Garfield. I found at the station a score or more of 
country wagons and carriages waiting for passengers. I 
said to the farmers: "Will any of you take me up to 
General Garfield's residence?" One of them answered: 
"We will all take you up this morning, but if you had 
come yesterday you would have had to wait your turn." 

It was a startling instance of the variableness of pub- 
lic opinion. Delegations from everywhere, on their way 
to extend greetings to the candidate, had read the morn- 
ing papers and turned back, deciding not to go. 

I found Garfield struggling bravely to overcome the 
depression which he felt. He was in close touch with 
the situation everywhere, and discussed it with discrimi- 
nation and hopefulness. 

The most affecting incident occurred while I was talk- 
ing with him. His mother passed through the room 
and, patting him on the back, said: "James, the neigh- 
bors think it is all right; they are raising a banner at the 
corner." 

Two old soldier friends came in, and the noonday din- 
ner was a rare intellectual feast. The general was a 
brilliant conversationalist. His mind turned first to the 
accidents of careers. He asked me if there was not a 
time in my early struggles when if Providence had offered 
a modest certainty I would not have exchanged the 
whole future for it, and then continued: "There was a 
period in my early struggles as a teacher when, if I had 
been offered the principalship of an endowed academy, 



no CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

with an adequate salary, with the condition that I must 
devote myself to its interests and abandon everything 
else, I am quite sure I would have accepted." 

Of course, the hopeful application of this incident to 
the Maine defeat was that, no such offer having been 
made or accepted, he had made a glorious career in the 
army, rising to the head of the General Staff, and for 
twenty years had been the leading figure in the House 
of Representatives, and was now a recently elected United 
States senator and chosen candidate for president. 

Then he turned to the instances where victory had 
been plucked from defeat in battles. After citing many 
instances he gave a word picture of the Battle of Chicka- 
mauga which was the finest thing of the kind I have ever 
heard or ever read. 

After his two comrades left I told him of the interest 
which my friends were taking in his canvass, and that I 
would add their contribution to the campaign commit- 
tee. The general instantly was exultant and jubilant. 
He fairly shouted: "Have I not proved to you all day 
that there is always a silver lining to the cloud, and that 
the darkest hour is just before dawn?" 

It was one of the sources of General Garfield's success 
as an orator that he was very emotional and sentimental. 
He happily carried with him amid all struggles and dis- 
appointments, as well as successes in the making of a 
career, the buoyant, hopeful, companionable, and affec- 
tionate interests which characterize the ambitious senior 
who has just left college to take his plunge into the 
activities of life. 

So far as our State was concerned, a great deal turned 
upon the attitude of Senator Conkling. His great and 
triumphant speech of four hours at the Academy of 



GENERAL GARFIELD in 

Music in New York brought all his friends into line, but 
the greatest help which General Garfield received was 
from the generous, unselfish, and enthusiastic support of 
General Grant. 

General Grant had been the leading candidate in the 
convention which finally nominated Garfield, but he 
voluntarily appeared upon the platform in several 
States and at Garfield's home. His brief but most effec- 
tive speeches gathered around Garfield not only the 
whole of the old-soldier vote but those who had become 
disaffected or indifferent because of the result of the 
national Republican convention. 

There probably was no canvass where the Republican 
orator ever had so many opportunities for the exercise 
of every faculty which he possessed. His candidate had 
made an excellent record as a soldier in the field and as 
a statesman in Congress, as an educator and a popular 
speaker on questions of vital interest, while the opposi- 
tion presented abundant opportunities for attack. 

After the presidential election came the meeting of the 
New York State legislature for the choosing of a United 
States senator. The legislature was overwhelmingly 
Republican, and the organization or machine Republi- 
cans were in a large majority. The assembly was organ- 
ized and the appointment of committees used to make 
certain the election of an organization man. 

A very unusual thing happened. The forces of the 
organization were divided between two candidates: 
Thomas C. Piatt and Richard Crowley. Mr. Conkl.ing 
had not declared his preference for either, as they were 
both devoted friends of his, though he had the power to 
have made a selection and have that selection accepted 
by the legislature. Vice-President-elect Chester A. Arthur 



ii2 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

appeared as manager for Mr. Crowley. Piatt conducted 
his own canvass. 

I was called to a meeting in New York, where Mr. 
Blaine, secretary of state, was present. Mr. Blaine said 
that administration managers had made a thorough can- 
vass of the legislature and they had found that I was 
the only one who could control enough anti-organization 
votes to be elected, and, therefore, General Garfield and 
his friends had decided that I must enter the race. I did 
not want to do it, nor did I want the senatorship at that 
time. However, it seemed a plain duty. 

A canvass showed that Mr. Piatt, Mr. Crowley, and 
myself had about an equal number of votes. Of course, 
Mr. Blaine's object was, knowing that Senator Conkling 
would be hostile to the administration, to prevent his 
having a colleague who would join with him, and thus 
place the State of New York against the policies of the 
incoming president. 

After the canvass had been going on for some time, 
Mr. Piatt came to me and asked why I was in it. I told 
him frankly that I was in it to see, if possible, that the 
senator-elect should support the administration. He 
said: "Very well, I will do that." 

I immediately called together my supporters. Mr. 
Piatt appeared before them and stated that if elected he 
would support the president and his administration in 
every respect. He was asked if he would vote for the 
confirmation of appointees whom the president might 
select who were specially in disfavor with Senator Conk- 
ling, conspicuously Senator William H. Robertson. Mr. 
Piatt said, "Yes, I will." My friends all went over to 
him and he was elected. 

General Garfield was inaugurated in March, 1881, and 



GENERAL GARFIELD n 3 

his difficulties began with his Cabinet. Senator Conk- 
ling, who saw clearly that with Blaine in the Cabinet his 
organization was in danger in New York, did not want 
any of his friends to accept a Cabinet position. The 
navy was offered to Levi P. Morton, but at the request 
of Senator Conkling he declined. 

When the time came for appointments in the Custom 
House of New York, General Garfield sent in the name 
of William H. Robertson, who was the leader of the anti- 
machine forces in the State. Mr. Conkling at once de- 
manded that Mr. Piatt should join with him in inducing 
the Senate to reject the nomination. Under the rule of 
senatorial courtesy the Senate would undoubtedly have 
done this if the two New York senators had acted 
together. Mr. Piatt told Mr. Conkling of his pledge to 
the members of the legislature, and that he must abide 
by it, and, as he told me, suggested to Mr. Conkling 
that, as he always had been his friend and did not want 
any breach with him, the only thing to be done, con- 
sistent with honor, was for both of them to resign and 
go back to the legislature for re-election, with a mandate 
which should enable them to reject the appointment of 
Judge Robertson and all similar appointments. 

As the legislature was overwhelmingly Republican, 
and the organization had a large majority, it seemed to 
both senators that they would be returned immediately. 
But it is singular how intense partisanship will blind the 
ablest and shrewdest politicians. Senators Conkling and 
Piatt were among the ablest and most capable political 
managers of their time. What they did not reckon with 
was that the people of the State of New York, or, rather, 
the Republicans of the State, having just elected a presi- 
dent, would not view favorably the legislature of the 



ii 4 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

State sending two senators to embarrass their own 
administration. There was hardly a newspaper in the 
State or in the country that did not take a hostile 
attitude. 

Mr. Blaine again came to New York and insisted upon 
my entering the canvass, and that I was the only one 
who could get the whole of the anti-organization vote. 

With the Democrats voting for their own candidate, 
and the anti-organization men voting for me, it was im- 
possible for any one to have a majority. The fight was 
most bitter. The ineffectual ballotting went on every 
day for months. Then Garfield was assassinated. The 
leader of the Conkling forces came to me and said: "You 
have a majority of the Republican members now voting 
for you. Of course, the antagonism has become so great 
on your candidacy that we cannot vote for you, but if 
you will withdraw, we will go into caucus." 

I instantly accepted the proposition, saw my own 
people, and we selected Warner Miller to represent the 
administration, and Congressman Lapham, a very able 
and capable lieutenant of Mr. Conkling, to represent the 
organization. The caucus unanimously nominated them 
and they were elected. Senator Conkling immediately 
settled in New York to practise law and retired from 
political activities. 

It is the irony of fate that General Garfield, who did 
more than any other statesman to bring the public from 
its frenzy after the murder of Lincoln back to a calm and 
judicious consideration of national conditions, should 
himself be the victim, so soon after his inauguration, of 
an assassin. 

Lincoln was assassinated in April, after his second in- 
auguration in March, while Garfield was shot in the rail- 



GENERAL GARFIELD 115 

way station at Washington July 2, following his inaugu- 
ration. The president was removed to a cottage at 
Long Branch, N. J., and lingered there with great suffer- 
ing for over two months. 

I was living at Long Branch that summer and going 
up and down every day to my office in New York. The 
whole country was in alternate emotions of hope and 
despair as the daily bulletins announced the varying 
phases of the illustrious patient's condition. The people 
also were greatly impressed at his wonderful self-control, 
heroic patience, endurance, and amiability. 

It was the experience of a lifetime in the psychology 
of human nature to meet, night after night, the people 
who gathered at the hotel at Long Branch. Most of 
them were office-seekers. There were those who had 
great anticipations of Garfield's recovery, and others, 
hidebound machinists and organization men, who thought 
if Garfield died and Vice-President Arthur became presi- 
dent, he would bring in the old order as it existed while 
he was one of its chief administrators. 

There were present very able and experienced news- 
paper men, representing every great journal in the coun- 
try. The evening sessions of these veteran observers of 
public men were most interesting. Their critical analy- 
sis of the history and motives of the arriving visitors 
would have been, if published, the most valuable volume 
of " Who's Who" ever published. When President Gar- 
field died the whole country mourned. 



IX 

CHESTER A. ARTHUR 

Chester A. Arthur immediately succeeded to the 
presidency. It had been my good fortune to know so 
well all the presidents, commencing with Mr. Lincoln, 
and now the occupant of the White House was a lifelong 
friend. 

President Arthur was a very handsome man, in the 
prime of life, of superior character and intelligence, and 
with the perfect manners and courtesies of a trained 
man of the world. A veteran statesman who had known 
most of our presidents intimately and been in Congress 
under many of them said, in reviewing the list with me 
at the recent convention at Chicago: "Arthur was the 
only gentleman I ever saw in the White House." 

Of course, he did not mean exactly that. He meant 
that Arthur was the only one of our presidents who came 
from the refined social circles of the metropolis or from 
other capitals, and was past master in all the arts and 
conventionalities of what is known as "best society." 
He could have taken equal rank in that respect with the 
Prince of Wales, who afterwards became King Ed- 
ward VII. 

The " hail-fellow-well-met " who had been on familiar 
terms with him while he was the party leader in New 
York City, found when they attempted the old familiari- 
ties that, while their leader was still their friend, he was 
President of the United States. 

116 



CHESTER A. ARTHUR 117 

Arthur, although one of the most rigid of organization 
and machine men in his days of local leadership, elevated 
the party standards by the men whom he drew around 
himself. He invited into party service and personal in- 
timacy a remarkable body of young, exceedingly able 
and ambitious men. Many of those became distin- 
guished afterwards in public and professional life. The 
ablest of them all was a gentleman who, I think, is now 
universally recognized both at home and abroad as the 
most efficient and accomplished American diplomat and 
lawyer — Elihu Root. 

There is no career so full of dramatic surprises as 
the political. President Hayes put civil-service reform 
upon its feet, and without the assistance of necessary 
laws vigorously enforced its principles. Among the vic- 
tims of his enforcement was General Arthur, whom he re- 
lieved as collector of the port of New York. To the sur- 
prise of every one and the amazement of his old friends, 
one of the first acts of President Arthur was to demand 
the enactment of a civil-service law, which had originated 
with the Civil Service Association, and whose most 
prominent members were George William Curtis and 
Carl Schurz. 

The president's urgency secured the passage of the 
measure. He then appointed a thoroughgoing Civil 
Service Commission, and during his term lived up to 
every requirement of the system. In doing this he alien- 
ated all his old friends, and among them General Grant, 
ex-Senator Conkling, Thomas C. Piatt, and also Mr. 
Blaine, whom he had asked to remain in the Cabinet as 
secretary of state. Among them was also John Sher- 
man, whom he had equally wished to retain as secretary 
of the treasury. 



u8 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

Arthur's administration, both in domestic affairs and 
in its foreign policies, meets the approval of history and 
the impartial judgment of posterity. But he was not 
big enough, nor strong enough, to contend with the pow- 
erful men who were antagonized, especially by his civil- 
service-reform tendencies. When the Republican con- 
vention met in 1884 and nominated a new ticket, it was 
universally recognized by everybody, including the presi- 
dent, that his political career had closed. 

President Arthur was one of the most delightful of 
hosts, and he made the White House the centre of refined 
hospitality and social charm. He was a shrewd analyst 
of human nature and told stories full of humor and dra- 
matic effect of some of his contemporaries. 

General Arthur, while Republican party leader in New 
York, invited me to a dinner given him by a friend who 
had just returned from a hunting trip with a large collec- 
tion of fine game. With the exception of myself, all the 
guests were active leaders in the State machine. 

During the dinner the general said to me: "While we 
draft you every fall to help in our canvass, after we have 
nominated our ticket we miss you in our councils, and 
we need you." 

"Well," I replied, "I do not know what the matter 
is, nor why Senator Conkling should have a continuing 
hostility, which I only feel when the time comes around 
to elect delegates to the State convention." 

The general continued: "We are unable to find out 
either. However, it is absurd, and we are going to see 
that you are a delegate to the national convention, and 
we want you to be at the State convention at Utica." 

I went to Albany, knowing that there would be a con- 
ference at the Executive Mansion, with General Arthur, 



CHESTER A. ARTHUR 119 

Governor Cornell, and Senator Conkling, to lay out a 
programme for the convention. I met the then secretary 
of the State committee, Mr. Johnson, and told him 
about my conversation with General Arthur. He said 
he was going to attend the conference and would report 
to me. 

When Mr. Johnson returned he told me that General 
Arthur, Governor Cornell, and others had strongly urged 
my being a delegate, and that Senator Conkling became 
very indignant and said that he did not want me back 
in the organization, and that it was a matter of indiffer- 
ence on what side I was. It is needless to say that I did 
not attend the convention at Utica. 

Mr. Johnson also told me that among other things 
decided upon was that if General Grant should be nomi- 
nated for a third term, the old machine under Senator 
Conkling would be made stronger than ever; that the 
men who had come to the front during President Hayes's 
administration as members of the State Senate and 
assembly and of Congress would be retired, and that 
another State paper would be established which would 
wipe out the Albany Evening Journal, because it had 
sustained President Hayes and his policies. 

While the convention was in session at Utica I had an 
interview with Mr. George Dawson, who was editor of 
the Albany Evening Journal, and he became convinced 
that he had nothing to lose by entering at once into an 
open antagonism, if there was any way by which it could 
be made effective. 

I said to Mr. Dawson: "The only salvation for those 
who have been benefited during the era of liberty occa- 
sioned by President Hayes's civil-service policies is to 
prevent the national convention adopting the unit rule." 



120 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

The unit rule is that if the majority of the delegates 
from any State make a decision, the chairman of the 
delegation shall cast the entire vote of the delegation 
from the State for the result arrived at by the majority, 
whether it be a candidate or a policy. Under the unit 
rule I have seen a bare majority of one vote for a candi- 
date, and then the chairman of the delegation cast the 
entire vote for the candidate, though the minority were 
very hostile to him. 

The delegates of the State convention at Utica 
returned to Albany that night. Many of them were 
State senators whose decapitation was assured if the 
old machine supported by federal patronage was revived. 
State Senator Webster Wagner was one of them. He 
and I chartered a train and invited the whole State dele- 
gation to go with us to Chicago. In the preliminary 
discussions, before the national convention met, twenty- 
six out of seventy-eight delegates decided to act inde- 
pendently. 

Wayne MacVeagh, a lifelong friend of mine, had a 
strong following in the Pennsylvania delegation, and 
after he learned our position brought over also his 
people. Emory Storrs, who led the Illinois delegation, 
came to me and said that if we would not boom Elihu B. 
Washburne, who was a candidate for the nomination, we 
would have the Illinois vote. The result of the canvass 
was that the convention decided against the unit rule. 
This released so many individual delegates to indepen- 
dent action that the field was cleared and nobody had a 
majority. The leading candidates were General Grant, 
James G. Blaine, and John Sherman. 

In the history of convention oratory the nominating 
speeches of Senator Conkling for General Grant, and 



CHESTER A. ARTHUR 121 

James A. Garfield for John Sherman take the highest 
rank. Conkling took a lofty position on the platform. 
His speech was perfectly prepared, delivered with great 
dramatic effect, and received universal applause on the 
floor and in the gallery. 

General Garfield, on the other hand, also a fine-looking 
man and a practised orator, avoided the dramatic ele- 
ment, in which he could not compete with Conkling, but 
delivered a speech along the line of the average thought 
and general comprehension of his audience that made a 
great impression. It was a common remark: "He has 
nominated himself." 

There were among the audience thousands of Blaine 
enthusiasts. No public man since Lincoln ever had 
such enthusiastic, devoted, and almost crazy followers 
as Mr. Blaine. These enthusiasts were waiting to raise 
the roof and secure the nomination of their candidate 
when the chosen orator should present their favorite. 

The gentleman selected to present Mr. Blaine was 
eminent in business and great enterprises, but I doubt if 
he had ever spoken before except to a board of directors. 
Of course, in that vast hall such a man was fearfully 
handicapped and could not be very well heard. He 
closed by naming his candidate somewhat like this: "I 
now have the pleasure and honor of proposing as the 
candidate of this convention that eminent statesman, 
James S. Blaine." Nearly every one in the convention 
knew that Mr. Blaine's middle name was Gillespie. 

The Blaine followers, whose indignation had been 
growing throughout the speech, because they expected 
the very highest type of oratory for their favorite, 
shouted in chorus, "G., you fool, G. !" 

When General Garfield was voted for, he indignantly 



122 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

repudiated the votes as an imputation upon his honor, 
as he was there to nominate his friend, John Sherman. 
Senator George F. Hoar, of Massachusetts, presided at 
the convention. He interrupted Garfield by calling him 
to order, as it was not in order to interrupt the calling of 
the roll, and he did so for fear that Garfield would go so 
far as to say he would not accept the nomination if it 
were made. On the last ballot State after State, each 
striving to get ahead of the other, changed its vote from 
Sherman or Blaine to Garfield, and he was nominated. 

I sat close to him as a visitor to the Ohio delegation. 
It was a curious exhibit of the ambition of a lifetime 
suddenly and unexpectedly realized by a highly sensitive 
and highly wrought-up man. He was so overcome that 
he practically had to be carried out of the convention by 
his friends. 

Senator Conkling was very indignant at the result and 
expressed his anger with his usual emphasis and pic- 
turesqueness. The Ohio leaders were then anxious to 
placate New York, but Conkling would have nothing to 
do with them. They then came to us, who had been 
opposed to the unit rule, and wanted suggestions as to 
which New Yorker they should select for vice-president. 
Levi P. Morton was suggested. Mr. Morton said he 
would accept if Senator Conkling was willing to agree 
to it, and that he would not act without the senator's 
acquiescence, as he was an organization man. The 
senator refused his consent, and told Mr. Morton that 
no friend of his would go on the ticket. 

It was then suggested that they try General Arthur, 
who was Conkling's first lieutenant and chairman of the 
Republican State Committee of New York. Senator 
Conkling made the same answer to General Arthur, but 



CHESTER A.ARTHUR 123 

he frankly said to Conkling: "Such an honor and oppor- 
tunity comes to very few of the millions of Americans, 
and to that man but once. No man can refuse it, and I 
will not." And so General Arthur was nominated for 
vice-president. 



X 

GROVER CLEVELAND 

Grover Cleveland was a remarkable man. He had 
more political courage of the General Jackson type than 
almost any man who ever held great responsible posi- 
tions. He defied Tammany Hall while governor of the 
State, and repeatedly challenged the strongest elements 
of his party while president. Threats of defeat or retali- 
ation never moved him. If he had once made up his 
mind and believed he was right, no suggestions of expe- 
diency or of popularity had any influence on him. 

In personal intercourse he made friends and had great 
charm. The campaign against him when he ran for 
governor of New York was ruthlessly conducted. I con- 
sidered the actions of his enemies as unfair and that 
they would react in the canvass. I studiously dis- 
credited all in my speeches, and begged our people not 
to feature them. 

I knew Mr. Cleveland, and as an evidence of my 
appreciation of his character and ability, when the office 
of general counsel of the New York Central Railroad at 
Buffalo became vacant, I offered it to him, saying: "I 
am exceedingly anxious that you should accept this 
place. I think, by an adjustment of the administration 
of your office, you can retain your private practice, and 
this will add about fifteen thousand dollars a year to 
your income." 

Mr. Cleveland replied: "I have a very definite plan of 
life and have decided how much work I can do without 

124 



GROVER CLEVELAND 125 

impairing my health, and how much of additional 
responsibility I can assume. I have accumulated about 
seventy-five thousand dollars and my practice yields me 
an income which is sufficient for my wants and a prudent 
addition for my old age to my capital. No amount of 
money whatever would tempt me to add to or increase 
my present work." 

I doubt if there were many lawyers in the United 
States who had that philosophy or control of their ambi- 
tions. His annual income from his profession was con- 
siderably less than the compensation offered by the gen- 
eral counselship of the New York Central. 

Cleveland was most satisfactory as president in his 
quick and decisive judgment upon matters presented to 
him. There were no delays, no revisions; in fact, no 
diplomatic methods of avoiding a disagreeable decision. 
He told you in the briefest time and in the clearest way 
what he would do. 

A great social leader and arbiter in social affairs in 
New York was very desirous that the president should 
reverse his judgment in regard to an appointment affect- 
ing a member of his family. I gave him a letter which 
procured him a personal and confidential interview. 
When he came back to me he said: "That is the most 
extraordinary man I ever saw. After he had heard me 
through, he said he understood the matter thoroughly 
and would not change his opinion or action. He has no 
social position and never had. I tried to present its 
attractions and my ability to help him in that regard, 
but he only laughed; yes, he positively laughed." 

While President Hayes had difficulty with civil-ser- 
vice reform and incurred the hostility of the Republican 
organization and machine men, the situation with him 



126 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

was far less difficult than it was with Cleveland, who 
was a sincere civil-service reformer, and also an earnest 
Democrat. While a Democratic senator from Ohio, Mr. 
Pendleton, had passed a bill during the Hayes adminis- 
tration for reform in the civil service, the great majority 
of the Democratic party believed in Secretary Marcy's 
declaration that "to the victors belong the spoils." 

There was an aggravation, also, growing out of the fact 
that the Democrats had been out of office for twenty- 
four years. We can hardly visualize or conceive now of 
their hunger for office. The rule for rescuing people 
dying of starvation is to feed them in very small quanti- 
ties, and frequently. By trying this, the president be- 
came one of the most unpopular of men who had ever 
held office; in fact, so unpopular among the Democratic 
senators and members of the House that a story which 
Zebulon Vance, of North Carolina, told went all over the 
country and still survives. Vance, who had a large pro- 
portion of the citizens of North Carolina on his waiting 
list, and could get none of them appointed, said that the 
situation, which ought to be one of rejoicing at the elec- 
tion of a president by his own party, was like that of a 
client of his who had inherited a farm from his father. 
There were so many difficulties about the title and get- 
ting possession of it and delay, that the son said: "I 
almost wished father had not died." 

However, Mr. Cleveland, in his deliberate way did 
accomplish the impossible. He largely regained favor 
with his party by satisfying their demands, and at the 
same time so enlarged the scope of civil-service require- 
ments as to receive the commendation of the two great 
leaders of the civil-service movement — George William 
Curtis and Carl Schurz. 



GROVER CLEVELAND 127 

President Cleveland entered upon his second term 
with greater popularity in the country than most of his 
predecessors. When he retired from office, it was prac- 
tically by unanimous consent. It is among the tragedies 
of public life that he lost entirely the confidence of his 
party and, in a measure, of the whole people by render- 
ing to his country the greatest public service. 

A strike of the men on the railroads tied up transpor- 
tation. Railroads are the arteries of travel, commerce, 
and trade. To stop them is to prevent the transporta- 
tion of provisions or of coal, to starve and freeze cities 
and communities. Cleveland used the whole power of 
the federal government to keep free the transportation 
on the railways and to punish as the enemies of the 
whole people those who were trying to stop them. It 
was a lesson which has been of incalculable value ever 
since in keeping open these great highways. 

He forced through the repeal of the silver purchasing 
law by every source and pressure and the unlimited use 
of patronage. His party were almost unanimous for the 
silver standard and resented this repeal as a crime, but 
it saved the country from general bankruptcy. Except 
in the use of patronage to help his silver legislation, he 
offended his party by improving the civil service and 
retaining Theodore Roosevelt as head of the Civil Ser- 
vice Commission. These crises required from the presi- 
dent an extraordinary degree of courage and steadfast- 
ness. 

While Mr. Cleveland was in such unprecedented popu- 
lar disfavor when he retired to private life, his fame as 
president increases through the years, and he is rapidly 
assuming foremost position in the estimation of the 
people. 



128 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

Mr. Cleveland had a peculiar style in his speeches and 
public documents. It was criticised as labored and that 
of an essayist. I asked him, after he had retired to 
private life, how he had acquired it. He said his father 
was a clergyman and he had been educated by him 
largely at home. His father was very particular about 
his compositions and his English, so that he acquired a 
ministerial style. The result of this was that whenever 
any of the members of the local bar died, he was called 
upon to write the obituary resolutions. 

To take a leap over intervening years: After Mr. 
Cleveland retired from his second term I used to meet 
him very frequently on social occasions and formal cele- 
brations. He soon left the practice of law and settled 
in Princeton, where he did great and useful service, until 
he died, as trustee of the university and a lecturer before 
the students. 

Riding in the same carriage with him in the great pro- 
cession at the funeral of General Sherman, he reminisced 
most interestingly in regard to his experiences while 
president. Every little while there would break out a 
cheer and then a shout in the crowd of one of the old 
campaign cries: "Grover, Grover, four years more.*' 
Mr. Cleveland remarked: "I noticed while president a 
certain regularity and recrudescence of popular applause, 
and it was the same in every place I visited." That cry, 
" Grover, Grover, four years more!" would occur every 
third block, and during our long ride the mathematical 
tradition was preserved. 



XI 

BENJAMIN HARRISON 

The year 1888 was one of singular experience for me. 
I was working very hard in my professional duties and 
paying no attention to public affairs. 

The district conventions to send delegates to the 
national convention at Chicago began electing their 
delegates and alternates, and passing resolutions in- 
structing them to vote for me as their candidate for 
president. 

After several districts had thus acted I was asked to 
meet in Whitelaw Reid's office in the Tribune Building 
Thomas C. Piatt, our State leader, and United States 
Senator Frank Hiscock. Piatt demanded to know why 
I was making this canvass without consulting the organ- 
ization or informing them. I told him I was doing 
nothing whatever by letter, telegram, or interview; that 
I had seen no one, and no one had been to see me. 

Mr. Piatt, who had been all his life accomplishing 
things through the organization, was no believer in 
spontaneous uprisings, and asked me frankly: "Are you 
a candidate?" I told him I was not, because I did not 
believe I could be nominated with the present condition 
of the public mind in regard to railways, and I was presi- 
dent of one of the largest systems. 

Then it was suggested that I permit the Tribune, 

which was the party organ, to state that I was not a 

candidate and did not want to be. The next morning 

the Tribune had that fully explained. The conventions 

129 



130 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

kept on convening and instructing their delegates the 
same way. 

Another conference was called, and then I was asked 
to make the statement that if nominated I would not 
accept, and if elected I would decline. I said to my 
conferees: "Gentlemen, there is no American living big 
enough to say that. In the first place, it is gross egotism 
to think such a thing might happen." The result was 
that the organization accepted the situation. 

The only way that I can account for this unanimous 
action of the party in its conventions in the congressional 
districts of the State is the accumulative result of appre- 
ciation of unselfish work for the party. Every fall, for 
a quarter of a century, I had been on the platform in 
every part of the State, and according to my means was 
a contributor to the State and local canvass. During 
this period I had asked nothing and would accept noth- 
ing. If I may apply so large a phrase to a matter so 
comparatively unimportant, I would deny the often 
quoted maxim that "republics are ungratefuI.' , 

When the convention met there was an overwhelming 
sentiment for Mr. Blaine, but his refusal was positive 
and absolute. I had always been a warm supporter and 
friend of Mr. Blaine, and his followers were very friendly 
to me. 

What were called "the Granger States," and especially 
Iowa, had become very hostile to railway management 
and railway men. They were passing laws which were 
practically confiscatory of railway securities. The com- 
mittees from those States visited all other State delega- 
tions and spoke in bitter terms of my candidacy. The 
strength of my candidacy was that New York was unani- 
mously for me, except for one vote from New York 



BENJAMIN HARRISON 131 

City, and no nominee could hope to be elected unless he 
could carry New York. 

After receiving ninety-nine votes, I found that on the 
next ballot my vote would be very largely increased, and 
decided to retire. I called together the New York dele- 
gation and stated my position, and the reason for it. A 
considerable debate took place. The motion was made 
and unanimously carried that the four delegates at large 
should meet and see if they could agree upon a candidate 
who would command the support of the entire delegation 
of the State. The object was, of course, to make the 
State, with its larger number of delegates than any other 
commonwealth, a deciding factor in the selection. 

The delegates at large were: Thomas C. Piatt, Senator 
Frank Hiscock, Warner Miller, and myself. When we 
met, Piatt and Hiscock declared for Senator Allison of 
Iowa. Warner Miller with equal warmth announced 
that he was for John Sherman. 

A heated controversy arose between Mr. Piatt and 
Mr. Miller, during which Mr. Piatt said that neither 
he nor any of his friends would vote for Sherman if he 
was nominated. Senator Hiscock, who was always a 
pacifier, interrupted them, saying: "Mr. Depew has said 
nothing as yet. I suggest that we hear his views." 

Mr. Piatt and Mr. Miller responded to this suggestion 
and I replied: "Gentlemen, New York has given to me 
its cordial and practically unanimous support, and I 
have felt under the circumstances that I should follow 
and not lead. The situation which has grown out of this 
discussion here eliminates two candidates. Without the 
aid of Senator Piatt and his friends, Mr. Sherman could 
not carry New York. Iowa has gone to the extreme of 
radical legislation which threatens the investment in 



1 32 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

securities of her railroads, and New York is such a capi- 
talistic State that no man identified with that legisla- 
tion could carry a majority of the vote of its people, and 
that makes Allison impossible. There is one candidate 
here who at present apparently has no chance, but who, 
nevertheless, seems to me to possess more popular quali- 
fications than any other, and that is General Benjamin 
Harrison, of Indiana. I do not know him, never met 
him, but he rose from the humblest beginnings until he 
became the leader of the bar of his State. He enlisted 
in the Civil War as a second lieutenant, and by con- 
spicuous bravery and skill upon the battle-field came out 
as brigadier-general. As United States senator he be- 
came informed about federal affairs. His grandfather, 
President William H. Harrison, had one of the most pic- 
turesque campaigns in our history. There are enough 
survivors of that 'hard cider and log cabin' canvass to 
make an attractive contribution on the platform at every 
meeting, and thus add a certain historic flavor to Gen- 
eral Harrison's candidacy." 

After some discussion the other three agreed. We 
reported our conclusion to the delegation, which by an 
overwhelming majority assented to the conclusions of 
the four delegates at large. This decision settled the 
question in the convention, and after a few ballots Gen- 
eral Harrison was nominated. New York was awarded 
the vice-presidency and selected Levi P. Morton. 

During Harrison's administration I was absorbed in 
my duties as president of the New York Central Rail- 
road, and was seldom in Washington. But soon after 
his inauguration he sent to me a member of Congress 
from Indiana with a special message. This congressman 
said: "I come from President Harrison, and he has in- 



BENJAMIN HARRISON 133 

structed me to offer you a place in his Cabinet. He is 
anxious to have you in his official family." 

I told him that I was not prepared to enter public life, 
and while I was exceedingly gratified by the offer, it was 
impossible for me to accept. 

The congressman said: "I am a poor man, but cannot 
understand how anybody can refuse to be member of 
the Cabinet of the President of the United States. If 
such an offer was made to me, and the conditions of our 
overruling Providence were that I and my family should 
live in want and poverty for the rest of our lives, I would 
accept without hesitation." 

I had met Benjamin Harrison as we passed through 
Indianapolis on business during the canvass, for the first 
time. I was much impressed with him, but his auster- 
ity appeared to those who called upon him while pres- 
ent upon official business. I found him one of the most 
genial and agreeable of men, and this impression was 
intensified when I met him at the White House. At his 
own table and family dinners he was one of the most 
charming of hosts. He had, unfortunately, a repellent 
manner and a harsh voice. In meeting those who came 
to him for official favors this made him one of the most 
unpopular presidents with senators and members of the 
House of Representatives. 

On the platform as a public speaker he had few equals. 
He was most lucid and convincing, and had what few 
orators possess, which was of special use to him in cam- 
paigning and touring the country as president, the 
ability to make a fresh speech every day and each a 
good one. It was a talent of presenting questions from 
many angles, each of which illuminated his subject and 
captivated his audience. It was said of him by a sen- 



134 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

ator who was his friend, and the remark is quoted by 
Senator Hoar, that if he spoke to an audience of ten 
thousand people, he would make every one of them his 
friend, but if he were introduced to each of them after- 
wards, each would depart his enemy. I think that his 
manner, which was so unfortunate, came from the fact 
that his career had been one of battle, from his early 
struggles to his triumphant success. 

A short time before the national convention met in 
1892 Senator Frank Hiscock came to me and said that 
President Harrison had requested him to ask me to lead 
his forces on the floor in the convention. I said to him 
that I was a loyal organization man and did not want 
to quarrel with our leader, Senator Piatt. Then he told 
me that he had seen Piatt, who remarked that no one 
could help Harrison, and that I would conduct the cam- 
paign in better spirit than any one, and so he had no 
objection to my accepting the position. There was one 
obstacle which I wished removed. I was devoted to Mr. 
Blaine and not only was one of his political supporters 
but very fond of him personally. Mr. Blaine happened 
to be in the city, and I immediately called upon him. 
His health was then very bad. 

"Mr. Blaine," I said to him, "if you are a candidate, 
you know I will support you with the greatest of plea- 
sure, but if not, then I will accept the invitation of the 
president." 

Mr. Blaine was most cordial. He said that he had no 
objections whatever to my taking the commission, but 
he doubted if the president could be renominated, and 
that he could not be re-elected if nominated. Harrison 
had made an excellent president, but his manner of treat- 
ing people who came to him had filled the country with 



BENJAMIN HARRISON 135 

bitter and powerful enemies, while his friends were very 
few. 

Then he mentioned several other possible candidates, 
but evidently doubted the success of the Republican 
party in the election. In regard to himself he said: "If 
I should accept the nomination I could not endure the 
labors of the canvass and its excitements. It would kill 
me." That diagnosis of his condition was correct and 
was demonstrated by the fact that he died soon after 
the election, but long before he could be inaugurated if 
elected. 

All organization leaders of the party were united 
against the nomination of President Harrison. The 
leaders were Piatt, Quay, and Clarkson, who was also 
chairman of the national committee. They were the 
greatest masters of organization and of its management 
we ever had in politics, especially Piatt and Quay. 
Their methods were always secret, so I decided that 
the only hope of success for President Harrison was in 
the greatest publicity. 

The position I had accepted soon became known, and 
I began to give the fullest interviews, each one an argu- 
ment for the renomination of the president. I went to 
Chicago a few days in advance of the convention, was 
met there by correspondents of the press, some fifty of 
them, and gave them a talk in a body, which made a 
broadside in the morning papers, each correspondent 
treating it in his own way, as his own individual in- 
terview. 

This statement or, rather, argument, was intended to 
be read and succeeded in being so by the delegates from 
everywhere who were on their way to the convention and 
had to pass through Chicago. The convention was held 



136 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

in Minneapolis. I received from that city an invitation to 
address a gathering of New Yorkers who had settled in 
the West to speak before two patriotic audiences, and 
to make the address at the dedication of the great hall 
where the convention was to meet. 

It was evident that before these engagements had been 
concluded, every delegate would have attended some of 
these meetings, and, therefore, with the relationship be- 
tween a speaker and his audience, I would be practically 
the only man in the convention who was personally 
known to every member. This relationship was an 
enormous benefit in conducting the canvass. 

The great organization leaders were difficult of access 
and carried on their campaign through trusted members 
of each State delegation. My rooms were wide open for 
everybody. On account of the conflicting statements 
made by members of the State delegations, it was very 
difficult to make an accurate and detailed list of those 
who were for the president, and those who were for Mr. 
Blaine. It occurred to me that it would help to call a 
meeting of the Harrison delegates. Many thought it 
was hazardous, as it might develop a majority the other 
way. 

The meeting was attended, however, by every dele- 
gate, those opposed coming out of curiosity. Taking the 
chair, I asked some member of each delegation to arise 
and state how many votes he believed could be relied 
upon from his State. Of course the statement of each 
delegate was often loudly challenged by others from his 
State who were present. When the result was announced 
it showed a majority of three for General Harrison. A 
veteran campaigner begged me to announce it as fifty, 
but I refused. "No," I said, "the closeness of the vote 



BENJAMIN HARRISON 137 

when there is every opportunity for manipulation would 
carry conviction." 

An old gentleman who stood beside me had a gold- 
headed ebony cane. I seized it and rapped it on the 
table with such force that it broke in two and announced 
that the figures showed absolute certainty of President 
Harrison's renomination. I doubt if there was a reli- 
able majority, but the announcement of this result 
brought enough of those always anxious to get on the 
band-wagon to make it certain. 

Soon after arriving home I received a letter from the 
owner of the cane. He wrote: "I was very angry when 
you broke my cane. It was a valued birthday present 
from my children. It is now in a glass case in my 
library, and on the case is this label: 'This cane nomi- 
nated a president of the United States.' " 

Mr. McKinley, then Governor of Ohio, presided at the 
convention. I stood close beside him when I made my 
speech for Harrison's renomination. While thoroughly 
prepared, the speech was in a way extemporaneous to 
meet calls or objections. In the midst of a sentence Mc- 
Kinley said to me in a loud voice: "You are making a 
remarkably fine speech." The remark threw me off my 
balance as an opposition would never have done. I lost 
the continuity and came near breaking down, but hap- 
pily the applause gave me time to get again upon the 
track. 

Among my colleagues in the New York delegation was 
James W. Husted. General Husted was very ill and un- 
able to leave his room during the convention. He sent 
for me one morning and said: "I have just had a call 
from Governor McKinley. He says that you have the 
power to nominate him, and that Harrison cannot be 



138 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

nominated. If you will direct the Harrison forces for 
him, he will be the next president." 

I told Husted I was enlisted for the war and, while 
having a great admiration for McKinley, it was impos- 
sible. 

Soon after arriving home I received an invitation from 
the president to visit him at Washington. I took the 
night train, arriving there in the morning. My appoint- 
ment was to lunch with him. 

During the morning Stephen B. Elkins, then secretary 
of war, called and asked me to take a walk. While we 
were walking he told me that the president was going to 
offer me the secretaryship of state, in succession to Mr. 
Blaine, and that I ought to accept. He then led me to 
the State Department and pointed to the portraits on 
the walls of the different secretaries, commencing with 
Thomas Jefferson. Elkins said that to be in that list 
was a greater distinction than to be on the walls of the 
White House, because these men are of far greater emi- 
nence. 

After luncheon the president invited me into the 
Blue Room, and with a great deal of emotion said: "You 
are the only man who has ever unselfishly befriended me. 
It was largely through your efforts that I became presi- 
dent, and I am greatly indebted to you for my renomi- 
nation. I have tried my best to show my appreciation 
by asking you into my Cabinet and otherwise, but you 
have refused everything I have heretofore offered. I 
now want to give you the best I have, which is secretary 
of state. It is broken bread, because if I am not re- 
elected it will be only till the 4th of March, but if I am 
re-elected it will be for four years more. I personally 
want you in my Cabinet." 



BENJAMIN HARRISON 139 

I told the president it was impossible for me to accept; 
that even if I resigned my presidency of the railroad, 
coming directly from that position would bring the rail- 
road question, which was very acute, into the canvass. 
He said he did not think there was anything in that, but 
I realized that if he was defeated his defeat would be 
charged to having made that mistake. 

He then said: "Well, how about it if I am re-elected?" 
I told him that I would regard the appointment the 
greatest of honors, and the associations the most plea- 
surable of a lifetime. 

"Very well," he said; "I will appoint Mr. John W. 
Foster, who has been doing excellent service for the 
State Department, until next 4th of March, and you can 
prepare to come here upon that date." 

The most painful thing that was connected with the 
canvass at Minneapolis before the convention was the 
appearance of Mr. Blaine as a candidate. He had re- 
signed from the Cabinet and yielded to the pressure of 
his friends to become a candidate. 

Notwithstanding my interview and what he had said, 
he sent no word whatever to me, and personally I had 
no information and no notification that his candidacy 
was authorized by himself. What gave, however, much 
authority to the statement that he would accept the 
nomination was the appearance of his son, Emmons, 
among those who were endeavoring to bring it about. 

There has never been a statesman in our public life, 
except Henry Clay, who had such devoted friends as 
Mr. Blaine. While Henry Clay never reached the presi- 
dency and was fairly defeated in his attempt, there is no 
doubt that Mr. Blaine was elected in 1884, and that 
notwithstanding the Burchard misfortune, he would still 



i 4 o CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

have been a victor except for transparent frauds in New 
York. 

General Harrison was by far the ablest and profound- 
est lawyer among our presidents. None of them equalled 
him as an orator. His State papers were of a very high 
order. When history sums up the men who have held 
the great place of president of the United States, General 
Harrison will be among the foremost. 

He retired from office, like many of our presidents, a 
comparatively poor man. After retirement he entered 
at once upon the practice of his profession of the law 
and almost immediately became recognized as one of 
the leaders of the American bar. 



XII 

JAMES G. BLAINE 

I have spoken in every national canvass, beginning 
with 1856. It has been an interesting experience to be 
on the same platform as an associate speaker with nearly 
every man in the country who had a national reputation. 
Most of them had but one speech, which was very long, 
elaborately prepared, and so divided into sections, each 
complete in itself, that the orator was equipped for an 
address of any length, from fifteen minutes to four hours, 
by selection or consolidation of these sections. Few of 
them would trust themselves to extemporaneous speak- 
ing. The most versatile and capable of those who could 
was James G. Blaine. He was always ready, courted 
interruptions, and was brilliantly effective. In a few 
sentences he had captured his audience and held them 
enthralled. No public man in our country, except, per- 
haps, Henry Clay, had such devoted following. 

Mr. Blaine had another extraordinary gift, which is 
said to belong only to kings; he never forgot any one. 
Years after an introduction he would recall where he had 
first met the stranger and remember his name. This 
compliment made that man Blaine's devoted friend for 
life. 

I had an interesting experience of his readiness and 

versatility when he ran for president in 1884. He asked 

me to introduce him at the different stations, where he 

was to deliver long or short addresses. After several of 

these occasions, he asked: "What's the next station, 

141 



142 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

Chauncey?" I answered: "Peekskill." "Well," he 
said, "what is there about Peekskill?'* "I was born 
there," I answered. 'Well," he said, rising, "I always 
thought that you were born at Poughkeepsie." "No, 
Peekskill." Just then we were running into the sta- 
tion, and, as the train stopped, I stepped forward to in- 
troduce him to the great crowd which had gathered there 
from a radius of fifty miles. He pushed me back in a 
very dramatic way, and shouted: "Fellow citizens, allow 
me to make the introduction here. As I have many 
times in the last quarter of a century travelled up and 
down your beautiful Hudson River, with its majestic 
scenery made famous by the genius of Washington Irv- 
ing, and upon the floating palaces not equalled anywhere 
else in the world, or when the steamer has passed through 
this picturesque bay and opposite your village, I have 
had emotions of tenderness and loving memories, greater 
than those impressed by any other town, because I have 
said to myself: 'There is the birthplace of one of my 
best friends, Chauncey Depew.'" 

Local committees who desire to use the candidate to 
help the party in their neighborhood and also their 
county tickets are invariably most unreasonable and 
merciless in their demands upon the time of the candi- 
date. They know perfectly well that he has to speak 
many times a day; that there is a limit to his strength 
and to his vocal cords, and yet they will exact from 
him an effort which would prevent his filling other en- 
gagements, if they possibly can. This was notoriously 
the case during Mr. Blaine's trip through the State of 
New York and afterwards through the country. The 
strain upon him was unprecedented, and, very naturally, 
he at times showed his irritation and some temper. 



JAMES G. BLAINE 143 

The local committees would do their best with the 
railroad company and with Blaine's managers in New 
York to prolong his stay and speech at each station. He 
would be scheduled according to the importance of the 
place for five, ten, fifteen, twenty, or thirty minutes. 

Before we reached Albany he asked me to accompany 
him to the end of our line at Buffalo, and make the in- 
troduction as usual at the stations. The committee 
would sometimes succeed in changing the programme 
and make the stays longer at their several places. Mr. 
Blaine's arrangement with me was that after he had 
decided how long he would speak, I should fill up the 
time, whether it was longer or shorter. That would 
often enlarge my speech, but I was young and vigorous 
and had no responsibilities. 

I remember one committee, where the train was sched- 
uled for ten minutes, succeed in having it delayed an 
hour, and instead of a brief address from the platform 
of the car, carried the presidential party to a stand in 
the central square where many thousands had gathered. 
In the first place, this city was not on Mr. Blaine's 
schedule, and as it was late in the afternoon, after a 
fatiguing day, he therefore told the committee peremp- 
torily that ten minutes was his limit. Then he said to 
me: "Chauncey, you will have to fill out the hour." 

Mr. Blaine's wonderful magnetism, the impression he 
made upon every one, and his tactful flattery of local 
pride, did a great deal to remove the prejudices against 
him, which were being fomented by a propaganda of 
a "mugwump" committee in New York. This propa- 
ganda, as is usually the case, assailed his personal in- 
tegrity. 

Notwithstanding the predictions made at the time, he 



144 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

was nominated, and it was subsequently repeated that 
he would not carry New York. From my own experi- 
ence of many years with the people of the State and from 
the platform view-point, I felt confident that he would 
have a majority in the election. 

It was a few days before the close of the canvass, 
when I was in the western part of the State, I received 
an urgent telegram from Mr. Blaine to join him on the 
train, which was to leave the Grand Central Station in 
New York early next morning for his tour of New Eng- 
land. Upon arrival I was met by a messenger, who 
took me at once to Mr. Blaine's car, which started a few 
minutes afterwards. 

There was an unusual excitement in the crowd, which 
was speedily explained. The best account Mr. Blaine 
gave me himself in saying: "I felt decidedly that every- 
thing was well in New York. It was against my judg- 
ment to return here. Our national committee, how- 
ever, found that a large body of Protestant clergymen 
wanted to meet me and extend their support. They 
thought this would offset the charges made by the * mug- 
wump* committee. I did not believe that any such 
recognition was necessary. However, their demands for 
my return and to meet this body became so importunate 
that I yielded my own judgment. 

" I was engaged in my room with the committee and 
other visitors when I was summoned to the lobby of the 
hotel to meet the clergymen. I had prepared no speech; 
in fact, had not thought up a reply. When their spokes- 
man, Reverend Doctor Burchard, began to address me, 
my only hope was that he would continue long enough 
for me to prepare an appropriate response. I had a very 
definite idea of what he would say and so paid little 



JAMES G. BLAINE 145 

attention to his speech. In the evening the reporters 
began rushing in and wanted my opinion of Doctor 
Burchard's statement that the main issue of the cam- 
paign was 'Rum, Romanism, and Rebellion.' If I had 
heard him utter these words, I would have answered at 
once, and that would have been effective, but I am still 
in doubt as to what to say about it now. The situation 
is very difficult, and almost anything I say is likely to 
bitterly offend one side or the other. Now I want you 
to do all the introductions and be beside me to-day as 
far as possible. I have become doubtful about every- 
body and you are always sure-footed." I have treasured 
that compliment ever since. 

As we rode through the streets of New Haven the 
Democrats had placed men upon the tops of the houses 
on either side, and they threw out in the air thousands of 
leaflets, charging Blaine with having assented to the 
issue which Doctor Burchard had put out — "Rum, 
Romanism, and Rebellion." They so filled the air that 
it seemed a shower, and littered the streets. 

A distinguished Catholic prelate said to me: "We had 
to resent an insult like that, and I estimate that the 
remark has changed fifty thousand votes." I know per- 
sonally of about five thousand which were changed in 
our State, but still Blaine lost New York and the presi- 
dency by a majority against him of only one thousand 
one hundred and forty-nine votes. 

Whenever I visited Washington I always called upon 
Mr. Blaine. The fascination of the statesman and his 
wonderful conversational power made every visit an 
event to be remembered. On one occasion he said to 
me: "Chauncey, I am in very low spirits to-day. I 
have read over the first volume of my 'Twenty Years in 



146 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

Congress,' which is just going to the printer, and de- 
stroyed it. I dictated the whole of it, but I find that 
accuracy and elegance can only be had at the end of a 
pen. I shall rewrite the memoirs in ink. In these days 
composition by the typewriter or through the stenogra- 
pher is so common." There will be many who differ 
with Mr. Blaine. 



XIII 

WILLIAM McKINLEY 

In the canvass of 1896 the Republican organization of 
the State of New York decided, if possible, to have the 
national convention nominate Levi P. Morton for presi- 
dent. Mr. Morton won popular favor as vice-president, 
and the canvass for him looked hopeful. But a new man 
of extraordinary force and ability came into this cam- 
paign, and that man was Mark Hanna, of Ohio. Mr. 
Hanna was one of the most successful of our business 
men. He had a rare genius for organization, and pos- 
sessed resourcefulness, courage, and audacity. He was 
most practical and at the same time had imagination and 
vision. While he had taken very little part in public 
affairs, he had rather suddenly determined to make his 
devoted friend, William McKinley, president of the 
United States. 

In a little while every State in tne Union felt the force 
of Mr. Hanna's efforts. He applied to politics the 
methods by which he had so successfully advanced his 
large manufacturing interests. McKinley clubs and Mc- 
Kinley local organizations sprang up everywhere under 
the magic of Hanna's management. When the conven- 
tion met it was plain that McKinley's nomination was 
assured. 

The New York delegation, however, decided to pre- 
sent Morton's name and submit his candidacy to a vote. 
I was selected to make a nominating speech. If there is 
any hope, an orator on such an occasion has inspiration. 

147 



148 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

But if he knows he is beaten he cannot put into his effort 
the fire necessary to impress an audience. It is not pos- 
sible to speak with force and effect unless you have faith 
in your cause. 

After Mr. McKinley was nominated I moved that the 
nomination be made unanimous. The convention called 
for speech and platform so insistently that their call had 
to be obeyed. The following is an account from a news- 
paper of that date of my impromptu speech. The story 
which is mentioned in the speech was told to me as I 
was ascending the platform by Senator Proctor of 
Vermont. 

"I am in the happy position now of making a speech 
for the man who is going to be elected. (Laughter and 
applause.) It is a great thing for an amateur, when his 
first nomination has failed, to come in and second the 
man who has succeeded. New York is here with no 
bitter feeling and with no disappointment. We recog- 
nize that the waves have submerged us, but we have 
bobbed up serenely. (Loud laughter.) It was a can- 
non from New York that sounded first the news of 
McKinley's nomination. They said of Governor Mor- 
ton's father that he was a New England clergyman, who 
brought up a family of ten children on three hundred 
dollars a year, and was, notwithstanding, gifted in 
prayer. (Laughter.) It does not make any difference 
how poor he may be, how out of work, how ragged, how 
next door to a tramp anybody may be in the United 
States to-night, he will be 'gifted in prayer* at the re- 
sult of this convention. (Cheers and laughter.) 

"There is a principle dear to the American heart. It 
is the principle which moves American spindles, starts 
the industries, and makes the wage-earners sought for, 



WILLIAM McKINLEY 149 

instead of seeking employment. That principle is em- 
bodied in McKinley. His personality explains the nomi- 
nation to-day. And his personality will carry into the 
presidential chair the aspirations of the voters of Amer- 
ica, of the families of America, of the homes of America, 
protection to American industry and America for Ameri- 
cans." (Cheers.) 

As every national convention, like every individual, 
has its characteristics, the peculiar distinction of the 
Republican convention of 1896 was its adoption of the 
gold standard of value. An amazing and illuminating 
part of our political literature of that time is the claim 
which various statesmen and publicists make to the 
authorship of the gold plank in the platform. 

Senator Foraker, who was chairman of the committee 
on resolutions, devotes a considerable part of his interest- 
ing autobiography to the discussion of this question. He 
is very severe upon all those who claim to have origi- 
nated the idea. I have been asked by several statesmen 
to enforce their claims to its authorship. 

The silver craze had not yet subsided. Bimetallism 
had strong advocates and believers in our convention. I 
think even our candidate was not fully convinced at that 
time of the wisdom of the declaration. It went into the 
platform rather as a venture than an article of faith, but 
to the surprise of both the journalists and campaign 
orators, it turned out that the people had become con- 
verted to the gold standard, and it proved to be the 
strongest and most popular declaration of the con- 
vention. 

When the campaign opened the genius of Mark Hanna 
soon became evident. He organized a campaign of edu- 
cation such as had never been dreamed of, much less 



i 5 o CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

attempted. Travelling publicity agents, with wagon- 
loads of pamphlets, filled the highways and the byways, 
and no home was so isolated that it did not receive its 
share. Columns in the newspapers, especially the coun- 
try papers, were filled with articles written by experts, 
and the platform was never so rich with public speakers. 

Such a campaign is irresistible. Its influence is felt by 
everybody; its arguments become automatically and al- 
most insensibly the common language of the people. 
But the expense is so terrific that it will never again be 
attempted. There was no corruption or purchase of 
votes in Mr. Hanna's management. It was publicity 
and again publicity, but it cost nearly five millions of 
dollars. To reach the one hundred and ten million of 
people in the United States in such a way would involve 
a sum so vast that public opinion would never permit 
any approach to it.. 

Mr. McKinley's front-porch campaign was a pictur- 
esque and captivating feature. The candidate was a 
handsome man and an eloquent speaker, with a cordial 
and sympathetic manner which won everybody. Dele- 
gations from all parts of the country and representing 
every phase of American life appeared at Mr. McKin- 
ley's residence. His address to them was always appro- 
priate and his reception made the visitors his fast friends. 

I received a personal request to visit him, and on the 
occasion he said to me: "In certain large agricultural 
sections there is a very dangerous revolt in our party, 
owing to the bad conditions among the farmers. Wheat 
and corn are selling below the cost of production. I 
wish you would go down among them and make speeches 
explaining the economic conditions which have produced 
this result, and how we propose to and will remedy it." 



WILLIAM McKINLEY 151 

"Mr. McKinley," I said, "my position as a railroad 
president, I am afraid, would antagonize them." 

"On the contrary, your very position will draw the 
largest audiences and receive the greater attention." 

The result proved that he was correct. 

I recall one meeting in particular. There were thou- 
sands present, all farmers. In the midst of my speech 
one man arose and said: "Chauncey Depew, we appre- 
ciate your coming here, and we are very anxious to hear 
you. Your speech is very charming and interesting, but 
I want to put this to you personally. We here are suf- 
fering from market conditions for the products of our 
farms. The prices are so low that we have difficulty in 
meeting the interest on our mortgages and paying our 
taxes, no matter how seriously we economize. Now you 
are the president of one of the greatest railroads in the 
country. It is reported that you are receiving a salary 
of fifty thousand dollars a year. You are here in a 
private car. Don't you think that the contrast between 
you and us makes it difficult for us poor farmers to give 
you the welcome which we would like?" 

I saw at once I had lost my audience. I then ven- 
tured upon a statement of conditions which I have often 
tried and always successfully. I said: "My friend, what 
you say about me is true. Now, as to my career, I was 
born and brought up in a village similar to the one which 
is near you here. My father gave me my education and 
nothing else with which to begin life. As a young law- 
yer I was looking for clients and not for office. I made 
up my mind that there were no opportunities offered in 
the village, but that the chances of success were in the 
service of corporations. The result is that I have 
accomplished what you have described. Now, my 



i 5 2 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

friend, I believe that you have a promising boy. I also 
believe that to your pride and satisfaction he is going 
through the neighboring college here, and that you 
intend on account of his brightness and ability to make 
him a lawyer. When he is admitted to the bar, do you 
expect him to try to do what I have accomplished and 
make an independent position in life, or fail?" 

The farmer shouted: "Chauncey, you are all right. 
Go ahead and keep it up." 

My arguments and presentation were no better than 
many another speaker's, but, as Mr. McKkiley predicted, 
they received an attention and aroused a discussion, be- 
cause of what the old farmer had said, that no other 
campaigner could command. 

Mr. McKinley sent for me again and said: "Sentiment 
is a wonderful force in politics. Mr. Bryan, my oppo- 
nent, has made a remarkable speaking tour through our 
State. He started in the early morning from Cleveland 
with a speech. His train made many stops on the way 
to Cincinnati, where he arrived in the evening, and at 
each place he addressed large audiences, traversing the 
State from one side to the other. His endurance and 
versatility have made a great impression upon our peo- 
ple. * To meet and overcome that impression, I have 
asked you to come here and repeat Bryan's effort. You 
are so much older than he is — I think we may claim 
nearly twice his age — that if you can do it, and I hope 
you can, that sentiment will be dissipated." 

I traversed Mr. Bryan's route, stopped at the same 
stations and delivered speeches to similar audiences of 
about the same length. On arriving in Cincinnati in the 
evening I was met by a committee, the chairman of 
which said: "We have followed you all along from Cleve- 



WILLIAM McKINLEY 153 

land, where you started at seven o'clock this morning, 
and it is fine. Now Mr. Bryan, when he arrived here, 
had no meeting. We have seven thousand people in the 
Music Hall, and if you will go there and speak five min- 
utes it will make your trip a phenomenal success." 

I went to the Music Hall, of course had a wonderful 
time and wild ovation, and spoke for an hour. The 
next day I was none the worse for this twelve hours' 
experience. 

President McKinley had spent most of his life in the 
House of Representatives. He loved the associations 
and life of Congress. The most erratic and uncertain 
of bodies is Congress to an executive who does not 
understand its temper and characteristics. McKinley 
was past master of this. Almost every president has 
been greatly relieved when Congress adjourned, but Mr. 
McKinley often expressed to me his wish that Congress 
would always be in session, as he never was so happy 
as when he could be in daily contact with it. His door 
was open at all times to a senator or a member of the 
House of Representatives. If either failed to see him 
at least once a week, the absentee usually received a 
message stating that the president desired him to call. 
He was very keen in discovering any irritation on the 
part of any senator or member about any disappoint- 
ment or fancied slight, and always most tactfully man- 
aged to straighten the matter out. He was quite as 
attentive and as particular with the opposition as with 
members of his own party. 

President McKinley had a wonderful way of dealing 
with office-seekers and with their friends and supporters. 
A phrase of his became part of the common language of 
the capital. It was: "My dear fellow, I am most anxious 



154 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

to oblige you, but I am so situated that I cannot give 
you what you want. I will, however, try to find you 
something equally as good." The anxious caller for 
favors, if he or his congressman failed to get the office 
desired, always carried away a flower or a bouquet given 
by the president, with a complimentary remark to be 
remembered. It soon came to be understood among 
applicants for office that a desired consulship in England 
could not be granted, but one of equal rank in South 
Africa was possible. 

There were many good stories in the Senate of his tact 
in dealing with the opposition. A Southern senator, who 
as a general had made a distinguished record in the Civil 
War on the Confederate side, was very resentful and 
would frequently remark to his friends "that our presi- 
dent unfortunately is not a gentleman, and in his ances- 
try is some very common blood." 

Mr. McKinley persuaded some of the senator's South- 
ern colleagues to bring him to the White House. He ex- 
pressed his regret to the senator that he should have 
offended him in any way and asked what he had done. 
The senator replied: "You have appointed for the town 
where my sister lives a nigger, and a bad nigger at that, 
for postmaster, and my sister has to go to him for her 
letters and stamps." The president arranged for the 
transfer of this postmaster and the appointment of a 
man recommended by the senator. The senator then 
went to his friends and said: "Have I remarked to you 
at any time that our president was not a gentleman and 
had somewhere in his ancestry very common blood? If 
I did I recall the statement and apologize. Mr. McKin- 
ley is a perfect gentleman." 

All the measures which the president wished passed, 



WILLIAM McKINLEY 155 

unless they were absolutely partisan, always received 
afterwards the support of the Southern senator. 

I was in the Senate during a part of his term and 
nearly every day at the White House, where his recep- 
tion was so cordial and his treatment of the matter pre- 
sented so sympathetic that it was a delight to go there, 
instead of being, as usual, one of the most disagreeable 
tasks imposed upon a senator. 

He had a way of inviting one to a private conference 
and with impressing you with its confidential character 
and the trust he reposed in your advice and judgment 
which was most flattering. 

Entertainments at the White House were frequent, 
and he managed to make each dinner an event to be 
most pleasantly remembered. I think, while he was 
very courteous to everybody, he was more than usually 
so to me because of an incident prior to his inauguration. 

A well-known journalist came to my office one day 
and said: "I am just from Canton, where I have been 
several days with the president. I discussed with him 
federal appointments — among others, the mission to 
England, in which I am interested because my father is 
an Englishman, and both my father and I are exceed- 
ingly anxious to have you take the post, and Mr. Mc- 
Kinley authorized me to ask you if you would accept the 



mission." 



The embassy to England presented peculiar attrac- 
tion to me, because I knew personally the Prince of 
Wales and most of the leading English statesmen and 
public men. The journalist said that if I accepted he 
would sound the press. This he did, and the response 
was most flattering from journals of all political views. 

About the time of the inauguration Vice-President 



156 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

Hobart, who was a cordial friend of mine, said to me: 
"There is something wrong about you with the president. 
It is very serious, and you can expect no recognition from 
the administration." I was wholly at a loss to account 
for the matter and would not investigate any further. 
Not long afterwards the vice-president came to me and 
said: "I have found out the truth of that matter of 
yours and have explained it satisfactorily to the presi- 
dent, who deeply regrets that he was misled by a false 
report from a friend in whom he had confidence." Soon 
after the president made me the offer of the mission to 
Germany. I did not understand the language and felt 
that I could be of little service there, and so declined. 

When President McKinley was lying seriously wounded 
at Buffalo from the shot of the anarchist Czolgosz, I 
went there to see if anything could be done for his com- 
fort. For some time there was hope he would recover, 
and that it would be better for him to go to Washington. 
I made every arrangement to take him to the capital if 
the doctors decided it could be done. But suddenly, as 
is always the case with wounds of that kind, a crisis 
arrived in which he died. 

Vice-President Roosevelt was camping in the Adiron- 
dacks. A message reached him, and the next morning 
he arrived in Buffalo. The Cabinet of Mr. McKinley 
decided that the vice-president should be at once in- 
augurated as president. Colonel Roosevelt was a guest 
at the house of Mr. Ainsley Wilcox. He invited me to 
witness his inauguration, which occurred the same eve- 
ning. It was a small company gathered in the parlor of 
Mr. Wilcox's house. Elihu Root, secretary of state, 
choking with emotion and in a voice full of tears, made 
a speech which was a beautiful tribute to the dead 



WILLIAM McKINLEY 157 

president and a clear statement of the necessity of imme- 
diate action to avoid an interregnum in the government. 
John Raymond Hazel, United States district judge, ad- 
ministered the oath, and the new president delivered a 
brief and affecting answer to Mr. Root's address. 

This inauguration was in pathetic and simple contrast 
to that which had preceded at the Capitol at Washing- 
ton. Among the few present was Senator Mark Hanna. 
He had been more instrumental than any one in the 
United States in the selection of Mr. McKinley for 
president and his triumphant election. Mr. McKinley 
put absolute trust in Hanna, and Hanna was the most 
powerful personality in the country. No two men in 
public life were ever so admirably fitted for each other 
as President McKinley and Senator Hanna. The day 
before the death of the president Hanna could look for- 
ward to four years of increasing power and usefulness 
with the president who had just been re-elected. But 
as he walked with me from Mr. Wilcox's house that 
night, he felt keenly that he never could have any such 
relation with Colonel Roosevelt. He was personally 
exceedingly fond of Mr. McKinley, and to his grief at 
the death of his friend was added a full apprehension of 
his changed position in American public life. 



XIV 

THEODORE ROOSEVELT 

The bullet of the assassin had ended fatally, and 
McKinley was no more. Theodore Roosevelt, vice- 
president, became president. Few recognized at the 
time there had come into the presidency of the United 
States one of the most remarkable, capable, and original 
men who ever occupied the White House. 

During the following seven years President Roosevelt 
not only occupied but filled the stage of public affairs in 
the United States. Even now, two years or more after 
his death, with the exception of President Wilson, Roose- 
velt is the best known American in the world. It is diffi- 
cult to predict the future because of the idealization 
which sometimes though rarely occurs in regard to public 
men, but Colonel Roosevelt is rapidly taking a position 
as third, with Washington and Lincoln as the other two. 

My relations with Colonel Roosevelt were always 
most interesting. His father, who was a cordial friend 
of mine, was one of the foremost citizens of New York. 
In all civic duties and many philanthropies he occupied 
a first place. The public activities of the father had 
great influence in forming the character and directing the 
ambitions of his son. 

Mr. Roosevelt entered public life very early and, as 
with everything with him, always in a dramatic way. 
One of the interesting characters of New York City was 
Frederick Gibbs, who was an active politician and a dis- 
trict leader. Gibbs afterwards became the national 

158 



THEODORE ROOSEVELT 159 

committeeman from New York on the Republican na- 
tional committee. When he died he left a collection 
of pictures which, to the astonishment of everybody, 
showed that he was a liberal and discriminating patron 
of art. 

Gibbs had a district difficult to manage, because, com- 
mencing in the slums it ran up to Fifth Avenue. It was 
normally Democratic, but he managed to keep his party 
alive and often to win, and so gained the reputation that 
he was in league with Tammany. He came to me one 
day and said: "Our organization has lost the confidence 
of the 'highbrows.' They have not a great many votes, 
but their names carry weight and their contributions are 
invaluable in campaigns. To regain their confidence we 
are thinking of nominating for member of the legislature 
young Theodore Roosevelt, who has just returned from 
Harvard. What do you think of it?" 

Of course, I advocated it very warmly. 'Well," he 
said, "we will have a dinner at Delmonico's. It will be 
composed entirely of 'highbrows.' We wish you to 
make the principal speech, introducing young Roosevelt, 
who, of course, will respond. I will not be at the din- 
ner, but I will be in the pantry." 

The dinner was a phenomenal success. About three 
hundred in dress suits, white vests, and white neckties 
were discussing the situation, saying: "Where did these 
stories and slanders originate in regard to our district, 
about its being an annex of Tammany and with Tam- 
many affiliations? We are the district, and we all know 
each other." 

Young Roosevelt, when he rose to speak, looked about 
eighteen years old, though he was twenty-three. His 
speech was carefully prepared, and he read it from a 



i6o CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

manuscript. It was remarkable in the emphatic way in 
which he first stated the evils in the city, State, and 
national governments, and how he would correct them if 
he ever had the opportunity. It is a curious realization 
of youthful aspirations that every one of those oppor- 
tunities came to him, and in each of them he made 
history and permanent fame. 

The term of office of Frank Black, Governor of the 
State of New York, was about expiring. Black was a 
man of great ability and courage. The people had voted 
nine millions of dollars to improve the Erie Canal. 
There were persistent rumors of fraud in the work. 
Governor Black ordered an investigation through an 
able committee which he appointed. The committee 
discovered that about a million dollars had been wasted 
or stolen. Black at once took measures to recover the 
money if possible and to prosecute the guilty. The 
opposition took advantage of this to create the impres- 
sion in the public mind of the corruption of the Republi- 
can administration. The acute question was: "Should 
Governor Black be renominated?" 

Colonel Roosevelt had just returned from Cuba, where 
he had won great reputation in command of the Rough 
Riders, and he and his command were in camp on Long 
Island. 

Senator Piatt, the State leader, was accustomed to 
consult me, and his confidence in my judgment was the 
greater from the fact that he knew that I wanted noth- 
ing, while most of the people who surrounded the leader 
were recipients of his favor, and either the holders of 
offices or expecting some consideration. He asked me 
to come and see him at Manhattan Beach. As usual, he 
entered at once upon the question in hand by saying: 



THEODORE ROOSEVELT 161 

"I am very much troubled about the governorship. 
Frank Black has made an excellent governor and did 
the right thing in ordering an investigation of the Canal 
frauds, but the result of the investigation has been that 
in discovering frauds the Democrats have been able to 
create a popular impression that the whole State admin- 
istration is guilty. The political situation is very criti- 
cal in any way. Benjamin Odell, the chairman of our 
State committee, urges the nomination of Colonel Roose- 
velt. As you know, Roosevelt is no friend of mine, and 
I don't think very well of the suggestion. Now, what 
do you think?" 

I instantly replied: "Mr. Piatt, I always look at a 
public question from the view of the platform. I have 
been addressing audiences ever since I became a voter, 
and my judgment of public opinion and the views of the 
people are governed by how they take or will take and 
act upon the questions presented. Now, if you nomi- 
nate Governor Black and I am addressing a large audi- 
ence — and I certainly will — the heckler in the audience 
will arise and interrupt me, saying: 'Chauncey, we agree 
with what you say about the Grand Old Party and all 
that, but how about the Canal steal?' I have to explain 
that the amount stolen was only a million, and that 
would be fatal. If Colonel Roosevelt is nominated, I 
can say to the heckler with indignation and enthusiasm: 
W I am mighty glad you asked that question. We have 
nominated for governor a man who has demonstrated in 
public office and on the battlefield that he is a fighter for 
the right, and always victorious. If he is selected, you 
know and we all know from his demonstrated character- 
istics, courage and ability, that every thief will be caught 
and punished, and every dollar that can be found restored 



1 62 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

to the public treasury.' Then I will follow the colonel 
leading his Rough Riders up San Juan Hill and ask the 
band to play the ' Star-Spangled Banner.' " 

Piatt said very impulsively: "Roosevelt will be nomi- 
nated." 

When the State convention met to nominate a State 
ticket, I was selected to present the name of Colonel 
Roosevelt as a candidate for governor. I have done 
that a great many times in conventions, but have never 
had such a response. As I went on reciting the achieve- 
ments of Roosevelt, his career, his accomplishments, and 
his great promise, the convention went wild with enthu- 
siasm. It was plain that no mistake had been made in 
selecting him as the candidate. 

During the campaign he made one of the most pictur- 
esque canvasses the State has ever experienced. He was 
accompanied in his travels by a large staff of orators, but 
easily dominated the situation and carried the audience 
with him. He was greatly amused at a meeting where 
one of his Rough Riders, who was in the company, in- 
sisted upon making a speech. The Rough Rider said: 
"My friends and fellow citizens, my colonel was a great 
soldier. He will make a great governor. He always 
put us boys in battle where we would be killed if 
there was a chance, and that is what he will do with 
you." 

Roosevelt as governor was, as always, most original. 
New York was an organization State, with Mr. Piatt as 
leader, and with county leaders of unusual ability and 
strength. Governors had been accustomed to rely upon 
the organization both for advice and support. Roose- 
velt could not bear any kind of control. He sought ad- 
vice in every direction and then made up his mind. 



THEODORE ROOSEVELT 163 

This brought him often in conflict with local leaders 
and sometimes with the general organization. 

On one occasion the State chairman, who was always 
accustomed to be in Albany during the closing day of 
the legislature, to prevent in the haste and confusion, 
characteristic of legislation at this time, the passage of 
bad or unpopular measures, bade the governor good-by 
at midnight, as the legislature was to adjourn the follow- 
ing day with the understanding that lawmaking was 
practically over. 

A large real-estate delegation arrived the next morn- 
ing, with the usual desire to relieve real-estate from tax- 
ation by putting it somewhere else. They came with a 
proposition to place new burdens upon public utilities. 
It was too late to formulate and introduce a measure on 
a question so important, but there was a bill which had 
been in the legislature most of the session and never 
received serious consideration. The governor sent an 
emergency message to the legislature, which had remain- 
ing only one hour of life to pass that bill. 

Next day the tremendous interest in public utilities 
was panic-stricken because the bill was so crude that it 
amounted to confiscation. The governor, when applied 
to, said: "Yes, I know that the bill is very crude and un- 
fit to become a law, but legislation on this subject is ab- 
solutely necessary. I will do this: I have thirty days 
before I must make up my mind to sign the bill, or let it 
become a law without my signature. Within that thirty 
days I will call the legislature together again. Then 
you can prepare and submit to me a proper bill, and if 
we can agree upon it, I will present it to the legislature. 
If the legislature passes that measure I will sign it, but if 
it does not, I will let the present measure, bad as it is, 
become a law." 



1 64 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

The result of the threat was that a very good and 
timely act was presented in regard to the taxation of 
public utilities, a measure which largely increased mu- 
nicipal and State revenues. I know of no governor in 
my time who would have had the originality and the 
audacity to accomplish what he desired by such drastic 
operation. 

Roosevelt's administration was high-minded and pa- 
triotic. But by his exercise of independent judgment 
and frequently by doing things without consulting the 
leaders, State or local, he became exceedingly unpopular 
with the organization. It was evident that it would be 
very difficult to renominate him. It was also evident 
that on account of his popularity with the people, if he 
failed in the renomination, the party would be beaten. 
So it was unanimously decided to put him on the national 
ticket as vice-president. 

The governor resisted this with all his passionate 
energy. He liked the governorship. He thought there 
were many things which he could do in another term, 
and he believed and so stated that the vice-presidency 
was a tomb. He thought that nobody could be resur- 
rected when once buried in that sarcophagus. 

The national Republican convention of 1904 was a 
ratification meeting. President McKinley's administra- 
tion had been exceedingly popular. The convention met 
practically to indorse McKinley's public acts and re- 
nominate him for another term. The only doubtful 
question was the vice-presidency. There was a general 
accord of sentiment in favor of Governor Roosevelt, 
which was only blocked by his persistent refusal. 

Roosevelt and I were both delegates at large, and that 
position gave him greater opportunity to emphasize his 



THEODORE ROOSEVELT 165 

disinclination. A very intimate friend of his called upon 
me and begged that I would use all my influence to pre- 
vent the colonel's nomination. This friend said to me: 
"The governor's situation, officially and personally, 
makes it impossible for him to go to Washington. On 
the official side are his unfinished legislation and the new 
legislation greatly needed by the State, which will add 
enormously to his reputation and pave the way for his 
future. He has very little means. As governor his sal- 
ary is ample. The Executive Mansion is free, with 
many contributory advantages, and the schools of 
Albany admirable for the education of his six children. 
While in Washington the salary of vice-president is 
wholly inadequate to support the dignity of the posi- 
tion, and it is the end of a young man of a most prom- 
ising career." 

I knew what the friend did not know, and it was that 
Mr. Roosevelt could not be governor again. I was so 
warmly attached to him and so anxious for his future 
that I felt it was my duty to force his nomination if 
possible. 

Governor Odell was chairman of the delegation for 
all convention purposes, but in the distribution of honors 
I was made the presiding officer at its meetings. The 
delegation met to consider the vice-presidency. Several 
very eloquent speeches were made in favor of Mr. Roose- 
velt, but in an emphatic address he declined the nomi- 
nation. He then received a unanimous vote, but again 
declined. A delegate then arose and suggested that he 
reconsider his determination, and several others joined 
most earnestly in this request. Roosevelt was deeply 
affected, but, nevertheless, firmly declined. 

I knew there was a member of the delegation who had 



1 66 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

canvassed it to secure the honor in case Roosevelt be- 
came impossible, and that the next motion would be 
the nomination of this aspirant. So I abruptly declared 
the meeting adjourned. I did this in the hope that dur- 
ing the night, with the pressure brought to bear upon 
him, the colonel would change his mind. In the morn- 
ing Mr. Roosevelt surrendered his convictions and 
agreed to accept the nomination. 

In every convention there is a large number of men 
prominent in their several delegations who wish to secure 
general attention and publicity. As there were no dis- 
putes as to either candidate or platform, these gentlemen 
all became anxious to make speeches favoring the can- 
didates, McKinley and Roosevelt. There were so many 
of these speeches which, of course, were largely repeti- 
tions, that the convention became wearied and impa- 
tient. The last few were not heard at all on account 
of the confusion and impatience of the delegates. While 
one orator was droning away, a delegation from a West- 
ern State came over to me and said: "We in the extreme 
West have never heard you speak, and won't you oblige 
us by taking the platform?" 

I answered: "The audience will not stand another 
address." Roosevelt, who sat right in front of me, then 
remarked: "Yes, they will from you. These speeches 
have pretty nearly killed the ticket, and if it keeps up 
the election is over, and McKinley and I are dead." He 
then seized me and almost threw me on the platform. 

The novelty of the situation, which was suddenly 
grasped by the delegates, commanded attention. I 
recalled what Mr. Lincoln had once said to me, defend- 
ing his frequent use of anecdotes, and this is what he 
said: "Plain people, take them as you find them, are 



THEODORE ROOSEVELT 167 

more easily influenced through the medium of a broad 
and humorous illustration than in any other way." 

I had heard a new story, a rare thing, and began with 
the narration of it. Alongside the chairman sat Senator 
Thurston. He was a fine speaker, very ornate and 
highly rhetorical. He never indulged in humor or un- 
bent his dignity and formality. I heard him say in a 
sepulchral voice to the chairman: "Great God, sir, the 
dignity and solemnity of this most important and his- 
torical occasion is to be ruined by a story." Happily the 
story was a success and gave the wearied audience two 
opportunities to hear my speech. Their laughter was 
internal relief, and it was giving the- external relief of 
changing their positions for new and more restful ones. 

My friend, John M. Thurston, came to Philadelphia 
with a most elaborate and excellent oration. Sitting in 
the audience on three different occasions, I heard it with 
as much pleasure the last time as I had the first. 

When Mr. Roosevelt as vice-president came to pre- 
side over the Senate, it was soon evident that he would 
not be a success. His talents were executive and ad- 
ministrative. The position of the presiding officer of the 
United States Senate is at once easy and difficult. The 
Senate desires impartiality, equable temper, and knowl- 
edge of parliamentary law from its presiding officer. 
But it will not submit to any attempt on the part of the 
presiding officer to direct or advise it, and will instantly 
resent any arbitrary ruling. Of course, Mr. Roosevelt 
presided only at a few meetings before the final adjourn- 
ment. When Congress met again he was President of 
the United States. 

Senators and members soon found that there was a 
change at the White House. No two men were ever so 



1 68 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

radically different in every respect as McKinley and 
Roosevelt. Roosevelt loved to see the people in a mass 
and rarely cared for private or confidential interviews. 
He was most hospitable and constantly bringing visitors 
to luncheon when the morning meetings in the executive 
offices had closed, and he had not had a full opportunity 
to hear or see them. 

Senator Hanna was accustomed to have a few of his 
colleagues of the Senate dine with him frequently, in 
order to consult on more effective action upon pending 
measures. President Roosevelt, who knew everything 
that was going on, often burst into Hanna's house after 
dinner and with the utmost frankness submitted the 
problems which had arisen at the White House, and 
upon which he wished advice or, if not advice, support — 
more frequently support. 

Any one who attended the morning conferences, 
where he saw senators and members of the House, and 
the public, was quite sure to be entertained. I remem- 
ber on one occasion I had been requested by several 
friends of his, men of influence and prominence in New 
York, to ask for the appointment of minister to a foreign 
government for a journalist of some eminence. When I 
entered the Cabinet room it was crowded, and the presi- 
dent knew that I was far from well, so he at once called 
my name, asked how I was and what I wanted. I told 
him that I had to leave Washington that day on the 
advice of my doctor for a rest, and what I wanted was 
to present the name of a gentleman for appointment as 
a minister, if I could see him for five minutes. 

The president exclaimed: "We have no secrets here. 
Tell it right out." I then stated the case. He asked 
who was behind the applicant. I told him. Then he 



THEODORE ROOSEVELT 169 

said, "Yes, that's all right," to each one until I men- 
tioned also the staff of the gentleman's newspaper, which 
was one of the most prominent and powerful in the 
country but a merciless critic of the president. He 
shouted at once: "That settles it. Nothing which that 
paper wishes will receive any consideration from me." 
Singularly enough, the paper subsequently became one 
of his ardent advocates and supporters. 

On another occasion I was entering his private office 
as another senator was coming out of the Cabinet room, 
which was fdled. He called out: "Senator Depew, do 
you know that man going out?" I answered: "Yes, he 
is a colleague of mine in the Senate." "Well," he 
shouted, "he is a crook." His judgment subsequently 
proved correct. 

Mr. Roosevelt and his wife were all their lives in the 
social life of the old families of New York who were 
admitted leaders. They carried to the White House 
the culture and conventions of what is called the best 
society of the great capitals of the world. This experi- 
ence and education came to a couple who were most 
democratic in their views. They loved to see people 
and met and entertained every one with delightful hos- 
pitality. 

Roosevelt was a marvel of many-sidedness. Besides 
being an executive as governor of a great State and ad- 
ministrator as civil-service commissioner and police com- 
missioner of New York, he was an author of popular 
books and a field naturalist of rare acquirements. He 
was also a wonderful athlete. I often had occasion to 
see him upon urgent matters, and was summoned to his 
gymnasium, where he was having a boxing match with 
a well-known pugilist, and getting the better of his an- 



1 7 o CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

tagonist, or else launching at his fencing master. The 
athletics would cease, to be resumed as soon as he had in 
his quick and direct way disposed of what I presented. 

Horseback riding was a favorite exercise with him, and 
his experience on his Western ranch and in the army had 
made him one of the best riders in the world. The for- 
eign diplomats in Washington, with their education that 
their first duty was to be in close touch with the chief 
magistrate, whether czar, queen, king, or president, 
found their training unequal to keeping close to Presi- 
dent Roosevelt, except one, and he told me with great 
pleasure that though a poor rider he joined the president 
in his horseback morning excursions. Sometimes, he 
said, when they came to a very steep, high, and rough 
hill the president would shout, "Let us climb to the 
top," and the diplomat would struggle over the stones, 
the underbrush, and gullies, and return to his horse with 
torn garments after sliding down the hill. At another 
time, when on the banks of the Potomac, where the 
waters were raging rapids, the president said, "We will 
go to that island in the middle of the river," and imme- 
diately plunge in. The diplomat followed and reached 
the island after wading and swimming, and with great 
difficulty returned with sufficient strength to reach home. 
He had an attack of pneumonia from this unusual expo- 
sure, but thereafter was the envy and admiration of his 
colleagues and increased the confidence of his own gov- 
ernment by this intimacy with the president. 

The president's dinners and luncheons were unique 
because of his universal acquaintance with literary and 
scientific people. There were generally some of them 
present. His infectious enthusiasm and hearty cordial- 
ity drew out the best points of each guest. I was pres- 



THEODORE ROOSEVELT 171 

ent at a large dinner one evening when an instance 
occurred which greatly amused him. There were some 
forty guests. When they were seated, the president 
noticed four vacant chairs. He sent one of his aides to 
ascertain the trouble. The aide discovered an elderly 
senator standing with his wife, and another senator and 
a lady looking very disconsolate. The aged senator 
refused to take out a lady as his card directed or leave 
his wife to a colleague. He said to the president's aide, 
who told him that dinner was waiting and what he had 
to do: "When I eat I eat with my wife, or I don't eat at 
all." The old gentleman had his way. 

The president had one story which he told often and 
with much glee. While he was on the ranch the neigh- 
bors had caught a horse thief and hung him. They soon 
discovered that they had made a mistake and hung the 
wrong man. The most diplomatic among the ranchers 
was selected to take the body home and break the news 
gently to his wife. The cowboy ambassador asked the 

wife: "Are you the wife of ?" She answered "Yes." 

"Well," said the ambassador, "you are mistaken. You 
are his widow. I have his body in the wagon. You 
need not feel bad about it, because we hung him think- 
ing he was the horse thief. We soon after found that 
he was innocent. The joke is on us." 

Mr. Roosevelt was intensely human and rarely tried 
to conceal his feelings. He was to address the New 
York State Fair at Syracuse. The management invited 
me as a United States Senator from New York to be 
present. There were at least twenty thousand on the 
fair ground, and Mr. Roosevelt read his speech, which he 
had elaborately prepared, detailing his scheme for har- 
monizing the relations between labor and capital. The 



1 72 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

speech was long and very able and intended for publica- 
tion all over the country. But his audience, who were 
farmers, were not much interested in the subject. Be- 
sides, they had been wearied wandering around the 
grounds and doing the exhibits, waiting for the meeting 
to begin. I know of nothing so wearisome to mind and 
body as to spend hours going through the exhibits of a 
great fair. When the president finished, the audience 
began calling for me. I was known practically to every 
one of them from my long career on the platform. 

Knowing Roosevelt as I did, I was determined not to 
speak, but the fair management and the audience would 
not be denied. I paid the proper compliments to the 
president, and then, knowing that humor was the only 
possible thing with such a tired crowd, I had a rollicking 
good time with them. They entered into the spirit of 
the fun and responded in a most uproarious way. I 
heard Roosevelt turn to the president of the fair and say 
very angrily: "You promised me, sir, that there would 
be no other speaker." 

When I met the president that evening at a large din- 
ner given by Senator Frank Hiscock, he greeted me with 
the utmost cordiality. He was in fine form, and early 
in the dinner took entire charge of the discussion. For 
three hours he talked most interestingly, and no one 
else contributed a word. Nevertheless, we all enjoyed 
the evening, and not the least the president himself. 

I used to wonder how he found time, with his great 
activities and engagements, to read so much. Pub- 
lishers frequently send me new books. If I thought 
they would interest him I mentioned the work to him, 
but invariably he had already read it. 

When my first term as senator expired and the ques- 






THEODORE ROOSEVELT 173 

tion of my re-election was before the legislature, Presi- 
dent Roosevelt gave me his most cordial and hearty 
support. 

Events to his credit as president, which will be monu- 
ments in history, are extraordinary in number and im- 
portance. To mention only a few: He placed the Mon- 
roe Doctrine before European governments upon an im- 
pregnable basis by his defiance to the German Kaiser, 
when he refused to accept arbitration and was deter- 
mined to make war on Venezuela. The president cabled: 
"Admiral Dewey with the Atlantic Fleet sails to-mor- 
row." And the Kaiser accepted arbitration. Raissuli, 
the Moroccan bandit, who had seized and held for ran- 
som an American citizen named Perdicaris, gave up his 
captive on receipt of this cable: "Perdicaris alive or 
Raissuli dead." He settled the war between Russia and 
Japan and won the Nobel prize for peace. 

Roosevelt built the Panama Canal when other efforts 
had failed for five hundred years. As senator from his 
own State, I was in constant consultation with him while 
he was urging legislation necessary to secure the conces- 
sion for the construction of the canal. The difficulties 
to be overcome in both Houses seemed insurmountable, 
and would have been so except for the marvellous re- 
sourcefulness and power of the president. 

When the Republican convention met in 1908, I was 
again delegate at large. It was a Roosevelt convention 
and crazy to have him renominated. It believed that 
he could overcome the popular feeling against a third 
term. Roosevelt did not think so. He believed that in 
order to make a third term palatable there must be an 
interval of another and different administration. When 
the convention found that his decision was unalterably 



174 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

not to accept the nomination himself, it was prepared to 
accept any one he might advise. He selected his secre- 
tary of war and most intimate friend, William Howard 
Taft. Taft had a delightful personality, and won dis- 
tinction upon the bench, and had proved an admirable 
administrator as governor of the Philippine Islands. 
After Mr. Taft's election the president, in order that the 
new president and his administration might not be em- 
barrassed by his presence and prestige, went on a two 
years' trip abroad. 

During that trip he was more in the popular mind at 
home and abroad than almost any one in the world. If 
he reviewed the German army with the Kaiser, the press 
was full of the common characteristics and differences 
between the two men and of the unprecedented event of 
the guest giving advice to the Kaiser. 

When he visited England he told in a public speech of 
his experience in Egypt, and recommended to the Eng- 
lish Government that, if they expected to continue to 
govern Egypt, to begin to govern it. 

All France was aghast and then hilarious when, in an 
address before the faculties of Sorbonne, he struck at 
once at the weak point of the future and power of France, 
and that was race suicide. 



XV 
UNITED STATES SENATE 

My twelve years in the Senate were among the happi- 
est of my life. The Senate has long enjoyed the repu- 
tation of being the best club in the world, but it is more 
than that. My old friend, Senator Bacon, of Georgia, 
often said that he preferred the position of senator to 
that of either President or Chief Justice of the United 
States. There is independence in a term of six years 
which is of enormous value to the legislative work of the 
senator. The member of the House, who is compelled 
to go before his district every two years, must spend 
most of his time looking after his re-election. Then the 
Senate, being a smaller body, the associations are very 
close and intimate. I do not intend to go into discussion 
of the measures which occupied the attention of the 
Senate during my time. They are a part of the history 
of the world. The value of a work of this kind, if it has 
any value, is in personal incidents. 

One of the most delightful associations of a lifetime, 
personally and politically, was that with Vice-President 
James S. Sherman. During the twenty-two years he 
was in the House of Representatives he rarely was in the 
City of New York without coming to see me. He be- 
came the best parliamentarian in Congress, and was gen- 
erally called to the chair when the House met in com- 
mittee of the whole. He was intimately familiar with 
every political movement in Washington, and he had a 

175 



176 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

rare talent for discriminatory description, both of events 
and analysis of the leading characters in the Washing- 
ton drama. He was one of the wisest of the advisers of 
the organization of his party, both national and State. 

When President Roosevelt had selected Mr. Taft as 
his successor he made no indication as to the vice-presi- 
dency. Of course, the nomination of Mr. Taft under 
such conditions was a foregone conclusion, and when the 
convention met it was practically unanimous for Roose- 
velt's choice. Who was the best man to nominate for 
vice-president in order to strengthen the ticket embar- 
rassed the managers of the Taft campaign. The Repub- 
lican congressmen who were at the convention were prac- 
tically unanimous for Sherman, and their leader was 
Uncle Joe Cannon. We from New York found the Taft 
managers discussing candidates from every doubtful 
State. We finally convinced them that New York was 
the most important, but they had gone so far with State 
candidates that it became a serious question how to get 
rid of them without offending their States. 

The method adopted by one of the leading managers 
was both adroit and hazardous. He would call up a 
candidate on the telephone and say to him: "The friends 
of Mr. Taft are very favorable to you for vice-president. 
Will you accept the nomination?" The candidate 
would hesitate and begin to explain his ambitions, his 
career and its possibilities, and the matter which he 
would have to consider. Before the prospective candi- 
date had finished, the manager would say, "Very sorry, 
deeply regret," and put up the telephone. 

When the nomination was made these gentlemen who 
might have succeeded would come around to the man- 
ager and say impatiently and indignantly: "I was all 



UNITED STATES SENATE 177 

right. Why did you cut mc off?" However, those gen- 
tlemen have had their compensation. Whenever you 
meet one of them he will say to you: "I was offered the 
vice-presidency with Taft but was so situated that I 
could not accept." 

One evening during the convention a wind and rain 
storm drove everybody indoors. The great lobby of 
Congress Hall was crowded, and most of them were dele- 
gates. Suddenly there was a loud call for a speech, and 
some husky and athletic citizen seized and lifted me on 
to a chair. After a story and a joke, which put the 
crowd into a receptive mood, I made what was practi- 
cally a nominating speech for Sherman. The response 
was intense and unanimous. When I came down from 
a high flight as to the ability and popularity to the 
human qualities of "Sunny Jim," I found "Sunny Jim" 
such a taking characterization, and it was echoed and re- 
echoed. I do not claim that speech nominated Sherman, 
only that nearly everybody who was present became a 
most vociferous advocate for Sherman for vice-president. 

The position of vice-president is one of the most diffi- 
cult in our government. Unless the president requests 
his advice or assistance, he has no public function except 
presiding over the Senate. No president ever called the 
vice-president into his councils. McKinley came near- 
est to it during his administration, with Hobart, but did 
not keep it up. 

President Harding has made a precedent for the 
future by inviting Vice-President Coolidge to attend all 
Cabinet meetings. The vice-president has accepted and 
meets regularly with the Cabinet. 

Sherman had one advantage over other vice-presidents 
in having been for nearly a quarter of a century a leader 



178 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

in Congress. Few, if any, who ever held that office have 
been so popular with the Senate and so tactful and influ- 
ential when they undertook the very difficult task of in- 
fluencing the action of a Senate, very jealous of its pre- 
rogatives and easily made resentful and hostile. 

Among my colleagues in the Senate were several re- 
markable men. They had great ability, extraordinary 
capacity for legislation, and, though not great orators, 
possessed the rare faculty of pressing their points home 
in short and effective speeches. Among them was Sen- 
ator Frye, of Maine. He was for many years chairman 
of the great committee on commerce. Whatever we had 
of a merchant marine was largely due to his persistent 
efforts. He saved the government scores of millions in 
that most difficult task of pruning the River and Harbor 
Bill. He possessed the absolute confidence of both par- 
ties, and was the only senator who could generally carry 
the Senate with him for or against a measure. While 
wise and the possessor of the largest measure of common 
sense, yet he was one of the most simple-minded of men. 
I mean by this that he had no guile and suspected none 
in others. Whatever was uppermost in his mind came 
out. These characteristics made him one of the most 
delightful of companions and one of the most harmonious 
men to work with on a committee. 

Clement A. Griscom, the most prominent American 
ship owner and director, was very fond of Senator Frye. 
Griscom entertained delightfully at his country home 
near Philadelphia. He told me that at one time Senator 
Frye was his guest over a week-end. To meet the sena- 
tor at dinner on Saturday evening, he had invited great 
bankers, lawyers, and captains of industry of Phila- 
delphia. Their conversation ran from enterprises and 



UNITED STATES SENATE 179 

combinations involving successful industries and ex- 
ploitations to individual fortunes and how they were ac- 
cumulated. The atmosphere was heavy with millions 
and billions. Suddenly Griscom turned to Senator Frye 
and said: "I know that our successful friends here would 
not only be glad to hear but would learn much if you 
would tell us of your career." "It is not much to tell," 
said Senator Frye, "especially after these stories which 
are like chapters from the 'Arabian Nights.' I was very 
successful as a young lawyer and rising to a leading prac- 
tice and head of the bar of my State when I was offered 
an election to the House of Representatives. I felt that 
it would be a permanent career and that there was no 
money in it. I consulted my wife and told her that it 
meant giving up all prospects of accumulating a fortune 
or independence even, but it was my ambition, and I 
believed I could perform valuable service to the public, 
and that as a career its general usefulness would far sur- 
pass any success at the bar. My wife agreed with me 
cordially and said that she would economize on her part 
to any extent required. 

"So," the senator continued, "I have been nearly 
thirty years in Congress, part of this time in the House 
and the rest in the Senate. I have been able on my 
salary to meet our modest requirements and educate 
our children. I have never been in debt but once. Of 
course, we had to calculate closely and set aside sufficient 
to meet our extra expenses in Washington and our ordi- 
nary one at home. We came out a little ahead every 
year but one. That year the president very unexpect- 
edly called an extra session, and for the first time in 
twenty years I was in debt to our landlord in Wash- 
ington." 



180 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

Griscom told me that this simple narrative of a states- 
man of national reputation seemed to make the monu- 
mental achievements of his millionaire guests of little 
account. 

Senator Frye's genial personality and vivid conversa- 
tion made him a welcome guest at all entertainments in 
Washington. There was a lady at the capital at that 
time who entertained a great deal and was very popular 
on her own account, but she always began the conver- 
sation with the gentleman who took her out by narrating 
how she won her husband. I said one day to Senator 
Frye: "There will be a notable gathering at So-and-So's 
dinner to-night. Are you going?" He answered: "Yes, 
I will be there; but it has been my lot to escort to dinner 
this lady" — naming her — "thirteen times this winter. 
She has told me thirteen times the story of her courtship. 
If it is my luck to be assigned to her to-night, and she 
starts that story, I shall leave the table and the house 
and go home." 

Senator Aldrich, of Rhode Island, was once called by 
Senator Quay the schoolmaster of the Senate. As the 
head of the finance committee he had commanding influ- 
ence, and with his skill in legislation and intimate knowl- 
edge of the rules he was the leader whenever he chose 
to lead. This he always did when the policy he desired 
or the measure he was promoting had a majority, and 
the opposition resorted to obstructive tactics. As there 
is no restriction on debate in the Senate, or was none at 
my time, the only way the minority could defeat the 
majority was by talking the bill to death. I never knew 
this method to be used successfully but once, because in 
the trial of endurance the greater number wins. The 
only successful talk against time was by Senator Carter, 



UNITED STATES SENATE 181 

of Montana. Carter was a capital debater. He was in- 
valuable at periods when the discussion had become very 
bitter and personal. Then in his most suave way he 
would soothe the angry elements and bring the Senate 
back to a calm consideration of the question. When he 
arose on such occasions, the usual remark among those 
who still kept their heads was: "Carter will now bring 
out his oil can and pour oil upon the troubled waters" — 
and it usually proved effective. 

Senator George F. Hoar, of Massachusetts, seemed to 
be a revival of what we pictured in imagination as the 
statesmen who framed the Constitution of the United 
States, or the senators who sat with Webster, Clay, and 
Calhoun. He was a man of lofty ideals and devotion to 
public service. He gave to each subject on which he 
spoke an elevation and dignity that lifted it out of ordi- 
nary senatorial discussions. He had met and knew inti- 
mately most of the historical characters in our public life 
for fifty years, and was one of the most entertaining and 
instructive conversationalists whom I ever met. 

On the other hand, Senator Benjamin Tillman, of 
South Carolina, who was an ardent admirer of Senator 
Hoar, was his opposite in every way. Tillman and I be- 
came very good friends,, though at first he was exceed- 
ingly hostile. He hated everything which I represented. 
With all his roughness, and at the beginning his brutal- 
ity, he had a singular streak of sentiment. 

I addressed the first dinner of the Gridiron Club at its 
organization and have been their guest many times since. 
The Gridiron Club is an association of the newspaper 
correspondents at Washington, and their dinners several 
times a year are looked forward to with the utmost inter- 
est and enjoyed by everybody privileged to attend. 



1 82 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

The Gridiron Club planned an excursion to Charleston, 
S. C, that city having extended to them an invitation. 
They invited me to go with them and also Senator Till- 
man. Tillman refused to be introduced to me because 
I was chairman of the board of directors of the New 
York Central Railroad, and he hated my associations 
and associates. We had a wonderful welcome from the 
most hospitable of cities, the most beautifully located 
City of Charleston. On the many excursions, luncheons, 
and gatherings, I was put forward to do the speaking, 
which amounted to several efforts a day during our three 
days' visit. The Gridiron stunt for Charleston was very 
audacious. There were many speakers, of course, in- 
cluding Senator Tillman, who hated Charleston and the 
Charlestonians, because he regarded them as aristocrats 
and told them so. There were many invited to speak 
who left their dinners untasted while they devoted them- 
selves to looking over their manuscripts, and whose 
names were read in the list at the end of the dinner, but 
their speeches were never called for. 

On our way home we stopped for luncheon at a place 
outside of Charleston. During the luncheon an earth- 
quake shook the table and rattled the plates. I was 
called upon to make the farewell address for the Grid- 
iron Club to the State of South Carolina. Of course the 
earthquake and its possibilities gave an opportunity for 
pathos as well as humor, and Tillman was deeply 
affected. When we were on the train he came to me 
and with great emotion grasped my hand and said: 
"Chauncey Depew, I was mistaken about you. You 
are a damn good fellow." And we were good friends 
until he died. 

I asked Tillman to what he owed his phenomenal rise 



UNITED STATES SENATE 183 

and strength in the conservative State of South Caro- 
lina. He answered: "We in our State were governed by 
a class during the colonial period and afterwards until 
the end of the Civil War. They owned large planta- 
tions, hundreds of thousands of negroes, were educated 
for public life, represented our State admirably, and did 
great service to the country. They were aristocrats and 
paid little attention to us poor farmers, who constituted 
the majority of the people. The only difference between 
us was that they had been colonels or generals in the 
Revolutionary War, or delegates to the Continental 
Congress or the Constitutional Convention, while we had 
been privates, corporals, or sergeants. They generally 
owned a thousand slaves, and we had from ten to thirty. 
I made up my mind that we should have a share of the 
honors, and they laughed at me. I organized the ma- 
jority and put the old families out of business, and we 
became and are the rulers of the State." 

Among the most brilliant debaters of any legislative 
body were Senators Joseph W. Bailey, of Texas, and 
John C. Spooner, of Wisconsin. They would have 
adorned and given distinction to any legislative body in 
the world. Senator Albert J. Beveridge, of Indiana, and 
Senator Joseph B. Foraker, of Ohio, were speakers of a 
very high type. The Senate still has the statesmanship, 
eloquence, scholarship, vision, and culture of Senator 
Lodge, of Massachusetts. 

One of the wonders of the Senate was Senator M. W. 
Crane, of Massachusetts. He never made a speech. I 
do not remember that he ever made a motion. Yet he 
was the most influential member of that body. His wis- 
dom, tact, sound judgment, encyclopaedic knowledge of 
public affairs and of public men made him an authority. 



1 84 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

Senator Hanna, who was a business man pure and sim- 
ple, and wholly unfamiliar with legislative ways, devel- 
oped into a speaker of remarkable force and influence. 
At the same time, on the social side, with his frequent 
entertainments, he did more for the measures in which 
he was interested. They were mainly, of course, of a 
financial and economic character. 

One of the characters of the Senate, and one of the 
upheavals of the Populist movement was Senator Jeff. 
Davis, of Arkansas. Davis was loudly, vociferously, 
and clamorously a friend of the people. Precisely what 
he did to benefit the people was never very clear, but if 
we must take his word for it, he was the only friend the 
people had. Among his efforts to help the people was 
to denounce big business of all kinds and anything which 
gave large employment or had great capital. I think 
that in his own mind the ideal state would have been 
made of small landowners and an occasional lawyer. 
He himself was a lawyer. 

One day he attacked me, as I was sitting there listen- 
ing to him, in a most vicious way, as the representative 
of big corporations, especially railroads, and one of the 
leading men in the worst city in the world, New York, 
and as the associate of bankers and capitalists. When 
he finished Senator Crane went over to his seat and told 
him that he had made a great mistake, warned him that 
he had gone so far that I might be dangerous to him per- 
sonally, but in addition to that, with my ridicule and 
humor, I would make him the laughing-stock of the 
Senate and of the country. Jeff, greatly alarmed, wad- 
dled over to my seat and said: "Senator Depew, I hope 
you did not take seriously what I said. I did not mean 
anything against you. I won't do it again, but I thought 



UNITED STATES SENATE 185 

that you would not care, because it won't hurt you, and 
it does help me out in Arkansas." I replied: "Jeff, old 
man, if it helps you, do it as often as you like." Need- 
less to say, he did not repeat. 

I have always been deeply interested in the preserva- 
tion of the forests and a warm advocate of forest pre- 
servers. I made a study of the situation of the Ap- 
palachian Mountains, where the lumberman was doing 
his worst, and millions of acres of fertile soil from the 
denuded hills were being swept by the floods into the 
ocean every year. I made a report from my committee 
for the purchase of this preserve, affecting, as it did, 
eight States, and supported it in a speech. Senator 
Eugene Hale, a Senate leader of controlling influence, 
had been generally opposed to this legislation. He be- 
came interested, and, when I had finished my speech, 
came over to me and said: "I never gave much attention 
to this subject. You have convinced me and this bill 
should be passed at once, and I will make the motion." 
Several senators from the States affected asked for delay 
in order that they might deliver speeches for local con- 
sumption. The psychological moment passed and that 
legislation could not be revived until ten years after- 
wards, and then in a seriously modified form. 

I worked very hard for the American mercantile ma- 
rine. A subsidy of four million dollars a year in mail 
contracts would have been sufficient, in addition to the 
earnings of the ships, to have given us lines to South and 
Central America, Australia, and Asia. 

Shakespeare's famous statement that a rose by any 
other name would smell as sweet has exceptions. In the 
psychology of the American mind the word subsidy is 
fatal to any measure. After the most careful investiga- 



1 86 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

tion, while I was in the Senate, I verified this statement, 
that a mail subsidy of four millions a year would give 
to the United States a mercantile marine which would 
open new trade routes for our commerce. This contri- 
bution would enable the ship-owners to meet the losses 
which made it impossible for them to compete with the 
ships of other countries, some having subsidies and all 
under cheaper expenses of operation. It would not all 
be a contribution because part of it was a legitimate 
charge for carrying the mails. The word subsidy, how- 
ever, could be relied upon to start a flood of fiery ora- 
tory, charging that the people of the United States were 
to be taxed to pour money into the pockets of specula- 
tors in New York and financial crooks in Wall Street. 

We have now created a mercantile marine through the 
Shipping Board which is the wonder and amazement of 
the world. It has cost about five hundred millions. 
Part of it is junk already, and a part available is run at 
immense loss, owing to discriminatory laws. Recently a 
bill was presented to Congress for something like sixty 
millions of dollars to make up the losses in the opera- 
tions of our mercantile marine for the year. While a 
subsidy of four millions under private management 
would have been a success but was vetoed as a crime, 
the sixty millions are hailed as a patriotic contribution 
to public necessity. 

A river and harbor bill of from thirty to fifty millions 
of dollars was eagerly anticipated and enthusiastically 
supported. It was known to be a give and take, a swap 
and exchange, where a few indispensable improvements 
had to carry a large number of dredgings of streams, 
creeks, and bayous, which never could be made naviga- 
ble. Many millions a year were thrown away in these 



UNITED STATES SENATE 187 

river and harbor bills, but four millions a year to restore 
the American mercantile marine aroused a flood of indig- 
nant eloquence, fierce protest, and wild denunciation of 
capitalists, who would build and own ships, and it was 
always fatal to the mercantile marine. 

Happily the war has, among its benefits, demonstrated 
to the interior and mountain States that a merchant 
marine is as necessary to the United States as its navy, 
and that we cannot hope to expand and retain our trade 
unless we have the ships. 

I remember one year when the river and harbor bill 
came up for passage on the day before final adjourn- 
ment. The hour had been fixed by both Houses, and, 
therefore, could not be extended by one House. The 
administration was afraid of the bill because of the 
many indefensible extravagances there were in it. At 
the same time, it had so many political possibilities that 
the president was afraid to veto it. Senator Carter was 
always a loyal administration man, and so he was put 
forward to talk the bill to death. He kept it up without 
yielding the floor for thirteen hours, and until the hour of 
adjournment made action upon the measure impossible. 

I sat there all night long, watching this remarkable 
effort. The usual obstructor soon uses up all his own 
material and then sends pages of irrelevant matter to the 
desk for the clerk to read, or he reads himself from the 
pages of the Record, or from books, but Carter stuck to 
his text. He was a man of wit and humor. Many items 
in the river and harbor bill furnished him with an oppor- 
tunity of showing how creeks and trout streams were to 
be turned by the magic of the money of the Treasury into 
navigable rivers, and inaccessible ponds were to be 
dredged into harbors to float the navies of the world. 



1 88 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

The speech was very rich in anecdotes and delightful 
in its success by an adroit attack of tempting a supporter 
of the measure into aiding the filibuster by indignantly 
denying the charge which Carter had made against him. 
By this method Carter would get a rest by the folly of 
his opponent. The Senate was full and the galleries 
were crowded during the whole night, and when the 
gavel of the vice-president announced that no further 
debate was admissible and the time for adjournment had 
arrived, and began to make his farewell speech, Carter 
took his seat amidst the wreck of millions and the hopes 
of the exploiters, and the Treasury of the United States 
had been saved by an unexpected champion. 

The country does not appreciate the tremendous 
power of the committees, as legislative business con- 
stantly increases with almost geometrical progression. 
The legislation of the country is handled almost entirely 
in committees. It requires a possible revolution to over- 
come the hostility of a committee, even if the House and 
the country are otherwise minded. Some men whose 
names do not appear at all in the Congressional Record, 
and seldom in the newspapers, have a certain talent for 
drudgery and detail which is very rare, and when added 
to shrewdness and knowledge of human nature makes 
such a senator or representative a force to be reckoned 
with on committees. Such a man is able to hold up al- 
most anything. 

I found during my Washington life the enormous im- 
portance of its social side. Here are several hundred 
men in the two Houses of Congress, far above the aver- 
age in intelligence, force of character, and ability to 
accomplish things. Otherwise they would not have been 
elected. They are very isolated and enjoy far beyond 



UNITED STATES SENATE 189 

those who have the opportunity of club life, social atten- 
tions. At dinner the real character of the guest comes 
out, and he is most responsive to these attentions. Mrs. 
Depew and I gave a great many dinners, to our intense 
enjoyment and, I might say, education. By this method 
I learned to know in a way more intimate than other- 
wise would have been possible many of the most inter- 
esting characters I have ever met. 

Something must be done, and that speedily, to bridge 
the widening chasm between the Executive and the 
Congress. Our experience with President Wilson has 
demonstrated this. As a self-centred autocrat, confident 
of himself and suspicious of others, hostile to advice or 
discussion, he became the absolute master of the Con- 
gress while his party was in the majority. 

The Congress, instead of being a co-ordinate branch, 
was really in session only to accept, adopt, and put into 
laws the imperious will of the president. When, how- 
ever, the majority changed, there being no confidence 
between the executive and the legislative branch of the 
government, the necessary procedure was almost para- 
lyzed. The president was unyielding and the Congress 
insisted upon the recognition of its constitutional rights. 
Even if the president is, as McKinley was, in close and 
frequent touch with the Senate and the House of Rep- 
resentatives, the relation is temporary and unequal, and 
not what it ought to be, automatic. 

Happily we have started a budget system; but the 
Cabinet should have seats on the floor of the Houses, and 
authority to answer questions and participate in debates. 
Unless our system was radically changed, we could not 
adopt the English plan of selecting the members of the 
Cabinet entirely from the Senate and the House. But 



190 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

we could have an administration always in close touch 
with the Congress if the Cabinet members were in 
attendance when matters affecting their several depart- 
ments were under discussion and action. 

I heard Senator Nelson W. Aldrich, who was one of the 
shrewdest and ablest legislators of our generation, say 
that if business methods were applied to the business of 
the government in a way in which he could do it, there 
would be a saving of three hundred millions of dollars a 
year. We are, since the Great War, facing appropria- 
tions of five or six billions of dollars a year. I think the 
saving of three hundred millions suggested by Senator 
Aldrich could be increased in proportion to the vast 
increase in appropriations. 

There has been much discussion about restricting un- 
limited debates in the Senate and adopting a rigid clo- 
sure rule. My own recollection is that during my 
twelve years unlimited discussion defeated no good mea- 
sure, but talked many bad ones to death. There is a 
curious feature in legislative discussion, and that is the 
way in which senators who have accustomed themselves 
to speak every day on each question apparently increase 
their vocabulary as their ideas evaporate. Two senators 
in my time, who could be relied upon to talk smoothly as 
the placid waters of a running brook for an hour or more 
every day, had the singular faculty of apparently saying 
much of importance while really developing no ideas. 
In order to understand them, while the Senate would 
become empty by its members going to their committee 
rooms, I would be a patient listener. I finally gave that 
up because, though endowed with reasonable intelligence 
and an intense desire for knowledge, I never could grasp 
what they were driving at. 



XVI 

AMBASSADORS AND MINISTERS 

The United States has always been admirably repre- 
sented at the Court of St. James. I consider it as a rare 
privilege and a delightful memory that I have known 
well these distinguished ambassadors and ministers who 
served during my time. I was not in England while 
Charles Francis Adams was a minister, but his work 
during the Civil War created intense interest in America. 
It is admitted that he prevented Great Britain from tak- 
ing such action as would have prolonged the war and 
endangered the purpose which Mr. Lincoln was trying 
to accomplish, namely, the preservation of the Union. 
His curt answer to Lord John Russell, "This means 
war," changed the policy of the British Government. 

James Russell Lowell met every requirement of the 
position, but, more than that, his works had been read 
and admired in England before his appointment. Lit- 
erary England welcomed him with open arms, and offi- 
cial England soon became impressed with his diplomatic 
ability. He was one of the finest after-dinner speakers, 
and that brought him in contact with the best of English 
public life. He told me an amusing instance. As soon 
as he was appointed, everybody who expected to meet 
him sent to the book stores and purchased his works. 
Among them, of course, was the "Biglow Papers." One 
lady asked him if he had brought Mrs. Biglow with him. 

The secretary of the embassy, William J. Hoppin, was 

a very accomplished gentleman. He had been president 

191 



192 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

of the Union League Club, and I knew him very well. 
I called one day at the embassy with an American liv- 
ing in Europe to ask for a favor for this fellow country- 
man. The embassy was overwhelmed with Americans 
asking favors, so Hoppin, without looking at me or wait- 
ing for the request, at once brought out his formula for 
sliding his visitors on an inclined plane into the street. 
He said: "Every American — and there are thousands of 
them — who comes to London visits the embassy. They 
all want to be invited to Buckingham Palace or to have 
cards to the House of Lords or the House of Commons. 
Our privileges in that respect are very few, so few that 
we can satisfy hardly anybody. Why Americans, when 
there is so much to see in this old country from which 
our ancestry came, and with whose literature we are so 
familiar, should want to try to get into Buckingham Pal- 
ace or the Houses of Parliament is incomprehensible. 
There is a very admirable cattle show at Reading. I 
have a few tickets and will give them to you, gentlemen, 
gladly. You will find the show exceedingly interesting." 

I took the tickets, but if there is anything of which I 
am not a qualified judge, it is prize cattle. That night, 
at a large dinner given by a well-known English host, my 
friend Hoppin was present, and at once greeted me with 
warm cordiality. Of course, he had no recollections of 
the morning meeting. Our host, as usual when a new 
American is present, wanted to know if I had any fresh 
American stories, and I told with some exaggeration and 
embroidery the story of the Reading cattle show. Dear 
old Hoppin was considerably embarrassed at the chafing 
he received, but took it in good part, and thereafter the 
embassy was entirely at my service. 

Mr. Edward J. Phelps was an extraordinary success. 



AMBASSADORS AND MINISTERS 193 

He was a great lawyer, and the Chief Justice of the 
Supreme Court of the United States told me that there 
was no one who appeared before that Court whose argu- 
ments were more satisfactory and convincing than those 
of Mr. Phelps. He had the rare distinction of being a 
frequent guest at the Benchers' dinners in London. One 
of the English judges told me that at a Benchers' dinner 
the judges were discussing a novel point which had arisen 
in one of the cases recently before them. He said that 
in the discussion in which Mr. Phelps was asked to par- 
ticipate, the view which the United States, minister pre- 
sented was so forcible that the decision, which had been 
practically agreed upon, was changed to meet Mr. 
Phelps's view. I was at several of Mr. Phelps's dinners. 
They were remarkable gatherings of the best in almost 
every department of English life. 

At one of his dinners I had a delightful talk with 
Browning, the poet. Browning told me that as a young 
man he was several times a guest at the famous break- 
fasts of the poet and banker, Samuel Rogers. Rogers, 
he said, was most arbitrary at these breakfasts with his 
guests, and rebuked him severely for venturing beyond 
the limits within which he thought a young poet should 
be confined. 

Mr. Browning said that nothing gratified him so much 
as the popularity of his works in the United States. He 
was especially pleased and also embarrassed by our 
Browning societies, of which there seemed to be a great 
many over here. They sent him papers which were read 
by members of the societies, interpreting his poems. 
These American friends discovered meanings which had 
never occurred to him, and were to him an entirely novel 
view of his own productions. He also mentioned that 



194 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

every one sent him presents and souvenirs, all of them 
as appreciations and some as suggestions and help. 
Among these were several cases of American wine. He 
appreciated the purpose of the gifts, but the fluid did not 
appeal to him. 

He told me he was a guest at one time at the dinners 
given to the Shah of Persia. This monarch was a bar- 
barian, but the British Foreign Office had asked and ex- 
tended to him every possible courtesy, because of the 
struggle then going on as to whether Great Britain or 
France or Russia should have the better part of Persia. 
France and Russia had entertained him with lavish mili- 
tary displays and other governmental functions, which a 
democratic country like Great Britain could not dupli- 
cate. So the Foreign Office asked all who had great 
houses in London or in the country, and were lavish 
entertainers, to do everything they could for the Shah. 

Browning was present at a great dinner given for the 
Shah at Stafford House, the home of the Duke of Suther- 
land, and the finest palace in London. Every guest was 
asked, in order to impress the Shah, to come in all the 
decorations to which they were entitled. The result was 
that the peers came in their robes, which they otherwise 
would not have thought of wearing on such an occasion, 
and all others in the costumes of honor significant of their 
rank. Browning said he had received a degree at Oxford 
and that entitled him to a scarlet cloak. He was so out- 
ranked, because the guests were placed according to rank, 
that he sat at the foot of the table. The Shah said to 
his host: "Who is that distinguished gentleman in the 
scarlet cloak at the other end of the table?" The host 
answered: "That is one of our greatest poets." "That 
is no place for a poet," remarked the Shah; "bring him 



AMBASSADORS AND MINISTERS 195 

up here and let him sit next to me." So at the royal 
command the poet took the seat of honor. The Shah 
said to Browning: "I am mighty glad to have you near 
me, for I am a poet myself." 

It was at this dinner that Browning heard the Shah 
say to the Prince of Wales, who sat at the right of the 
Shah: "This is a wonderful palace. Is it royal?" The 
Prince answered: "No, it belongs to one of our great 
noblemen, the Duke of Sutherland." "Well," said the 
Shah, "let me give you a point. When one of my noble- 
men or subjects gets rich enough to own a palace like 
this, I cut off his head and take his fortune." 

A very beautiful English lady told me that she was at 
Ferdinand Rothschild's, where the Shah was being enter- 
tained. In order to minimize his acquisitive talents, the 
wonderful treasures of Mr. Rothschild's house had been 
hidden. The Shah asked for an introduction to this 
lady and said to her: "You are the most beautiful woman 
I have seen since I have been in England. I must take 
you home with me." "But," she said, "Your Majesty, 
I am married." "Well," he replied, "bring your hus- 
band along. When we get to Teheran, my capital, I 
will take care of him." 

Mr. Phelps's talent as a speaker was quite unknown 
to his countrymen before he went abroad. While he was 
a minister he made several notable addresses, which 
aroused a great deal of interest and admiration in Great 
Britain. He was equally happy in formal orations and 
in the field of after-dinner speeches. Mrs. Phelps had 
such a phenomenal success socially that, when her hus- 
band was recalled and they left England, the ladies of 
both the great parties united, and through Lady Rose- 
bery, the leader of the Liberal, and Lady Salisbury, of 



1 96 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

the Conservative, women, paid her a very unusual and 
complimentary tribute. 

During John Hay's term as United States minister to 
Great Britain my visits to England were very delightful. 
Hay was one of the most charming men in public life of 
his period. He had won great success in journalism, as 
an author, and in public service. At his house in Lon- 
don one would meet almost everybody worth while in 
English literary, public, and social life. 

In the hours of conversation with him, when I was 
posting him on the latest developments in America, his 
comment upon the leading characters of the time were 
most racy and witty. Many of them would have em- 
balmed a statesman, if the epigram had been preserved, 
like a fly in amber. He had officially a very difficult 
task during the Spanish War. The sympathies of all 
European governments were with Spain. This was espe- 
cially true of the Kaiser and the German Government. 
It was Mr. Hay's task to keep Great Britain neutral and 
prevent her joining the general alliance to help Spain, 
which some of the continental governments were fo- 
menting. 

Happily, Mr. Balfour, the British foreign minister, was 
cordially and openly our friend. He prevented this com- 
bination against the United States. 

During part of my term as a senator John Hay was 
secretary of state. To visit his office and have a discus- 
sion on current affairs was an event to be remembered. 
He made a prediction, which was the result of his own 
difficulties with the Senate, that on account of the two- 
thirds majority necessary for the ratification of a treaty, 
no important treaty sent to the Senate by the president 
would ever again be ratified. Happily this gloomy view 
has not turned out to be entirely correct. 



AMBASSADORS AND MINISTERS 197 

Mr. Hay saved China, in the settlement of the indem- 
nities arising out of the Boxer trouble, from the greed of 
the great powers of Europe. One of his greatest achieve- 
ments was in proclaiming the open door for China and 
securing the acquiescence of the great powers. It was a 
bluff on his part, because he never could have had the 
active support of the United States, but he made his 
proposition with a confidence which carried the belief 
that he had no doubt on that subject. He was fortu- 
nately dealing with governments who did not under- 
stand the United States and do not now. With them, 
when a foreign minister makes a serious statement of 
policy, it is understood that he has behind him the whole 
military, naval, and financial support of his govern- 
ment. But with us it is a long road and a very rocky 
one, before action so serious, with consequences so great, 
can receive the approval of the war-making power in 
Congress. 

I called on Hay one morning just as Cassini, the Rus- 
sian ambassador, was leaving. Cassini was one of the 
shrewdest and ablest of diplomats in the Russian ser- 
vice. It was said that for twelve years he had got the 
better of all the delegations at Pekin and controlled that 
extraordinary ruler of China, the dowager queen. Cas- 
sini told me that from his intimate associations with her 
he had formed the opinion that she was quite equal to 
Catherine of Russia, whom he regarded as the greatest 
woman sovereign who ever lived. 

Hay said to me: "I have just had a very long and very 
remarkable discussion with Cassini. He is a revelation 
in the way of secret diplomacy. He brought to me the 
voluminous instructions to him of his government on 
our open-door policy. After we had gone over them 



1 98 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

carefully, he closed his portfolio and, pushing it aside, 
said: 'Now, Mr. Secretary, listen to Cassini.' He im- 
mediately presented an exactly opposite policy from the 
one in the instructions, and a policy entirely favorable to 
us, and said: 'That is what my government will do.'" 
It was a great loss to Russian diplomacy when he died 
so early. 

As senator I did all in my power to bring about the 
appointment of Whitelaw Reid as ambassador to Great 
Britain. He and I had been friends ever since his be- 
ginning in journalism in New York many years before. 
Reid was then the owner and editor of the New York 
Tribune, and one of the most brilliant journalists in the 
country. He was also an excellent public speaker. His 
long and intimate contact with public affairs and inti- 
macy with public men ideally fitted him for the ap- 
pointment. He had already served with great credit as 
ambassador to France. 

The compensation of our representatives abroad 
always has been and still is entirely inadequate to enable 
them to maintain, in comparison with the representa- 
tives of other governments, the dignity of their own 
country. All the other great powers at the principal 
capitals maintain fine residences for their ambassadors, 
which also is the embassy. Our Congress,, except within 
the last few years, has always refused to make this pro- 
vision. The salary which we pay is scarcely ever more 
than one-third the amount paid by European govern- 
ments in similar service. 

I worked hard while in the Senate to improve this 
situation because of my intimate knowledge of the ques- 
tion. When I first began the effort I found there was a 
very strong belief that the whole foreign service was an 



AMBASSADORS AND MINISTERS 199 

unnecessary expense. When Mr. Roosevelt first became 
president, and I had to see him frequently about diplo- 
matic appointments, I learned that this was his view. 
He said to me: "This foreign business of the govern- 
ment, now that the cable is perfected, can be carried on 
between our State Department and the chancellery of 
any government in the world. Nevertheless, I am in 
favor of keeping up the diplomatic service. All the old 
nations have various methods of rewarding distinguished 
public servants. The only one we have is the diplomatic 
service. So when I appoint a man ambassador or minis- 
ter, I believe that I am giving him a decoration, and the 
reason I change ambassadors and ministers is that I want 
as many as possible to possess it." 

The longer Mr. Roosevelt remained president, and the 
closer he came to our foreign relations, the more he 
appreciated the value of the personal contact and inti- 
mate knowledge on the spot of an American ambassador 
or minister. 

Mr. Reid entertained more lavishly and hospitably 
than any ambassador in England ever had, both at his 
London house and at his estate in the country. He 
appreciated the growing necessity to the peace of the 
world and the progress of civilization of closer union of 
English-speaking peoples. At his beautiful and delight- 
ful entertainments Americans came in contact with Eng- 
lishmen under conditions most favorable for the appre- 
ciation by each of the other. The charm of Mr. and 
Mrs. Whitelaw Reid's hospitality was so genuine, so 
cordial, and so universal, that to be their guest was an 
event for Americans visiting England. There is no cap- 
ital in the world where hospitality counts for so much as 
in London, and no country where the house-party brings 



200 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

people together under such favorable conditions. Both 
the city and the country homes of Mr. and Mrs. Reid 
were universities of international good-feeling. Mr. 
Reid, on the official side, admirably represented his 
country and had the most intimate relations with the 
governing powers of Great Britain. 

I recall with the keenest pleasure how much my old 
friend, Joseph H. Choate, did to make each one of my 
visits to London during his term full of the most charm- 
ing and valuable recollections. His dinners felt the 
magnetism of his presence, and he showed especial skill 
in having, to meet his American guests, just the famous 
men in London life whom the American desired to know. 

Choate was a fine conversationalist, a wit and a 
humorist of a high order. His audacity won great tri- 
umphs, but if exercised by a man less endowed would 
have brought him continuously into trouble. He had 
the faculty, the art, of so directing conversation that at 
his entertainments everybody had a good time, and an 
invitation always was highly prized. He was appreciated 
most highly by the English bench and bar. They recog- 
nized him as the leader of his profession in the United 
States. They elected him a Bencher of the Middle Tem- 
ple, the first American to receive that honor after an 
interval of one hundred and fifty years. Choate's wit- 
ticisms and repartees became the social currency of din- 
ner-tables in London and week-end parties in the 
country. 

Choate paid little attention to conventionalities, which 
count for so much and are so rigidly enforced, especially 
in royal circles. I had frequently been at receptions, 
garden-parties, and other entertainments at Buckingham 
Palace in the time of Queen Victoria and also of King 



AMBASSADORS AND MINISTERS 201 

Edward. At an evening reception the diplomats repre- 
senting all the countries in the world stand in a solemn 
row, according to rank and length of service. They are 
covered with decorations and gold lace. The weight of 
the gold lace on some of the uniforms of the minor 
powers is as great as if it were a coat of armor. Mr. 
Choate, under regulations of our diplomatic service, 
could only appear in an ordinary dress suit. 

While the diplomats stand in solemn array, the king 
and queen go along the line and greet each one with 
appropriate remarks. Nobody but an ambassador and 
minister gets into that brilliant circle. On one occasion 
Mr. Choate saw me standing with the other guests out- 
side the charmed circle and immediately left the diplo- 
mats, came to me, and said: "I am sure you would like 
to have a talk with the queen." He went up to Her 
Majesty, stated the case and who I was, and the propo- 
sition was most graciously received. I think the royal- 
ties were pleased to have a break in the formal etiquette. 
Mr. Choate treated the occasion, so far as I was con- 
cerned, as if it had been a reception in New York or 
Salem, and a distinguished guest wanted to meet the 
hosts. The gold-laced and bejewelled and highly deco- 
rated diplomatic circle was paralyzed. 

Mr. Choate's delightful personality and original con- 
versational powers made him a favorite guest every- 
where, but he also carried to the platform the distinction 
which had won for him the reputation of being one of the 
finest orators in the United States. 

Choate asked at one time when I was almost nightly 
making speeches at some entertainment: "How do you 
do it?" I told him I was risking whatever reputation I 
had on account of very limited preparation, that I did 



202 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

not let these speeches interfere at all with my business, 
but that they were all prepared after I had arrived home 
from my office late in the afternoon. Sometimes they 
came easy, and I reached the dinner in time; at other 
times they were more difficult, and I did not arrive till 
the speaking had begun. Then he said: "I enjoy mak- 
ing these after-dinner addresses more than any other 
work. It is a perfect delight for me to speak to such an 
audience, but I have not the gift of quick and easy prep- 
aration. I accept comparatively few of the constant in- 
vitations I receive, because when I have to make such a 
speech I take a corner in the car in the morning going 
to my office, exclude all the intruding public with a 
newspaper and think all the way down. I continue the 
same process on my way home in the evening, and it 
takes about three days of this absorption and exclusive- 
ness, with some time in the evenings, to get an address 
with which I am satisfied." 

The delicious humor of these efforts of Mr. Choate and 
the wonderful way in which he could expose a current 
delusion, or what he thought was one, and produce an 
impression not only on his audience but on the whole 
community, when his speech was printed in the news- 
papers, was a kind of effort which necessarily required 
preparation. In all the many times I heard him, both 
at home and abroad, he never had a failure and some- 
times made a sensation. 

Among the many interesting characters whom I met 
on shipboard was Emory Storrs, a famous Chicago law- 
yer. Storrs was a genius of rare talent as an advocator. 
He also on occasions would make a most successful 
speech, but his efforts were unequal. At one session of 
the National Bar Association he carried off all the 



AMBASSADORS AND MINISTERS 203 

honors at their banquet. Of course, they wanted him 
the next year, but then he failed entirely to meet their 
expectations. Storrs was one of the most successful ad- 
vocates at the criminal bar, especially in murder cases. 
He rarely failed to get an acquittal for his client. He 
told me many interesting stories of his experiences. He 
had a wide circuit, owing to his reputation, and tried cases 
far distant from home. 

I remember one of his experiences in an out-of-the-way 
county of Arkansas. The hotel where they all stopped 
was very primitive, and he had the same table with the 
judge. The most attractive offer for breakfast by the 
landlady was buckwheat-cakes. She appeared with a 
jug of molasses and said to the judge: "Will you have a 
trickle or a dab?" The judge answered: "A dab." She 
then ran her fingers around the jug and slapped a huge 
amount of molasses on the judge's cakes. Storrs said: 
"I think I prefer a trickle." Whereupon she dipped her 
fingers again in the jug and let the drops fall from them 
on Storrs's cakes. The landlady was disappointed be- 
cause her cakes were unpopular with such distinguished 
gentlemen. 

Once Storrs was going abroad on the same ship with 
me on a sort of semi-diplomatic mission. He was deeply 
read in English literature and, as far as a stranger could 
be, familiar with the places made famous in English and 
foreign classics. 

He was one of the factors, as chairman of the Illinois 
delegation, of the conditions which made possible the 
nomination of Garfield and Arthur. In the following 
presidential campaign he took an active and very useful 
part. Then he brought all the influences that he could 
use, and they were many, to bear upon President Arthur 



2o 4 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

to make him attorney-general. Arthur was a strict for- 
malist and could not tolerate the thought of having 
such an eccentric genius in his Cabinet. Storrs was not 
only disappointed but hurt that Arthur declined to ap- 
point him. 

To make him happy his rich clients — and he had many 
of them — raised a handsome purse and urged him to 
make a European trip. Then the president added to the 
pleasure of his journey by giving him an appointment as 
a sort of roving diplomat, with special duties relating to 
the acute trouble then existing in regard to the admis- 
sion of American cattle into Great Britain. They were 
barred because of a supposed infectious disease. 

Storrs's weakness was neckties. He told me that he 
had three hundred and sixty-five, a new one for every 
day. He would come on deck every morning, display 
his fresh necktie, and receive a compliment upon its 
color and appropriateness, and then take from his pocket 
a huge water-proof envelope. From this he would unroll 
his parchment appointment as a diplomat, and the let- 
ters he had to almost every one of distinction in Europe. 
On the last day, going through the same ceremony, he 
said to me: "I am not showing you these things out of 
vanity, but to impress upon you the one thing I most 
want to accomplish in London. I desire to compel 
James Russell Lowell, our minister, to give me a dinner." 

Probably no man in the world could be selected so 
antipathetic to Lowell as Emory Storrs. Mr. Lowell 
told me that he was annoyed that the president should 
have sent an interloper to meddle with negotiations 
which he had in successful progress to a satisfactory 
conclusion. So he invited Storrs to dinner, and then 
Storrs took no further interest in his diplomatic mission. 



AMBASSADORS AND MINISTERS 205 

Mr. Lowell told me that he asked Storrs to name who- 
ever he wanted to invite. He supposed from his general 
analysis of the man that Storrs would want the entire 
royal family. He was delighted to find that the selection 
was confined entirely to authors, artists, and scientists. 

On my return trip Mr. Storrs was again a fellow 
passenger. He was very enthusiastic over the places of 
historic interest he had visited, and eloquent and graphic 
in descriptions of them and of his own intense feelings 
when he came in contact with things he had dreamed of 
most of his life. 

"But," he said, "I will tell you of my greatest adven- 
ture. I was in the picture-gallery at Dresden, and in 
that small room where hangs Raphael's 'Madonna.' I 
was standing before this wonderful masterpiece of divine 
inspiration when I felt the room crowded. I discovered 
that the visitors were all Americans and all looking at 
me. I said to them: 'Ladies and gentlemen, you are 
here in the presence of the most wonderful picture ever 
painted. If you study it, you can see that there is little 
doubt but with all his genius Raphael in this work had 
inspiration from above, and yet you, as Americans, in- 
stead of availing yourselves of the rarest of opportuni- 
ties, have your eyes bent on me. I am only a Chicago 
lawyer wearing a Chicago-made suit of clothes.' 

"A gentleman stepped forward and said: 'Mr. Storrs, 
on behalf of your countrymen and countrywomen pres- 
ent, I wish to say that you are of more interest to us 
than all the works of Raphael put together, because we 
understand that James Russell Lowell, United States 
Minister to Great Britain, gave you a dinner.'" 

One other incident in my acquaintance with Mr. 
Storrs was original. I heard the story of it both from 



206 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

him and Lord Coleridge, and they did not differ mate- 
rially. Lord Coleridge, Chief Justice of England, was a 
most welcome visitor when he came to the United States. 
He received invitations from the State Bar Associations 
everywhere to accept their hospitality. I conducted him 
on part of his trip and found him one of the most able 
and delightful of men. He was a very fine speaker, more 
in our way than the English, and made a first-class im- 
pression upon all the audiences he addressed. 

At Chicago Lord Coleridge was entertained by the Bar 
Association of the State of Illinois. Storrs, who was an 
eminent member of the bar of that State, came to him 
and said: "Now, Lord Coleridge, you have been enter- 
tained by the Bar Association. I want you to know the 
real men of the West, the captains of industry who have 
created this city, built our railroads, and made the Great 
West what it is." Coleridge replied that he did not 
want to go outside bar associations, and he could not 
think of making another speech in Chicago. Storrs 
assured him it would be purely a private affair and no 
speeches permitted. 

The dinner was very late, but when they sat down 
Lord Coleridge noticed a distinguished-looking gentle- 
man, instead of eating his dinner, correcting a manu- 
script. He said: "Mr. Storrs, I understood there was to 
be no speaking." "Well," said Storrs, "you can't get 
Americans together unless some one takes the floor. 
That man with the manuscript is General and Senator 
John A. Logan, one of our most distinguished citizens." 
Just then a reporter came up to Storrs and said: "Mr. 
Storrs, we have the slips of your speech in our office, and 
it is now set up with the laughter and applause in their 
proper places. The editor sent me up to see if you 



AMBASSADORS AND MINISTERS 207 






wanted to add anything." Of course Lord Coleridge 
was in for it and had to make another speech. 

The cause of the lateness of the dinner is the most 
original incident that I know of in historic banquets. 
Storrs received great fees and had a large income, but 
was very careless about his business matters. One of 
his creditors obtained a judgment against him. The 
lawyer for this creditor was a guest at this dinner and 
asked the landlord of the hotel if the dinner had been 
paid for in advance. The landlord answered in the 
affirmative, and so the lawyer telephoned to the sheriff, 
and had the dinner levied upon. The sheriff refused to 
allow it to be served until the judgment was satisfied. 
There were at least a hundred millions of dollars repre- 
sented among the guests, packers, elevator men, real- 
estate operators, and grain operators, but millionaires 
and multimillionaires in dress suits at a banquet never 
have any money on their persons. So it was an hour or 
more before the sheriff was satisfied. Lord Coleridge 
was intensely amused and related the adventure with 
great glee. 

Several years afterwards Lord Coleridge had some 
difficulty in his family which came into the courts of 
England. I do not remember just what it was all about, 
but Storrs, in reading the gossip which came across the 
cable, decided against the chief justice. Lord Coleridge 
told me he received from Storrs a cable reading some- 
thing like this: "I have seen in our papers about your 
attitude in the suit now pending. I therefore inform you 
that as far as possible I withdraw the courtesies which I 
extended to you in Chicago." In this unique way Storrs 
cancelled the dinner which was given and seized by the 
sheriff years ago. 



208 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

I met Storrs many times, and he was always not only 
charming but fascinating. He was very witty, full of 
anecdotes, and told a story with dramatic effect. Ex- 
cept for his eccentricities he might have taken the high- 
est place in his profession. As it was, he acquired such 
fame that an admirer has written a very good biography 
of him. 



XVII 

GOVERNORS OF NEW YORK STATE 

There is nothing more interesting than to see the be- 
ginning of a controversy which makes history. It is my 
good fortune to have been either a spectator or a partici- 
pant on several occasions. 

William M. Tweed was at the height of his power. 
He was the master of New York City, and controlled the 
legislature of the State. The rapid growth and expan- 
sion of New York City had necessitated a new charter, 
or very radical improvements in the existing one. 
Tweed, as chairman of the Senate committee on cities, 
had staged a large and spectacular hearing at the State 
Capitol at Albany. It was attended by a large body of 
representative citizens from the metropolis. Some spoke 
for civic and commercial bodies, and there were also 
other prominent men who were interested. Everybody 
interested in public affairs in Albany at the time at- 
tended. Not only was there a large gathering of legis- 
lators, but there were also in the audience judges, law- 
yers, and politicians from all parts of the State. 

After hearing from the Chamber of Commerce and 
various reform organizations, Mr. Samuel J. Tilden came 
forward with a complete charter. It was soon evident 
that he was better prepared and informed on the subject 
than any one present. He knew intimately the weak- 
nesses of the present charter, and had thought out with 
great care and wisdom what was needed in new legis- 
lation. 

209 



210 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

From the contemptuous way in which Senator Tweed 
treated Mr. Tilden, scouted his plans, and ridiculed his 
propositions, it was evident that the whole scheme had 
been staged as a State-wide spectacle to humiliate and 
end the political career of Samuel J. Tilden. 

In answer to Tilden's protest against this treatment, 
Tweed loudly informed him that he represented no one 
but himself, that he had neither influence nor standing 
in the city, that he was an intermeddler with things that 
did not concern him, and a general nuisance. 

Mr. Tilden turned ashy white, and showed evidences 
of suppressed rage and vindictiveness more intense than 
I ever saw in any one before, and abruptly left the hear- 
ing. 

I knew Mr. Tilden very well, and from contact with 
him in railroad matters had formed a high opinion of his 
ability and acquirements. He had a keen, analytic 
mind, tireless industry, and a faculty for clarifying diffi- 
culties and untangling apparently impossible problems 
to a degree that amounted to genius. 

In reference to what had happened, I said to a friend: 
"Mr. Tweed must be very confident of his position and 
of his record, for he has deliberately defied and invited 
the attacks of a relentless and merciless opponent by 
every insult which could wound the pride and incite the 
hatred of the man so ridiculed and abused. Mr. Tilden 
is a great lawyer. He has made a phenomenal success 
financially, he has powerful associates in financial and 
business circles, and is master of his time for any purpose 
to which he chooses to apply it." 

It was not long before one of the most remarkable and 
exhaustive investigations ever conducted by an individ- 
ual into public records, books, ledgers, bank-accounts, 



GOVERNORS OF NEW YORK STATE 211 

and contracts, revealed to the public the whole system of 
governing the city. This master mind solved the prob- 
lems so that they were plain to the average citizen as the 
simplest sum in arithmetic, or that two and two make 
four. 

The result was the destruction of the power of Tweed 
and his associates, of their prosecution and conviction, 
and of the elevation of Samuel J. Tilden to a State and 
national figure of the first importance. He not only be- 
came in the public mind a leader of reforms in govern- 
ment, municipal, State, and national, but embodied in 
the popular imagination reform itself. 

Mr. Tilden carried this same indefatigable industry 
and power of organization into a canvass for governor. 
His agencies reached not only the counties and towns, 
but the election districts of the State. He called into 
existence a new power in politics — the young men. The 
old leaders were generally against him, but he discovered 
in every locality ambitious, resourceful, and courageous 
youngsters and made them his lieutenants. This unpar- 
alleled preparation made him the master of his party 
and the governor of the State. 

After the election he invited me to come and see him 
at the Executive Mansion in Albany, and in the course 
of the conversation he said: "In your speeches in the 
campaign against me you were absolutely fair, and as a 
fair and open-minded opponent I want to have a frank 
talk. I am governor of the State, elected upon an issue 
which is purely local. The Democratic party is at pres- 
ent without principles or any definite issue on which to 
appeal to the public. If I am to continue in power we 
must find an issue. The Erie Canal is not only a State 
affair, but a national one. Its early construction opened 



2i2 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

the great Northwest, and it was for years the only out- 
let to the seaboard. The public not only in the State of 
New York, but in the West, believes that there has been, 
and is, corruption in the construction and management 
of the Canal. This great waterway requires continuing 
contracts for continuing repairs, and the people believe 
that these contracts are given to favorites, and that the 
work is either not performed at all or is badly done. I 
believe that matter ought to be looked into and the re- 
sult will largely justify the suspicion prevalent in the 
public mind. I want your judgment on the question and 
what will be the effect upon me." 

I then frankly answered him: "Governor, there is no 
doubt it will be a popular movement, but you know that 
the Canal contractors control the machinery of your 
party, and I cannot tell what the effect of that may be 
upon what you desire, which is a second term." 

"Those contractors," he said, "are good Democrats, 
and their ability to secure the contracts depends upon 
Democratic supremacy. A prosecution against them has 
been tried so often that they have little fear of either 
civil or criminal actions, and I think they will accept the 
issue as the only one which will keep their party in 
power." 

It is a part of the history of the time that he made 
the issue so interesting that he became a national figure 
of the first importance and afterwards the candidate of 
his party for President of the United States. Not only 
that, but he so impressed the people that popular judg- 
ment is still divided as to whether or not he was right- 
fully elected president. 

Once I was coming from the West after a tour of in- 
spection, and when we left Albany the conductor told 



GOVERNORS OF NEW YORK STATE 213 

me that Governor Tilden was on the train. I immedi- 
ately called and found him very uncomfortable, because 
he said he was troubled with boils. I invited him into 
the larger compartment which I had, and made him as 
comfortable as possible. His conversation immediately 
turned upon the second term and he asked what I, as a 
Republican, thought of his prospects as the result of his 
administration. We had hardly entered upon the sub- 
ject when a very excited gentleman burst into the com- 
partment and said: "Governor, I have been looking for 
you everywhere. I went to your office at the Capitol 
and to the Executive Mansion, but learned you were 
here and barely caught the train. You know who I am." 
(The governor knew he was mayor of a city.) " I want 
to see you confidentially." 

The governor said to him: "I have entire confidence 
in my Republican friend here. You can trust him. Go 



on. 



I knew the mayor very well, and under ordinary con- 
ditions he would have insisted on the interview with the 
governor being private and personal. But he was so 
excited and bursting with rage that he went right on. 
The mayor fairly shouted: "It is the station agent of the 
New York Central Railroad in our city of whom I com- 
plain. He is active in politics and controls the Demo- 
cratic organization in our county. He is working to pre- 
vent myself and my friends and even ex-Governor Sey- 
mour from being delegates to the national convention. 
It is to the interest of our party, in fact, I may say, the 
salvation of our party in our county that this New York 
Central agent be either removed or silenced, and I want 
you to see Mr. Vanderbilt on the subject." 

The governor sympathized with the mayor and dis- 



2i 4 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

missed him. Then in a quizzical way he asked me: "Do 
you know this agent?" 

"Yes," I answered. 

"What do you think of him?" 

"I know nothing about his political activities," I an- 
swered, "but he is one of the most efficient employees of 
the company in the State." 

"Well," said the governor, "I am glad to hear you 
say so. He was down to see me the other night; in fact, 
I sent for him, and I formed a very high opinion of his 
judgment and ability." 

As a matter of fact, the governor had selected him to 
accomplish this very result which the mayor had said 
would ruin the party in the county. 

When the New York Democratic delegation left the 
city for the Democratic national convention they had 
engaged a special train to leave from the Grand Central 
Station. I went down to see that the arrangements 
were perfected for its movement. It was a hilarious 
crowd, and the sides of the cars were strung with Tilden 
banners. 

Mr. Tilden was there also to see them off. After 
bidding good-by to the leaders, and with a whispered 
conference with each, the mass of delegates and espe- 
cially reporters, of whom there was a crowd, wished to 
engage him in conversation. He spied me and imme- 
diately hurried me into one of the alcoves, apparently 
for a private conversation. The crowd, of course, gath- 
ered around, anxious to know what it was all about. He 
asked me a few questions about the health of my family 
and then added: "Don't leave me. I want to avoid all 
these people, and we will talk until the train is off and 
the crowd disperses." 



GOVERNORS OF NEW YORK STATE 215 

Life was a burden for me the rest of the day and eve- 
ning, made so by the newspaper men and Democratic 
politicians trying to find out what the mysterious chief 
had revealed to me in the alcove of the Grand Central. 

I was very much gratified when meeting him after the 
fierce battles for the presidency were over, to have him 
grasp me by the hand and say: "You were about the 
only one who treated me absolutely fairly during the 
campaign." 

I love little incidents about great men. Mr. Tilden 
was intensely human and a great man. 

Doctor Buckley, who was at the head of the Methodist 
Book Concern in New York, and one of the most delight- 
ful of men, told me that there came into his office one 
day a Methodist preacher from one of the mining dis- 
tricts of Pennsylvania, who said to him: "My church 
burned down. We had no insurance. We are poor peo- 
ple, and, therefore, I have come to New York to raise 
money to rebuild it." 

The doctor told him that New York was overrun 
from all parts of the country with applicants for help, 
and that he thought he would have great difficulty in 
his undertaking. 

"Well," the preacher said, "I am going to see Mr. 
Tilden." 

Doctor Buckley could not persuade him that his mis- 
sion was next to impossible, and so this rural clergyman 
started for Gramercy Park. When he returned he told 
the doctor of his experience. 

"I rang the bell," he said, "and when the door was 
opened I saw Governor Tilden coming down the stairs. 
I rushed in and told him hastily who I was before the 
man at the door could stop me, and he invited me into 



216 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

his library. I stated my mission, and he said he was so 
overwhelmed with applications that he did not think he 
could do anything. 'But, governor,' I said, 'my case 
differs from all others. My congregation is composed 
of miners, honest, hardworking people. They have 
hitherto been Republicans on the protection issue, but 
they were so impressed by you as a great reformer that 
they all voted for you in the last election.' The gov- 
ernor said: 'Tell that story again.' So I started again 
to tell him about my church, but he interrupted me, say- 
ing: 'Not that, but about the election.' So I told him 
again about their having, on account of their admiration 
for him as a reformer, turned from the Republican party 
and voted the Democratic ticket. Then the governor 
said: 'Well, I think you have a most meritorious case, 
and so I will give you all I have.' " 

Doctor Buckley interrupted him hastily, saying: 
Great heavens, are you going to build a cathedral?" 
No," answered the clergyman; "all he had in his 
pocket was two dollars and fifty cents." 

Governor Tilden had many followers and friends 
whose admiration for him amounted almost to adora- 
tion. They believed him capable of everything, and 
they were among the most intelligent and able men of 
the country. 

John Bigelow, journalist, author, and diplomat, was 
always sounding his greatness, both with tongue and pen. 
Abram S. Hewitt was an equally enthusiastic friend and 
admirer. Both of these gentlemen, the latter especially, 
were, I think, abler than Mr. Tilden, but did not have 
his hypnotic power. 

I was dining one night with Mr. Hewitt, whose din- 
ners were always events to be remembered, when Mr. 



tt 



GOVERNORS OF NEW YORK STATE 217 

Tilden became the subject of discussion. After inci- 
dents illustrating his manifold distinctions had been nar- 
rated, Mr. Hewitt said that Mr. Tilden was the only one 
in America and outside of royalties in Europe who had 
some blue-labelled Johannisberger. This famous wine 
from the vineyards of Prince Metternich on the Rhine 
was at that time reported to be absorbed by the royal 
families of Europe. 

Our host said: "The bouquet of this wonderful bever- 
age is unusually penetrating and diffusing, and a proof is 
that one night at a dinner in the summer, with the win- 
dows all open, the guests noticed this peculiar aroma in 
the air. I said to them that Governor Tilden had 
opened a bottle of his Johannisberger." 

The governor's residence was on the other side of 
Gramercy Park from Mr. Hewitt's. The matter was so 
extraordinary that everybody at the table went across 
the park, and when they were admitted they found the 
governor in his library enjoying his bottle of blue-labelled 
Johannisberger. 

When Mr. Tilden was elected governor, my friend, 
General Husted, was speaker of the assembly, which 
was largely Republican. The governor asked General 
Husted to come down in the evening, because he wanted 
to consult him about the improvements and alterations 
necessary for the Executive Mansion, and to have the 
speaker secure the appropriation. During the discus- 
sion the governor placed before the speaker a bottle of 
rare whiskey, with the usual accompaniments. In front 
of the governor was a bottle of his Johannisberger and a 
small liqueur glass, a little larger than a thimble, from 
which the governor would from time to time taste a drop 
of this rare and exquisite fluid. The general, after a 



218 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

while, could not restrain his curiosity any longer and 
said: "Governor, what is that you are drinking?" 

The governor explained its value and the almost utter 
impossibility of securing any. 

"Well, governor," said Speaker Husted, "I never saw 
any before and I think I will try it." He seized the 
bottle, emptied it in his goblet and announced to the 
astonished executive that he was quite right in his esti- 
mate of its excellence. 

The governor lost a bottle of his most cherished trea- 
sure but received from the Republican legislature all 
the appropriation he desired for the Executive Mansion. 

It has been my good fortune to know well the gover- 
nors of our State of New York, commencing with Edmund 
D. Morgan. With many of them I was on terms of 
close intimacy. I have already spoken of Governors 
Seymour, Fenton, Dix, Tilden, Cleveland, and Roose- 
velt. It might be better to confine my memory to those 
who have joined the majority. 

Lucius Robinson was an excellent executive of the 
business type, as also were Alonzo B. Cornell and Levi 
P. Morton. Frank S. Black was in many ways original. 
He was an excellent governor, but very different from 
the usual routine. In the Spanish-American War he 
had a definite idea that the National Guard of our State 
should not go into the service of the United States as 
regiments, but as individual volunteers. The Seventh 
Regiment, which was the crack organization of the 
Guard, was severely criticised because they did not vol- 
unteer. They refused to go except as the Seventh Regi- 
ment, and their enemies continued to assail them as tin 
soldiers. 

General Louis Fitzgerald and Colonel Appleton came 



GOVERNORS OF NEW YORK STATE 219 

to me very much disturbed by this condition. General 
Russell A. Alger, secretary of war, was an intimate friend 
of mine, and I went to Washington and saw him and 
the president on the acute condition affecting the repu- 
tation of the Seventh Regiment. 

General Alger said: "We are about to make a des- 
perate assault upon the fortifications of Havana. Of 
course there will be many casualties and the fighting 
most severe. Will the Seventh join that expedition?" 

The answer of General Fitzgerald and Colonel Apple- 
ton was emphatic that the Seventh would march with 
full ranks on the shortest possible notice. Governor 
Black would not change his view of how the National 
Guard should go, and so the Seventh was never called. 
It seems only proper that I should make a record of this 
patriotic proposition made by this organization. 

Governor Black developed after he became governor, 
and especially after he had retired from office, into a 
very effective orator. He had a fine presence and an 
excellent delivery. He was fond of preparing epigrams, 
and became a master in this sort of literature. When 
he had occasion to deliver an address, it would be almost 
wholly made up of these detached gems, each perfect in 
itself. The only other of our American orators who cul- 
tivated successfully this style of speech was Senator 
John J. Ingalls, of Kansas. It is a style very difficult to 
attain or to make successful. 

David B. Hill was an extraordinary man in many 
ways. He was governor for three terms and United 
States senator for one. His whole life was politics. He 
was a trained lawyer and an excellent one, but his heart 
and soul was in party control, winning popular elections, 
and the art of governing. He consolidated the rural ele- 



220 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

ments of his party so effectively that he compelled Tam- 
many Hall to submit to his leadership and to recognize 
him as its master. 

For many years, and winning in every contest, Gov- 
ernor Hill controlled the organization and the policies of 
the Democratic party of the State of New York. In a 
plain way he was an effective speaker, but in no sense an 
orator. He contested with Cleveland for the presi- 
dency, but in that case ran against a stronger and bigger 
personality than he had ever encountered, and lost. He 
rose far above the average and made his mark upon the 
politics of his State and upon the United States Senate 
while he was a member. 

Levi P. Morton brought to the governorship business 
ability which had made him one of the great merchants 
and foremost bankers. As Governor of the State of New 
York, United States Minister to France, Congressman, 
and Vice-President of the United States, he filled every 
position with grace, dignity, and ability. A lovable per- 
sonality made him most popular. 

Roswell P. Flower, after a successful career as a 
banker, developed political ambitions. He had a fac- 
ulty of making friends, and had hosts of them. He was 
congressman and then governor. While the Democratic 
organization was hostile to him, he was of the Mark 
Hanna type and carried his successful business methods 
into the canvass for the nomination and the campaign 
for the election and was successful. 

Passing through Albany while he was governor, I 
stopped over to pay my respects. I was very fond of 
him personally. When I rang the door-bell of the Execu- 
tive Mansion and inquired for the governor, the servant 
said: "The governor is very ill and can see nobody." 



GOVERNORS OF NEW YORK STATE 221 

Then I asked him to tell the governor, when he was able 
to receive a message, that Chauncey Depew called and 
expressed his deep regret for his illness. Suddenly the 
governor popped out from the parlor and seized me by 
the hand and said: "Chauncey, come in. I was never 
so glad to see anybody in my life." 

He told me the legislature had adjourned and left on 
his hands several thousands of thirty-days bills — that is, 
bills on which he had thirty days to sign or veto, or let 
them become laws by not rejecting them. So he had to 
deny himself to everybody to get the leisure to read 
them over and form decisions. 

"Do you know, Chauncey," he said, "this is a new 
business to me. Most of these bills are on subjects 
which I never have examined, studied, or thought about. 
It is very difficult to form a wise judgment, and I want 
to do in each case just what is right." For the moment 
he became silent, seemingly absorbed by anxious thoughts 
about these bills. Then suddenly he exclaimed: "By 
the way, Chauncey, you've done a great deal of thinking 
in your life, and I never have done any except on busi- 
ness. Does intense thinking affect you as it does me, by 
upsetting your stomach and making you throw up?" 

"No, governor," I answered; "if it did I fear I would 
be in a chronic state of indigestion." 

While he was governor he canvassed the State in a 
private car and made many speeches. In a plain, 
homely man-to-man talk he was very effective on the 
platform. His train stopped at a station in a Republi- 
can community where there were few Democrats, while 
I was addressing a Republican meeting in the village. 
When I had finished my speech I said to the crowd, 
which was a large one: "Governor Flower is at the sta- 



222 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

tfon, and as I passed he had very few people listening 
to him. Let us all go over and give him an audience." 

The proposition was received with cheers. I went 
ahead, got in at the other end of the governor's car from 
the one where he was speaking from the platform. As 
this Republican crowd began to pour in, it was evident 
as I stood behind him without his knowing of my pres- 
ence, that he was highly delighted. He shouted: " Fel- 
low citizens, I told you they were coming. They are 
coming from the mountains, from the hills, and from the 
valleys. It is the stampede from the Republican party 
and into our ranks and for our ticket. This is the hap- 
piest evidence I have received of the popularity of our 
cause and the success of our ticket." 

Standing behind him, I made a signal for cheers, 
which was heartily responded to, and the governor, turn- 
ing around, saw the joke, grasped me cordially by the 
hand, and the whole crowd, including the veteran and 
hardened Democrats on the car, joined in the hilarity of 
the occasion. 

He came to me when he was running for the second 
time for Congress, and said that some of the people of 
his district were anxious for me to deliver an address for 
one of their pet charities, and that the meeting would 
be held in Harlem, naming the evening. I told him I 
would go. He came for me in his carriage, and I said: 
"Governor, please do not talk to me on the way up. I 
was so busy that I have had no time since I left my of- 
fice this afternoon to prepare this address, and I want 
every minute while we are riding to the meeting." 

The meeting was a large one. The governor took the 
chair and introduced me in this original way: "Ladies 
and gentlemen," he said, "I want to say about Chauncey 



GOVERNORS OF NEW YORK STATE 223 

Depew, whom I am now going to introduce to you as the 
lecturer of the evening, that he is no Demosthenes, be- 
cause he can beat Demosthenes out of sight. He pre- 
pared his speech in the carriage in which I was bringing 
him up here, and he don't have, like the old Greek, to 
chew pebble-stones in order to make a speech." 

Governor Flower in a conservative way was a suc- 
cessful trader in the stock market. When he felt he had 
a sure point he would share it with a few friends. He 
took special delight in helping in this way men who had 
little means and no knowledge of the art of money- 
making. There were a great many benefited by his 
bounty. 

I was dining one night with the Gridiron Club at 
Washington, and before me was a plate of radishes. The 
newspaper man next to me asked if I would object to 
having the radishes removed. 

I said: "There is no odor or perfume from them. 
What is the matter with the radishes?" 

After they were taken away he told me his story. 
"Governor Flower," he said, "was very kind to me, as 
he invariably was to all newspaper men. He asked me 
one day how much I had saved in my twenty years in 
journalism. I told him ten thousand dollars. He said: 
'That is not enough for so long a period. Let me have 
the money/ So I handed over to him my bank-account. 
In a few weeks he told me that my ten thousand dollars 
had become twenty, and I could have them if I wished. 
I said: 'No, you are doing far better than I could. Keep 
it.' In about a month or more my account had grown to 
thirty thousand dollars. Then the governor on a very 
hot day went fishing somewhere off the Long Island 
coast. He was a very large, heavy man, became over- 



224 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

heated, and on his return drank a lot of ice-water and 
ate a bunch of radishes. He died that afternoon. 
There was a panic in the stocks which were his favorites 
the next day, and they fell out of sight. The result was 
that I lost my fortune of ten thousand dollars and also 
my profit of twenty. Since then the sight of a radish 
makes me sick." 



XVIII 

FIFTY-SIX YEARS WITH THE NEW YORK CENTRAL 

RAILROAD COMPANY 

Heredity has much to do with a man's career. The 
village of Peekskill-on-the-Hudson, about forty miles 
from New York, was in the early days the market-town 
of a large section of the surrounding country, extending 
over to the State of Connecticut. It was a farming 
region, and its products destined for New York City 
were shipped by sloops on the Hudson from the wharfs 
at Peekskill, and the return voyage brought back the 
merchandise required by the country. 

My father and his brother owned the majority of the 
sloops engaged in this, at that time, almost the only 
transportation. The sloops were succeeded by steam- 
boats in which my people were also interested. When 
Commodore Vanderbilt entered into active rivalry with 
the other steamboat lines between New York and Al- 
bany, the competition became very serious. Newer and 
faster boats were rapidly built. These racers would 
reach the Bay of Peekskill in the late afternoon, and the 
younger population of the village would be on the banks 
of the river, enthusiastically applauding their favorites. 
Among well-known boats whose names and achievements 
excited as much interest and aroused as much partisan- 
ship and sporting spirit as do now famous race-horses 
or baseball champions, were the folio ving: Mary Powell, 

Dean Richmond, The Alida, and The Hendrick Hudson. 

225 



226 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

I remember as if it were yesterday when the Hudson 
River Railroad had reached Peekskill, and the event was 
locally celebrated. The people came in as to a county 
fair from fifty miles around. When the locomotive 
steamed into the station many of those present had 
never seen one. The engineer was continuously blowing 
his whistle to emphasize the great event. This produced 
much consternation and confusion among the horses, as 
all farmers were there with their families in carriages or 
wagons. 

I recall one team of young horses which were driven to 
frenzy; their owner was unable to control them, but he 
kept them on the road while they ran away with a wild 
dash over the hills. In telling this story, as illustrating 
how recent is railway development in the United States, 
at a dinner abroad, I stated that as far as I knew and 
believed, those horses were so frightened that they could 
not be stopped and were still running. A very success- 
ful and serious-minded captain of industry among the 
guests sternly rebuked me by saying: "Sir, that is im- 
possible; horses were never born that could run for 
twenty-five years without stopping." American exag- 
geration was not so well known among our friends on the 
other side then as it is now. 

As we boys of the village were gathered on the banks 
of the Hudson cheering our favorite steamers, or watch- 
ing with eager interest the movements of the trains, a 
frequent discussion would be about our ambitions in life. 
Every young fellow would state a dream which he hoped 
but never expected to be realized. I was charged by my 
companions with having the greatest imagination and 
with painting more pictures in the skies than any of 
them. This was because I stated that in politics, for I was 



WITH THE NEW YORK CENTRAL 227 

a great admirer of William H. Seward, then senator from 
New York, I expected to be a United States senator, and 
in business, because then the largest figure in the busi- 
ness world was Commodore Vanderbilt, I hoped to be- 
come president of the Hudson River Railroad. It is one 
of the strangest incidents of what seemed the wild imag- 
inings of a village boy that in the course of long years 
both these expectations were realized. 

When I entered the service of the railroad on the first 
of January, 1866, the Vanderbilt system consisted of the 
Hudson River and Harlem Railroads, the Harlem ending 
at Chatham, 128 miles, and the Hudson River at Al- 
bany, 140 miles long. The Vanderbilt system now 
covers 20,000 miles. The total railway mileage of the 
whole United States at that time was 36,000, and now 
it is 261,000 miles. 

My connection with the New York Central Railroad 
covers practically the whole period of railway construc- 
tion, expansion, and development in the United States. 
It is a singular evidence of the rapidity of our country's 
growth and of the way which that growth has steadily 
followed the rails, that all this development of States, of 
villages growing into cities, of scattered communities be- 
coming great manufacturing centres, of an internal com- 
merce reaching proportions where it has greater volume 
than the foreign interchanges of the whole world, has 
come about during a period covered by the official career 
of a railroad man who is still in the service: an attorney 
in 1866, a vice-president in 1882, president in 1885, 
chairman of the board of directors in 1899, and still 
holds that office. 

There is no such record in the country for continuous 
service with one company, which during the whole period 



228 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

has been controlled by one family. This service of more 
than half a century has been in every way satisfactory. 
It is a pleasure to see the fourth generation, inheriting 
the ability of the father, grandfather, and great-grand- 
father, still active in the management. 

I want to say that in thus linking my long relationship 
with the railroads to this marvellous development, I do 
not claim to have been better than the railway officers 
who during this time have performed their duties to the 
best of their ability. I wish also to pay tribute to the 
men of original genius, of vision and daring, to whom 
so much is due in the expansion and improvement of the 
American railway systems. 

Commodore Vanderbilt was one of the most remark- 
able men our country has produced. He was endowed 
with wonderful foresight, grasp of difficult situations, 
ability to see opportunities before others, to solve serious 
problems, and the courage of his convictions. He had 
little education or early advantages, but was eminently 
successful in everything he undertook. As a boy on 
Staten Island he foresaw that upon transportation de- 
pended the settlement, growth, and prosperity of this 
nation. He began with a small boat running across the 
harbor from Staten Island to New York. Very early in 
his career he acquired a steamboat and in a few years 
was master of Long Island Sound. He then extended 
his operations to the Hudson River and speedily acquired 
the dominating ownership in boats competing between 
New York and Albany. 

When gold was discovered in California he started a 
line on the Atlantic side of the Isthmus of Darien and 
secured from the government of Nicaragua the privilege 
of crossing the Isthmus for a transportation system 



WITH THE NEW YORK CENTRAL 229 

through its territory, and then established a line of 
steamers on the Pacific to San Francisco. In a short 
time the old-established lines, both on the Atlantic and 
the Pacific, were compelled to sell out to him. Then 
he entered the transatlantic trade, with steamers to Eu- 
rope. 

With that vision which is a gift and cannot be ac- 
counted for, he decided that the transportation work of 
the future was on land and in railroads. He abandoned 
the sea, and his first enterprise was the purchase of the 
New York and Harlem Railroad, which was only one 
hundred and twenty-eight miles long. The road was 
bankrupt and its road-bed and equipment going from 
bad to worse. The commodore reconstructed the line, 
re-equipped it, and by making it serviceable to its terri- 
tory increased its traffic and turned its business from 
deficiency into profit. This was in 1864. The commo- 
dore became president, and his son, William H. Vander- 
bilt, vice-president. He saw that the extension of the 
Harlem was not advisable, and so secured the Hudson 
River Railroad, running from New York to Albany, and 
became its president in 1865. It was a few months 
after this when he and his son invited me to become a 
member of their staff. 

The station of the Harlem Railroad in the city of New 
York was at that time at Fourth Avenue and Twenty- 
sixth Street, and that of the Hudson River Railroad at 
Chambers Street, near the North River. 

In a few years William H. Vanderbilt purchased the 
ground for the Harlem Railroad Company, where is now 
located the Grand Central Terminal, and by the acquisi- 
tion by the New York Central and Hudson River Rail- 
road of the Harlem Railroad the trains of the New York 



2 3 o CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

Central were brought around into the Grand Central 
Station. 

In 1867, two years after Mr. Vanderbilt had acquired 
the Hudson River Railroad, he secured the control of the 
New York Central, which ran from Albany to Buffalo. 
This control was continued through the Lake Shore on 
one side of the lakes and the Michigan Central on the 
other to Chicago. Subsequently the Vanderbilt System 
was extended to Cincinnati and St. Louis. It was thus 
in immediate connection with the West and Northwest 
centering in Chicago, and the Southwest at Cincinnati 
and St. Louis. By close connection and affiliation with 
the Chicago and Northwestern Railway Company, the 
Vanderbilt system was extended beyond to Mississippi. 
I became director in the New York Central in 1874 and 
in the Chicago and Northwestern in 1877. 

It has been my good fortune to meet with more or less 
intimacy many of the remarkable men in every depart- 
ment of life, but I think Commodore Vanderbilt was the 
most original. I had been well acquainted for some 
years both with the commodore and his son, William H. 
When I became attorney my relations were more inti- 
mate than those usually existing. I was in daily con- 
sultation with the commodore during the ten years prior 
to his death, and with his son from 1866 to 1885, when 
he died. 

The commodore was constantly, because of his wealth 
and power, importuned by people who wished to interest 
him in their schemes. Most of the great and progressive 
enterprises of his time were presented to him. He would 
listen patiently, ask a few questions, and in a short time 
grasp the whole subject. Then with wonderful quick- 
ness and unerring judgment he would render his decision. 
No one knew by what process he arrived at these con- 



WITH THE NEW YORK CENTRAL 231 

elusions. They seemed to be the results as much of 
inspiration as of insight. 

The Civil War closed in 1865, and one of its lessons 
had been the necessity for more railroads. The country 
had discovered that without transportation its vast and 
fertile territories could neither be populated nor made 
productive. Every mile of railroad carried settlers, 
opened farms and increased the national resources and 
wealth. The economical and critical conditions of the 
country, owing to the expansion of the currency and 
banking conditions, facilitated and encouraged vast 
schemes of railroad construction. This and a wild spec- 
ulation resulted in the panic of 1873. Nearly the whole 
country went bankrupt. The recovery was rapid, and 
the constructive talent of the Republic saw that the 
restoration of credit and prosperity must be led by rail- 
way solvency. In August, 1874, Commodore Vander- 
bilt invited the representatives of the other and competi- 
tive lines to a conference at Saratoga. Owing, however, 
to the jealousies and hostilities of the period, only the 
New York Central, the Pennsylvania, and the Erie rail- 
ways were represented. 

The eastern railway situation was then dominated by 
Commodore Vanderbilt, Colonel Thomas A. Scott, of the 
Pennsylvania, and John W. Garrett, of the Baltimore 
and Ohio. Both Scott and Garrett were original men 
and empire builders. There was neither governmental 
nor State regulation. The head of a railway system had 
practically unlimited power in the operation of his road. 
The people were so anxious for the construction of rail- 
ways that they offered every possible inducement to 
capital. The result was a great deal of unprofitable con- 
struction and immense losses to the promoters. 

These able men saw that there was no possibility of 



232 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

railway construction, operation, and efficiency, with a 
continuance of unrestricted competition. It has taken 
from 1874 until 1920 to educate the railway men, the 
shippers, and the government to a realization of the fact 
that transportation facilities required for the public 
necessities can only be had by the freest operations and 
the strictest government regulations; that the solution of 
the problem is a system so automatic that public arbitra- 
tion shall decide the justice of the demands of labor, and 
rates be advanced to meet the decision, and that public 
authority also shall take into consideration the other fac- 
tors of increased expenses and adequate facilities for the 
railroads, and that maintenance and the highest effi- 
ciency must be preserved and also necessary extensions. 
To satisfy and attract capital there must be the assur- 
ance of a reasonable return upon the investment. 

The meeting called by Commodore Vanderbilt in 1874, 
at Saratoga, was an epoch-making event. We must 
remember the railway management of the country was 
in the absolute control of about four men, two of whom 
were also largest owners of the lines they managed. 
Fierce competition and cutting of rates brought on utter 
demoralization among shippers, who could not calculate 
on the cost of transportation, and great favoritism to 
localities and individuals by irresponsible freight agents 
who controlled the rates. Under these influences rail- 
way earnings were fluctuating and uncertain. Improve- 
ments were delayed and the people on the weaker lines 
threatened with bankruptcy. 

Public opinion, however, believed this wild competi- 
tion to be the only remedy for admitted railway evils. 
As an illustration of the change of public opinion and 
the better understanding of the railway problems, this 



WITH THE NEW YORK CENTRAL 233 

occurred in the month of October, 1920. A committee 
of shippers and producers representing the farmers, 
manufacturers, and business men along a great railway 
system came to see the manager of the railroad and said 
to him: "We have been all wrong in the past. Our 
effort has always been for lower rates, regardless of the 
necessities of the railways. We have tried to get them 
by seeking bids from competing lines for our shipments 
and by appealing to the Interstate Commerce Commis- 
sion. The expenses of the railroads have been increased 
by demands of labor, by constantly rising prices and cost 
of rails, cars, terminals, and facilities, but we have been 
against allowing the railroads to meet this increased cost 
of operation by adequate advances in rates. We now 
see that this course was starving the railroads, and we 
are suffering for want of cars and locomotives to move 
our traffic and terminals to care for it. We are also suf- 
fering because the old treatment of the railroads has 
frightened capital so that the roads cannot get money to 
maintain their lines and make necessary improvements 
to meet the demands of business. We know now that 
rates make very little difference, because they can be 
absorbed in our business. What we must have is facili- 
ties to transport our products, and we want to help the 
railroads to get money and credit, and again we empha- 
size our whole trouble is want of cars, locomotives, and 
terminal facilities." 

Happily, public opinion was reflected in the last Con- 
gress in the passage of the Cummins-Esch bill, which is 
the most enlightened and adaptable legislation of the 
last quarter of a century. 

To return to the conference at Saratoga, the New 
York Central, the Pennsylvania, and the Erie came to 



234 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

the conclusion that they must have the co-operation of 
the Baltimore and Ohio. As Mr. Garrett, president and 
controlling owner of that road, would not come to the 
conference, the members decided that the emergency was 
so great that they must go to him. This was probably 
the most disagreeable thing Commodore Vanderbilt ever 
did. The marvellous success of his wonderful life had 
been won by fighting and defeating competitors. The 
peril was so great that they went as associates, and the 
visit interested the whole country and so enlarged Mr. 
Garrett's opinion of his power that he rejected their offer 
and said he would act independently. A railway war 
immediately followed, and in a short time bankruptcy 
threatened all lines, and none more than the Baltimore 
and Ohio. 

The trunk lines then got together and entered into an 
agreement to stabilize rates and carry them into effect. 
They appointed as commissioner Mr. Albert Fink, one 
of the ablest railway men of that time. Mr. Fink's ad- 
ministration was successful, but the rivalries and jeal- 
ousies of the lines and the frequent breaking of agree- 
ments were too much for one man. 

The presidents and general managers of all the rail- 
roads east of Chicago then met and formed an associa- 
tion, and this association was a legislative body without 
any legal authority to enforce its decrees. It had, how- 
ever, two effects: the disputes which arose were publicly 
discussed, and the merits of each side so completely dem- 
onstrated that the decision of the association came to 
be accepted as just and right. Then the verdict of the 
association had behind it the whole investment and 
banking community and the press. The weight of this 
was sufficient to compel obedience to its decisions by the 



WITH THE NEW YORK CENTRAL 235 

most rebellious member. No executive could continue 
to hold his position while endeavoring to break up the 
association. 

It is one of the most gratifying events of my life 
that my associates in this great and powerful association 
elected me their president, and I continued in office until 
the Supreme Court in a momentous decision declared 
that the railroads came under the provision of the Sher- 
man Anti-Trust Law and dissolved these associations in 
the East, West, and South. 

It was a liberal education of the railway problems to 
meet the men who became members of this association. 
Most of them left an indelible impression upon the rail- 
way conditions of the time and of the railway policies of 
the future. All were executives of great ability and sev- 
eral rare constructive geniuses. 

In our system there was John Newell, president of the 
Lake Shore and Michigan Southern, a most capable and 
efficient manager. Henry B. Ledyard, president of the 
Michigan Central, was admirably trained for the great 
responsibilities which he administered so well. There 
was William Bliss, president of the Boston and Albany, 
who had built up a line to be one of the strongest of the 
New England group. 

Melville E. Ingalls, president of the Cleveland, Cin- 
cinnati, Chicago and St. Louis, had combined various 
weak and bankrupt roads and made them an efficient 
organization. He had also rehabilitated and put in use- 
ful working and paying condition the Chesapeake and 
Ohio. 

Ingalls told me a very good story of himself. He had 
left the village in Maine, where he was born, and after 
graduation from college and admission to the bar had 



236 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

settled in Boston. To protect the interests of his clients 
he had moved to Cincinnati, Ohio, and rescued railroad 
properties in which they were interested. When his suc- 
cess was complete and he had under his control a large 
and successfully working railway system, he made a 
visit to his birthplace. 

One evening he went down to the store where the vil- 
lage congress was assembled, sitting on the barrels and 
the counter. They welcomed him very cordially, and 
then an inquisitive farmer said to him: "Melville, it is 
reported around here that you are getting a salary of 
nigh unto ten thousand dollars a year." 

Mr. Ingalls, who was getting several times that 
amount, modestly admitted the ten, which was a pro- 
digious sum in that rural neighborhood. Whereupon 
the old farmer voiced the local sentiment by saying: 
"Well, Melville, that shows what cheek and circum- 
stances can do for a man." 

I recall an incident connected with one of the ablest 
of the executives in our system. One day we had a con- 
ference of rival interests, and many executives were 
there in the effort to secure an adjustment. For this 
purpose we had an arbitrator. After a most exhausting 
day in the battle of wits and experience for advantages, 
I arrived home used up, but after a half-hour's sleep I 
awoke refreshed and, consulting my diary, found I was 
down for a speech at a banquet at Delmonico's that 
night. 

I arrived late, the intervening time being devoted to 
intensive and rapid preparation. I was called early. 
The speech attracted attention and occupied a column in 
the morning's papers. I was in bed at eleven o'clock 
and had between seven and eight hours' refreshing sleep. 



WITH THE NEW YORK CENTRAL 237 

On arriving at our meeting-place the next morning, 
one of the best-known presidents took me aside and 
said: "Chauncey, by making speeches such as you did 
last night you are losing the confidence of the people. 
They say you cannot prepare such speeches and give 
proper attention to your business." 

'Well," I said to him, "my friend, did I lose anything 
before the arbitrator yesterday?" 

He answered very angrily: "No, you gained entirely 
too much." 

'Well," I then said, "I am very fresh this morning. 
But what did you do last night?" 

He answered that he was so exhausted that he went 
to Delmonico's and ordered the best dinner possible. 
Then he went on to say: "A friend told me a little game 
was going on up-stairs, and in a close room filled with 
tobacco smoke I played poker until two o'clock and 
drank several high-balls. The result is, I think we bet- 
ter postpone this meeting, for I do not feel like doing 
anything to-day." 

"My dear friend," I said, "you will get the credit of 
giving your whole time to business, while I am by doing 
what refreshes my mind discredited, because it gets in 
the papers. I shall keep my method regardless of con- 
sequences." 

He kept his, and although much younger than myself 
died years ago. 

George B. Roberts, president of the Pennsylvania, was 
a very wise executive and of all-around ability. Frank 
Thompson, vice-president and afterwards president of 
the same road, was one of the ablest operating officers of 
his time and a most delightful personality. Mr. A. J. 
Cassatt was a great engineer and possessed rare foresight 



238 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

and vision. He brought the Pennsylvania into New 
York City through a tunnel under the Hudson River, 
continued the tunnel across the city to the East River 
and then under the river to connect with the Long 
Island, which he had acquired for his system. 

D. W. Caldwell, president of the New York, Chicago, 
and St. Louis, added to railway ability wit and humor. 
He told a good story on Mr. George Roberts. Caldwell 
was at one time division superintendent under President 
Roberts. He had obtained permission to build a new 
station-house, in whose plan and equipment he was 
deeply interested. It was Mr. Roberts's habit, by way 
of showing his subordinates that he was fully aware of 
their doings, to either add or take away something from 
their projects. 

Caldwell prepared a station-house according to his 
ideas, and, to prevent Roberts from making any essential 
changes he added an unnecessary bay window to the 
front of the passengers' room. Roberts carefully exam- 
ined the plans and said: "Remove that bay window," 
and then approved the plan, and Caldwell had what 
he wanted. 

Caldwell used to tell of another occasion when on a 
Western line he had over him a very severe and harsh 
disciplinarian as president. This president was a violent 
prohibitionist and had heard that Caldwell was a bon- 
vivant. He sent for Caldwell to discipline or discharge 
him. After a long and tiresome journey Caldwell arrived 
at the president's house. His first greeting was: "Mr. 
Caldwell, do you drink?" 

Caldwell, wholly unsuspicious, answered: "Thank you, 
Mr. President, I am awfully tired and will take a little 
rye. 



WITH THE NEW YORK CENTRAL 239 

Mr. E. B. Thomas, president of the Lehigh Valley, 
was a valuable member of the association. The Balti- 
more and Ohio, as usual, had its president, Mr. Charles 
F. Mayer, accompanied by an able staff. The Erie was 
represented by one of the most capable and genial of its 
many presidents, Mr. John King. 

King was a capital story-teller, and among them I 
remember this one: At one time he was general man- 
ager of the Baltimore and Ohio under John W. Garrett. 
In order to raise money for his projected extensions, 
Garrett had gone to Europe. The times were finan- 
cially very difficult. Johns Hopkins, the famous philan- 
thropist, died. His immortal monument is the Johns 
Hopkins University and Medical School. Everybody in 
Baltimore attended the funeral. Among the leading per- 
sons present was another John King, a banker, who was 
Hopkins's executor. A messenger-boy rushed in with 
a cable for John King, and handed it to John King, 
the executor, who sat at the head of the mourners. 
He read it and then passed it along so that each one 
could read it until it reached John King, of the Balti- 
more and Ohio, who sat at the foot of the line. The 
cable read as follows: "Present my sympathies to the 
family and my high appreciation of Mr. Johns Hopkins, 
and borrow from the executor all you can at five per 
cent. Garrett." 

Commodore Vanderbilt was succeeded in the presi- 
dency by his son, William H. Vanderbilt, who was then 
past forty years old and had been a successful farmer on 
Staten Island. He was active in neighborhood affairs 
and in politics. This brought him in close contact with 
the people and was of invaluable benefit to him when he 
became president of a great railroad corporation. He 



2 4 o CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

also acquired familiarity in railway management as a 
director of one on Staten Island. 

Mr. William H. Vanderbilt was a man of great ability, 
and his education made him in many ways an abler man 
than his father for the new conditions he had to meet. 
But, like many a capable son of a famous father, he did 
not receive the credit which was due him because of 
the overshadowing reputation of the commodore. Never- 
theless, on several occasions he exhibited the highest 
executive qualities. 

One of the great questions of the time was the duty of 
railroads to the cities in which they terminated, and the 
decision of the roads south of New York to have lower 
rates to Philadelphia and Baltimore. New York felt so 
secure in the strength of its unrivalled harbor and supe- 
rior shipping facilities that the merchants and financiers 
were not alarmed. Very soon, however, there was such 
a diversion of freight from New York as to threaten very 
seriously its export trade and the superiority of its port. 
The commercial leaders of the city called upon Mr. Van- 
derbilt, who after the conference said to them: "I will 
act in perfect harmony with you and will see that the 
New York Central Railroad protects New York City 
regardless of the effect upon its finances." The city rep- 
resentatives said: "That is very fine, and we will stand 
together." 

Mr. Vanderbilt immediately issued a statement that 
the rates to the seaboard should be the same to all ports, 
and that the New York Central would meet the lowest 
rates to any port by putting the same in effect on its own 
lines. The result was the greatest railroad war since 
railroads began to compete. Rates fell fifty per cent, 
and it was a question of the survival of the fittest. 



WITH THE NEW YORK CENTRAL 241 

Commerce returned to New York, and the competing 
railroads, to avoid bankruptcy, got together and formed 
the Trunk Line Association. 

New York City has not always remembered how inti- 
mately bound is its prosperity with that of the great 
railroad whose terminal is within its city limits. Mr. 
Vanderbilt found that the railroad and its management 
were fiercely assailed in the press, in the legislature, and 
in municipal councils. He became convinced that no 
matter how wise or just or fair the railroad might be in 
the interests of every community and every business 
which were so dependent upon its transportation, the 
public would not submit to any great line being owned 
by one man. The Vanderbilt promptness in arriving at 
a decision was immediately shown. He called upon Mr. 
Pierpont Morgan, and through him a syndicate, which 
Morgan formed, took and sold the greater part of Mr. 
Vanderbilt's New York Central stock. The result was 
that the New York Central from that time was owned 
by the public. It is a tribute to the justice and fairness 
of the Vanderbilt management that though the manage- 
ment has been submitted every year since to a stock- 
holders' vote, there has practically never been any oppo- 
sition to a continuance of the Vanderbilt policy and 
management. 

Among the most important of the many problems 
during Mr. Vanderbilt's presidency was the question of 
railway commissions, both in national and State govern- 
ments. In my professional capacity of general counsel, 
and in common with representatives of other railroads, 
I delivered argumentative addresses against them. The 
discussions converted me, and I became convinced of 
their necessity. The rapidly growing importance of 



242 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

railway transportation had created the public opinion 
that railway management should be under the control 
and supervision of some public body; that all passengers 
or shippers, or those whose land was taken for construc- 
tion and development, should have an appeal from the 
decision of the railway managers to the government 
through a government commission. 

As soon as I was convinced that commissions were 
necessary for the protection of both the public and the 
railroads, I presented this view to Mr. Vanderbilt. The 
idea was contrary to his education, training, and opinion. 
It seemed to me that it was either a commission or gov- 
ernment ownership, and that the commission, if strength- 
ened as a judicial body, would be as much of a protec- 
tion to the bond and stock holders and the investing 
public as to the general public and the employees. Mr. 
Vanderbilt, always open-minded, adopted this view and 
supported the commission system and favored legisla- 
tion in its behalf. 

In 1883 Mr. Vanderbilt decided, on account of illness, 
to retire from the presidency, and Mr. James H. Rutter 
was elected his successor. Mr. Rutter was the ablest 
freight manager in the country, but his health gave way 
under the exactions of executive duties, and I acted 
largely for him during his years of service. He died 
early in 1885, and I was elected president. 

The war with the West Shore had been on for several 
years, with disastrous results to both companies. The 
Ontario and Western, which had large terminal facilities 
near Jersey City on the west side of the Hudson, ran for 
fifty miles along the river before turning into the interior. 
At its reorganization it had ten millions of cash in the 
treasury. With this as a basis, its directors decided to 



WITH THE NEW YORK CENTRAL 243 

organize a new railroad, to be called the West Shore, 
and parallel the New York Central through its entire 
length to Buffalo. As the New York Central efficiently 
served this whole territory, the only business the West 
Shore could get must be taken away from the Central. 
To attract this business it offered at all stations lower 
rates. To retain and hold its business the New York 
Central met those rates at all points so that financially 
the West Shore went into the hands of a receiver. 

The New York Central was sustained because of 
its superior facilities and connections and established 
roadway and equipment. But all new and necessary 
construction was abandoned, maintenance was neglected, 
and equipment run down under forced reduction of 
expenses. 

I had very friendly personal relations with the man- 
agers and officers of the West Shore, and immediately 
presented to them a plan for the absorption of their line, 
instead of continuing the struggle until absolute exhaus- 
tion. Mr. Vanderbilt approved of the plan, as did the 
financial interests represented by Mr. Pierpont Morgan. 

By the reorganization and consolidation of the two 
companies the New York Central began gradually to 
establish its efficiency and to work on necessary improve- 
ments. As evidence of the growth of the railway busi- 
ness of the country, the New York Central proper has 
added since the reorganization an enormous amount of 
increased trackage, and has practically rebuilt, as a nec- 
essary second line, the West Shore and used fully its 
very large terminal facilities on the Jersey side of the 
Hudson. 

During his active life Mr. Vanderbilt was very often 
importuned to buy a New York daily newspaper. He 



244 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

was personally bitterly assailed and his property put in 
peril by attacks in the press. He always rejected the 
proposition to buy one. "If," he said, "I owned a news- 
paper, I would have all the others united in attacking 
me, and they would ruin me, but by being utterly out of 
the journalistic field, I find that taking the press as a 
whole I am fairly well treated. I do not believe any 
great interest dealing with the public can afford to have 
an organ." 

Colonel Scott, of the Pennsylvania, thought other- 
wise, but the result of his experiment demonstrated 
the accuracy of Mr. Vanderbilt's judgment. Scott 
selected as editor of the New York World one of the most 
brilliant journalistic writers of his time, William H. 
Hurlburt. When it became known, however, that the 
World belonged to Colonel Scott, Hurlburt's genius could 
not save it. The circulation ran down to a minimum, 
the advertising followed suit, and the paper was losing 
enormously every month. Mr. Joseph Pulitzer, with the 
rare insight and foresight which distinguished him, saw 
what could be made of the World, with its privileges in 
the Associated Press, and so he paid Scott the amount 
he had originally invested, and took over and made a 
phenomenal success of this bankrupt and apparently 
hopeless enterprise. 

I tried during my presidency to make the New York 
Central popular with the public without impairing its 
efficiency. The proof of the success of this was that 
without any effort on my part and against my published 
wishes the New York delegation in the national Repub- 
lican convention in 1888, with unprecedented unanimity, 
presented me as New York's candidate for president. I 
retired from the contest because of the intense hostility 



WITH THE NEW YORK CENTRAL 245 

to railroad men in the Western States. Those States 
could not understand how this hostility, which they had 
to railroads and everybody connected with them, had 
disappeared in the great State of New York. 

During my presidency the labor question was very 
acute and strikes, one after another, common. The uni- 
versal method of meeting the demands of labor at that 
time was to have a committee of employees or a leader 
present the grievances to the division superintendent or 
the superintendent of motive power. These officers were 
arbitrary and hostile, as the demands, if acceded to, led 
to an increase of expenses which would make them un- 
popular with the management. They had a difficult 
position. The employees often came to the conclusion 
that the only way for them to compel the attention of 
the higher officers and directors was to strike. 

Against the judgment of my associates in the railway 
management I decided to open my doors to any indi- 
vidual or committee of the company. At first I was 
overwhelmed with petty grievances, but when the men 
understood that their cases would be immediately heard 
and acted upon, they decided among themselves not to 
bring to me any matters unless they regarded them of 
vital importance. In this way many of the former irri- 
tations, which led ultimately to serious results, no longer 
appeared. 

I had no trouble with labor unions, and found their 
representatives in heart-to-heart talks very generally 
reasonable. Mr. Arthur, chief of the Brotherhood of 
Locomotive Engineers, had many of the qualities of a 
statesman. He built up his organization to be the 
strongest of its kind among the labor unions. I enjoyed 
his confidence and friendship for many years. 



246 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

There never was but one strike on the New York Cen- 
tral during my administration, and that one occurred 
while I was absent in Europe. Its origin and sequel 
were somewhat dramatic. I had nearly broken down by 
overwork, and the directors advised me to take an abso- 
lute rest and a trip abroad. 

I sent word over the line that I wanted everything 
settled before leaving, and to go without care. A large 
committee appeared in my office a few mornings after. 
To my surprise there was a representative from every 
branch of the service, passenger and freight conductors, 
brakemen, shopmen, yardmen, switchmen, and so forth. 
These had always come through their local unions. I 
rapidly took up and adjusted what each one of the repre- 
sentatives of his order claimed, and then a man said: "I 
represent the locomotive engineers." 

My response was: "You have no business here, and I 
will have nothing to do with you. I will see no one of the 
locomotive engineers, except their accredited chief officer." 

"Well," he said, "Mr. President, there is a new condi- 
tion on the road, a new order of labor called the Knights 
of Labor. We are going to absorb all the other unions 
and have only one. The only obstacle in the way is the 
locomotive engineers, who refuse to give up their broth- 
erhood and come in with us, but if you will recognize us 
only, that will force them to join. Now, the Brother- 
hood intends to present a demand very soon, and if you 
will recognize our order, the Knights of Labor, and not 
the Brotherhood of Locomotive Engineers, we will take 
care of what they demand and all others from every de- 
partment for two years, and you can take your trip to 
Europe in perfect peace of mind. If you do not do this 
there will be trouble." 



WITH THE NEW YORK CENTRAL 247 

I declined to deal with them as representatives of 
the Brotherhood of Locomotive Engineers. Then their 
spokesman said: "As this is so serious to you, we will 
give you to-night to think it over and come back in the 
morning." 

I immediately sent for the superintendent of motive 
power and directed him to have posted by telegraph in 
every roundhouse that the request of the Brotherhood 
of Locomotive Engineers, of which this committee had 
told me, had been granted. The next morning the com- 
mittee returned, and their leader said: "Well, Mr. Presi- 
dent, you have beaten us and we are going home." 

Then I appealed to them, saying: "I am a pretty 
badly broken-up man. The doctors tell me that if I can 
have three months without care I will be as good as ever. 
You must admit that I have at all times been absolutely 
square with you and tried to adjust fairly the matters 
you have brought to me. Now, will you take care of me 
while I am absent?" 

They answered unanimously: "Mr. President, we will, 
and you can be confident there will be no trouble on the 
New York Central while you are away." 

I sailed with my mind free from anxiety, hopeful and 
happy, leaving word to send me no cables or letters. 
After a visit to the Passion Play at Ober-Ammergau in 
Upper Bavaria, I went into the Austrian Tyrol. One 
night, at a hotel in Innsbruck, Mr. Graves, a very enter- 
prising reporter of a New York paper, suddenly burst 
into my room and said: "I have been chasing you all 
over Europe for an interview on the strike on the New 
York Central." This was my first information of the 
strike. 

As soon as I had left New York and was on the ocean, 



248 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

the young and ambitious officers who were at the head 
of the operations of the railroad and disapproved of my 
method of dealing with the employees, discharged every 
member of the committee who had called upon me. Of 
course, this was immediately followed by a sympathetic 
outburst in their behalf, and the sympathizers were also 
discharged. Then the whole road was tied up by a uni- 
versal strike. After millions had been lost in revenue by 
the railroad and in wages by the men, the strike was 
settled, as usual, by a compromise, but it gave to the 
Knights of Labor the control, except as to the Brother- 
hood of Locomotive Engineers. The early settlement of 
the strike was largely due to the loyalty and courage of 
the Brotherhood. 

During my presidency I was much criticised by the 
public, but never by the directors of the company, be- 
cause of my activities in politics and on the platform. 
For some time, when the duties of my office became most 
onerous, and I was in the habit of working all day and 
far into the night, I discovered that this concentrated 
attention to my railroad problems and intense and con- 
tinuous application to their solution was not only im- 
pairing my efficiency but my health. As I was not a 
sport, and never had time for games or horses, I decided 
to try a theory, which was that one's daily duties occupied 
certain cells of the brain while the others remained idle; 
that the active cells became tired by overwork while 
others lost their power in a measure by idleness; that if, 
after a reasonable use of the working cells, you would 
engage in some other intellectual occupation, it would 
furnish as much relief or recreation as outdoor exercise 
of any kind. I had a natural facility for quick and 
easy preparation for public speaking, and so adopted 



WITH THE NEW YORK CENTRAL 249 

that as my recreation. The result proved entirely suc- 
cessful. 

After a hard day's work, on coming home late in the 
afternoon, I accustomed myself to take a short nap of 
about fifteen minutes. Then I would look over my tab- 
lets to see if any engagement was on to speak in the 
evening, and, if so, the preparation of the speech might 
be easy, or, if difficult, cause me to be late at dinner. 
These speeches were made several times a week, and 
mainly at banquets on closing of the sessions of conven- 
tions of trade organizations of the country. The recip- 
rocal favors and friendship of these delegates transferred 
to the New York Central a large amount of competitive 
business. 

While I was active in politics I issued strict orders 
that every employee should have the same liberty, and 
that any attempt on the part of their superior officers to 
influence or direct the political action of a subordinate 
would be cause for dismissal. This became so well 
known that the following incident, which was not un- 
common, will show the result. 

As I was taking the train the morning after having 
made a political speech at Utica, the yardmaster, an 
Irishman, greeted me very cordially and then said: "We 
were all up to hear ye last night, boss, but this year we 
are agin ye." 

The position which this activity gave me in my own 
party, and the fact that, unlike most employers, I pro- 
tected the employees in their liberty and political action, 
gave me immense help in protecting the company from 
raids and raiders. 

We had a restaurant in the station at Utica which had 
deteriorated. The situation was called to my attention 



2 5 o CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

in order to have the evils corrected by the receipt of the 
following letter from an indignant passenger: "Dear Mr. 
President: You are the finest after-dinner speaker in the 
world. I would give a great deal to hear the speech you 
would make after you had dined in the restaurant in 
your station at Utica." 

After thirteen years of service as president I was 
elected chairman of the board of directors. Mr. Samuel 
R. Callaway succeeded me as president, and on his resig- 
nation was succeeded by Mr. William H. Newman, and 
upon his resignation Mr. W. C. Brown became president. 
Following Mr. Brown, Mr. Alfred H. Smith was elected 
and is still in office. All these officers were able and did 
excellent service, but I want to pay special tribute to 
Mr. Smith. 

Mr. Smith is one of the ablest operating officers of his 
time. When the United States Government took over 
the railroads he was made regional director of the gov- 
ernment for railroads in this territory. He received the 
highest commendation from the government and from 
the owners of the railroads for the admirable way in 
which he had maintained them and their efficiency dur- 
ing the government control. 

On the surrender of the railroads by the government, 
Mr. Smith was welcomed back by his directors to the 
presidency of the New York Central. The splendid con- 
dition of the Central and its allied lines is largely due to 
him. During his service as regional director the difficult 
task of the presidency of the New York Central was 
very ably performed by Mr. William K. Vanderbilt, Jr. 
Though the youngest among the executive officers of the 
railroads of the country, he was at the same time one of 
the best. 



WITH THE NEW YORK CENTRAL 251 

Among the efficient officers who have served the New 
York Central during the time I have been with the com- 
pany, I remember many on account of their worth and 
individuality. H. Walter Webb came into the railway 
service from an active business career. With rare in- 
telligence and industry he rapidly rose in the organiza- 
tion and was a very capable and efficient officer. There 
was F. W. Voorhees, the general superintendent, an un- 
usually young man for such a responsible position. He 
was a graduate of Troy Polytechnical School and a very 
able operating officer. Having gone directly from the 
college to a responsible position, he naturally did not 
understand or know how to handle men until after long 
experience. He showed that want of experience in a 
very drastic way in the strike of 1892 and its settlement. 
Being very arbitrary, he had his own standards. For in- 
stance, I was appealed to by many old brakemen and 
conductors whom he had discharged. I mention one 
particularly, who had been on the road for twenty-five 
years. Voorhees's answer to me was: "These old em- 
ployees are devoted to Toucey, my predecessor, and for 
efficient work I must have loyalty to me." 

I reversed his order and told him I would begin to dis- 
charge, if necessary, the latest appointments, including 
himself, keeping the older men in the service who had 
proved their loyalty to the company by the performance 
of their duties. 

Mr. Voorhees became afterwards vice-president and 
then president of the Philadelphia and Reading. With 
experience added to his splendid equipment and unusual 
ability he became one of the best executives in the 
country. 

Mr. John M. Toucey, who had come up from the bot- 



252 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

torn to be general superintendent and general manager, 
was a hard student. His close contact with his fellow 
employees gave him wonderful control over men. He 
supplemented his practical experience by hard study and 
was very well educated. Though self-taught, he had no 
confidence in the graduates of the professional schools. 

In selecting an assistant, one of them told me that 
Toucey subjected him to a rigid examination and then 
said: "What is your railroad career?" 

"I began at the bottom," answered the assistant, "and 
have filled every office on my old road up to division 
superintendent, which I have held for so many years." 

"That is very fine," said Toucey, "but are you a 
graduate of the Troy Technical School?" 

"No, sir." 

"Of the Stevens Tech.?" 

"No, sir." 

"Of Massachusetts Tech.?" 

"No, sir." 

"Then you are engaged," said Toucey. 

Mr. Toucey was well up-to-date, and differed from 
a superintendent on another road in which I was a 
director. The suburban business of that line had in- 
creased very rapidly, but there were not enough trains or 
cars to accommodate the passengers. The overcrowding 
caused many serious discomforts. I had the superin- 
tendent called before the board of directors, and said to 
him: "Why don't you immediately put on more trains 
and cars?" 

"Why, Mr. Depew," he answered, "what would be 
the use? They are settling so fast along the line that 
the people would fill them up and overcrowd them just 
as before." 



WITH THE NEW YORK CENTRAL 253 

I was going over the line on an important tour at one 
time with John Burroughs, superintendent of the West- 
ern Division. We were on his pony engine, with seats 
at the front, alongside the boiler, so that we could look 
directly on the track. Burroughs sat on one side and I 
on the other. He kept on commenting aloud by way of 
dictating to his stenographer, who sat behind him, and 
praise and criticism followed rapidly. I heard him utter 
in his monotonous way: "Switch misplaced, we will all 
be in hell in a minute," and then a second afterwards 
continue: "We jumped the switch and are on the track 
again. Discharge that switchman." 

Major Enos Priest was for fifty years a division super- 
intendent. It was a delightful experience to go with him 
over his division. He knew everybody along the line, 
was general confidant in their family troubles and arbiter 
in neighborhood disputes. He knew personally every 
employee and his characteristics and domestic situation. 
The wives were generally helping him to keep their hus- 
bands from making trouble. To show his control and 
efficiency, he was always predicting labor troubles and 
demonstrating that the reason they did not occur was 
because of the way in which he handled the situation. 

Mr. C. M. Bissell was a very efficient superintendent, 
and for a long time in charge of the Harlem Railroad. 
He told me this incident. We decided to put in effect as 
a check upon the conductors a system by which a con- 
ductor, when a fare was paid on the train, must tear 
from a book a receipt which he gave to the passenger, 
and mark the amount on the stub from which the receipt 
was torn. Soon after a committee of conductors called 
upon Mr. Bissell and asked for an increase of pay. "Why," 
Bissell asked, "boys, why do you ask for that now?" 



254 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

After a rather embarrassing pause the oldest con- 
ductor said: "Mr. Bissell, you have been a conductor 
yourself." 

This half-century and six years during which I have 
been in the service of the New York Central Railroad 
has been a time of unusual pleasure and remarkably free 
from friction or trouble. In this intimate association 
with the railroad managers of the United States I have 
found the choicest friendships and the most enduring. 
The railroad manager is rarely a large stockholder, but 
he is a most devoted and efficient officer of his company. 
He gives to its service, for the public, the employees, the 
investors, and the company, all that there is in him. In 
too many instances, because these officers do not get 
relief from their labor by variation of their work, they 
die exhausted before their time. 

The story graphically told by one of the oldest and 
ablest of railroad men, Mr. Marvin Hughitt, for a long 
time president and now chairman of the Chicago and 
Northwestern Railway, illustrates what the railroad does 
for the country. Twenty-five years ago the North- 
western extended its lines through Northern Iowa. Mr. 
Hughitt drove over the proposed extension on a buck- 
board. The country was sparsely settled because the 
farmers could not get their products to market, and the 
land was selling at six dollars per acre. 

In a quarter of a century prosperous villages and cities 
had grown up along the line, and farms were selling at 
over three hundred dollars per acre. While this enor- 
mous profit from six dollars per acre to over three hun- 
dred has come to the settlers who held on to their farms 
because of the possibilities produced by the railroad, the 
people whose capital built the road must remain satisfied 



WITH THE NEW YORK CENTRAL 255 

with a moderate return by way of dividend and interest, 
and without any enhancement of their capital, but those 
investors should be protected by the State and the 
people to whom their capital expenditures have been 
such an enormous benefit. 



XIX 

RECOLLECTIONS FROM ABROAD 

I know of nothing more delightful for a well-read 
American than to visit the scenes in Great Britain with 
which he has become familiar in his reading. No matter 
how rapidly he may travel, if he goes over the places 
made memorable by Sir Walter Scott in the " Waverley 
Novels," and in his poems, he will have had impressions, 
thrills, and educational results which will be a pleasure 
for the rest of his life. The same is true of an ardent 
admirer of Dickens or of Thackeray, in following the 
footsteps of their heroes and heroines. I gained a liberal 
education and lived over again the reading and studies 
of a lifetime in my visits to England, Ireland, Scotland, 
and Wales. I also had much the same experience of 
vivifying and spiritualizing my library in France, Italy, 
Germany, Belgium, and Holland. 

London is always most hospitable and socially the 

most delightful of cities. While Mr. Gladstone was 

prime minister and more in the eyes of the world than 

any statesman of any country, a dinner was given to 

him with the special object of having me meet him. 

The ladies and gentlemen at the dinner were all people 

of note. Among them were two American bishops. The 

arrangement made by the host and hostess was that 

when the ladies left the dining-room I should take the 

place made vacant alongside Mr. Gladstone, but one of 

the American bishops, who in his younger days was a 

256 



RECOLLECTIONS FROM ABROAD 257 

famous athlete, made a flying leap for that chair and no 
sooner landed than he at once proposed to Mr. Glad- 
stone this startling question: "As the bishop of the old 
Catholic Church in Germany does not recognize the 
authority of the pope, how can he receive absolution?" 
— and some other abstruse theological questions. This 
at once aroused Mr. Gladstone, who, when once started, 
was stopped with difficulty, and there was no pause until 
the host announced that the gentlemen should join the 
ladies. I made it a point at the next dinner given for 
me to meet Mr. Gladstone that there should be no 
American bishops present. 

At another time, upon arriving at my hotel in London 
from New York, I found a note from Lord Rosebery say- 
ing that Mr. Gladstone was dining with Lady Rosebery 
and himself that evening, and there would be no other 
guests, and inviting me to come. I arrived early and 
found Mr. Gladstone already there. While the custom in 
London society then was for the guests to be late, Mr. 
Gladstone was always from fifteen minutes to half an 
hour in advance of the time set by his invitation. He 
greeted me with great cordiality, and at once what were 
known as the Gladstone tentacles were fastened on me 
for information. It was a peculiarity with the grand old 
man that he extracted from a stranger practically all the 
man knew, and the information was immediately assimi- 
lated in his wonderful mind. He became undoubtedly 
the best-informed man on more subjects than anybody 
in the world. 

Mr. Gladstone said to me: "It has been raining here 
for forty days. What is the average rainfall in the 
United States and in New York?" If there was any 
subject about which I knew less than another, it was the 



258 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

meteorological conditions in America. He then con- 
tinued with great glee: "Our friend, Lord Rosebery, has 
everything and knows everything, so it is almost impos- 
sible to find for him something new. Great books are 
common, but I have succeeded in my explorations among 
antiquarian shops in discovering the most idiotic book 
that ever was written. It was by an old lord mayor of 
London, who filled a volume with his experiences in an 
excursion on the Thames, which is the daily experience 
of every Englishman." To the disappointment of Mr. 
Gladstone, Lord Rosebery also had that book. The 
evening was a memorable one for me. 

After a most charming time and dinner, while Lord 
Rosebery went off to meet an engagement to speak at a 
meeting of colonial representatives, Lady Rosebery took 
Mr. Gladstone and myself to the opera at Covent Gar- 
den. There was a critical debate on in the House of 
Commons, and the whips were running in to inform him 
of the progress of the battle and to get instructions from 
the great leader. 

During the entr'actes Mr. Gladstone most interestingly 
talked of his sixty years' experience of the opera. He 
knew all the great operas of that period, and criticised 
with wonderful skill the composers and their character- 
istics. He gave a word picture of all the great artists 
who had appeared on the English stage and the merits 
and demerits of each. A stranger listening to him would 
have said that a veteran musical critic, who had devoted 
his life to that and nothing else, was reminiscing. He 
said that thirty years before the manager of Covent 
Garden had raised the pitch, that this had become so 
difficult that most of the artists, to reach it, used the 
tremolo, and that the tremolo had taken away from him 



RECOLLECTIONS FROM ABROAD 259 

the exquisite pleasure which he formerly had in listening 
to an opera. 

Mr. Gladstone was at that time the unquestionable 
master of the House of Commons and its foremost ora- 
tor. I unfortunately never heard him at his best, but 
whether the question was of greater or lesser importance, 
the appearance of Mr. Gladstone at once lifted it above 
ordinary discussion to high debate. 

Mr. Gladstone asked many questions about large for- 
tunes in the United States, was curious about the meth- 
ods of their accumulation, and whether they survived in 
succeeding generations. He wanted to know all about 
the reputed richest man among them. I told him I did 
not know the amount of his wealth, but that it was at 
least one hundred millions of dollars. 

"How invested?" he asked. 

I answered: "All in fluid securities which could be 
turned into cash in a short time." 

He became excited at that and said: "Such a man is 
dangerous not only to his own country but to the world. 
With that amount of ready money he could upset the 
exchanges and paralyze the borrowing power of nations." 

"But," I said, "you have enormous fortunes," and 
mentioned the Duke of Westminster. 

"I know every pound of Westminster's wealth," he 
said. "It is in lands which he cannot sell, and bur- 
dened with settlements of generations and obligations 
which cannot be avoided." 

"How about the Rothschilds?" I asked. 

"Their fortunes," he answered, "are divided among 
the firms in London, Paris, Vienna, and Frankfort, and 
it would be impossible for them to be combined and 
used to unsettle the markets of the world. But 



2 6o CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

Mr. could do this and prevent governments from 

meeting their obligations." 

Mr. Gladstone had no hostility to great fortunes, how- 
ever large, unless so invested as to be immediately avail- 
able by a single man for speculation. But fortunes 
larger than that of one hundred millions have since been 
acquired, and their management is so conservative that 
they are brakes and safeguards against unreasoning 
panics. The majority of them have been used for pub- 
lic benefit. The most conspicuous instances are the 
Rockefeller Foundation, the Carnegie Endowment, and 
the Frick Creation. 

Henry Labouchere told me a delightful story of Mr. 
Gladstone's first meeting with Robert T. Lincoln, when 
he arrived in London as American minister. Mr. Lin- 
coln became in a short time after his arrival one of the 
most popular of the distinguished list of American rep- 
resentatives to Great Britain. He was especially noted 
for the charm of his conversation. Labouchere said that 
Mr. Gladstone told him that he was very anxious to 
meet Mr. Lincoln, both because he was the new minister 
from the United States and because of his great father, 
President Lincoln. Labouchere arranged for a dinner at 
his house, which was an hour in the country from Mr. 
Gladstone's city residence. Mrs. Gladstone made Mr. 
Labouchere promise, as a condition for permitting her 
husband to go, that Mr. Gladstone should be back inside 
of his home at ten o'clock. 

The dinner had no sooner started than some question 
arose which not only interested but excited Mr. Glad- 
stone. He at once entered upon an eloquent monologue 
on the subject. There was no possibility of interruption 
by any one, and Mr. Lincoln had no chance whatever to 



RECOLLECTIONS FROM ABROAD 261 

interpose a remark. When the clock was nearing eleven 
Labouchere interrupted this torrent of talk by saying: 
"Mr. Gladstone, it is now eleven; it is an hour's ride to 
London, and I promised Mrs. Gladstone to have you 
back at ten." When they were seated in the carriage 
Labouchere said to Mr. Gladstone: "Well, you have 
passed an evening with Mr. Lincoln; what do you think 
of him?" He replied: "Mr. Lincoln is a charming per- 
sonality, but he does not seem to have much conversa- 
tion. 

Among the very able men whom I met in London was 
Joseph Chamberlain. When I first met him he was one 
of Mr. Gladstone's trusted lieutenants. He was a capi- 
tal speaker, a close and incisive debater, and a shrewd 
politician. When he broke with Mr. Gladstone, he re- 
tained his hold on his constituency and continued to be 
a leader in the opposite party. 

Mr. Chamberlain told me that in a critical debate in 
the House of Commons, when the government was in 
danger, Mr. Gladstone, who alone could save the situa- 
tion, suddenly disappeared. Every known resort of his 
was searched to find him. Mr. Chamberlain, recollect- 
ing Mr. Gladstone's interest in a certain subject, drove 
to the house of the lady whose authority on that subject 
Mr. Gladstone highly respected. He found him submit- 
ting to the lady for her criticism and correction some of 
Watts's hymns, which he had translated into Italian. 

The British Government sent Mr. Chamberlain to 
America, and he had many public receptions given him 
by our mercantile and other bodies. On account of his 
separating from Mr. Gladstone on Home Rule, he met 
with a great deal of hostility here from the Irish. I was 
present at a public dinner where the interruptions and 



262 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

hostile demonstrations were very pronounced. But Mr. 
Chamberlain won his audience by his skill and fighting 
qualities. 

I gave him a dinner at my house and had a number of 
representative men to meet him. He made the occasion 
exceedingly interesting by presenting views of domestic 
conditions in England and international ones with this 
country, which were quite new to us. 

Mr. Chamberlain was a guest on the Teutonic at the 
famous review of the British navy celebrating Queen 
Victoria's jubilee, where I had the pleasure of again 
meeting him. He had recently married Miss Endicott, 
the charming daughter of our secretary of war, and 
everybody appreciated that it was a British statesman's 
honeymoon. 

He gave me a dinner in London, at which were present 
a large company, and two subjects came under very 
acute discussion. There had been a recent marriage in 
high English society, where there were wonderful pedi- 
gree and relationships on both sides, but no money. It 
finally developed, however, that under family settle- 
ments the young couple might have fifteen hundred 
pounds a year, or seven thousand five hundred dollars. 
The decision was unanimous that they could get along 
very well and maintain their position on this sum and be 
able to reciprocate reasonably the attentions they would 
receive. Nothing could better illustrate the terrific in- 
crease in the cost of living than the contrast between 
then and now. 

Some one of the guests at the dinner said that the 
Americans by the introduction of slang were ruining the 
English language. Mr. James Russell Lowell had come 
evidently prepared for this controversy. He said that 



RECOLLECTIONS FROM ABROAD 263 

American slang was the common language of that part 
of England from which the Pilgrims sailed, and that it 
had been preserved in certain parts of the United States, 
notably northern New England. He then produced an 
old book, a sort of dictionary of that period, and proved 
his case. It was a surprise to everybody to know that 
American slang was really classic English, and still 
spoken in the remoter parts of Massachusetts and New 
Hampshire, though no longer in use in England. 

The period of Mr. Gladstone's reign as prime minister 
was one of the most interesting for an American visitor 
who had the privilege of knowing him and the eminent 
men who formed his Cabinet. The ladies of the Cabinet 
entertained lavishly and superbly. A great favorite at 
these social gatherings was Miss Margot Tennant, after- 
wards Mrs. Asquith. Her youth, her wit, her originality 
and audacity made every function a success which was 
graced by her presence. 

The bitterness towards Mr. Gladstone of the opposi- 
tion party surpassed anything I have met in American 
politics, except during the Civil War. At dinners and 
receptions given me by my friends of the Tory party I 
was supposed as an American to be friendly to Mr. Glad- 
stone and Home Rule. I do not know whether this was 
the reason or whether it was usual, but on such occasions 
the denunciation of Mr. Gladstone as a traitor and the 
hope of living to see him executed was very frequent. 

I remember one important public man who was 
largely interested and a good deal of a power in Cana- 
dian and American railroads. He asked a friend of mine 
to arrange for me to meet him. I found him a most 
agreeable man and very accurately informed on the rail- 
way situation in Canada and the United States. He 



264 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

was preparing for a visit, and so wanted me to fill any 
gaps there might be in his knowledge of the situation. 

Apropos of the political situation at the time, he sud- 
denly asked me what was the attitude of the people of 
the United States towards Mr. Gladstone and his Home 
Rule bill. I told him they were practically unanimous 
in favor of the bill, and that Mr. Gladstone was the most 
popular Englishman in the United States. He at once 
flew into a violent rage, the rarest thing in the world for 
an Englishman, and lost control of his temper to such a 
degree that I thought the easiest way to dam the flood 
of his denunciation was to plead another engagement 
and retire from the field. I met him frequently after- 
wards, especially when he came to the United States, 
but carefully avoided his pet animosity. 

One year, in the height of the crisis of Mr. Gladstone's 
effort to pass the Home Rule bill, a member of his Cabi- 
net said to me: "We of the Cabinet are by no means 
unanimous in believing in Mr. Gladstone's effort, but he 
is the greatest power in our country. The people im- 
plicitly believe in him and we are helping all we can." 

It is well known that one after another broke away 
from him in time. The same Cabinet minister contin- 
ued: "Mr. Gladstone has gone to the extreme limit in 
concessions made in his Home Rule bill, and he can 
carry the English, Scotch, and Welsh members. But 
every time the Irish seem to be satisfied, they make a 
new demand and a greater one. Unless this stops and 
the present bill is accepted, the whole scheme will break 
down. Many of the Irish members are supported by 
contributions from America. Their occupation is poli- 
tics. If Home Rule should be adopted the serious peo- 
ple of Ireland, whose economic interests are at stake, 



RECOLLECTIONS FROM ABROAD 265 

might come to the front and take all representative 
offices themselves. We have come to the conclusion 
that enough of the Irish members to defeat the bill do 
not want Home Rule on any conditions. I know it is a 
custom when you arrive home every year that your 
friends meet you down the Bay and give you a reception. 
Then you give an interview of your impressions over 
here, and that interview is printed as widely in this 
country as in the United States. Now I wish you would 
do this: At the reception put in your own way what I 
have told you, and especially emphasize that Mr. Glad- 
stone is imperilling his political career and whole future 
for the sake of what he believes would be justice to 
Ireland. He cannot go any further and hold his Eng- 
lish, Scotch, and Welsh constituencies. He believes 
that he can pass the present bill and start Ireland on a 
career of Home Rule if he can receive the support of 
the Irish members. The Americans who believe in Mr. 
Gladstone and are all honest Home Rulers will think 
this is an indirect message from himself, and it would 
be if it were prudent for Mr. Gladstone to send the mes- 
sage." 

On my return to New York I did as requested. The 
story was published and commented on everywhere, and 
whether it was due to American insistence or not, I do 
not know, but shortly after Mr. Gladstone succeeded in 
carrying his Home Rule bill through the House of Com- 
mons, but it was defeated by the Conservatives in the 
House of Lords. 

His Irish policy is a tribute to Mr. Gladstone's judg- 
ment and foresight, because in the light and conditions 
of to-day it is perfectly plain that if the Gladstone mea- 
sure had been adopted at that time, the Irish question 



266 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

would not now be the most difficult and dangerous in 
British politics. 

I had many talks with Mr. Parnell and made many 
speeches in his behalf and later for Mr. Redmond. I 
asked him on one occasion if the Irish desired complete 
independence and the formation of an independent gov- 
ernment. He answered: "No, we want Home Rule, but 
to retain our connection in a way with the British Empire. 
The military, naval, and civil service of the British 
Empire gives great opportunities for our young men. 
Ireland in proportion to its population is more largely 
represented in these departments of the British Govern- 
ment than either England, Scotland, or Wales." 

Incidental to the division in Mr. Gladstone's Cabi- 
net, which had not at this time broken out, was the 
great vogue which a story of mine had. I was dining 
with Earl Spencer. He had been lord lieutenant of Ire- 
land and was very popular. His wife especially had 
been as great a success as the vice-regent. He was 
called the Red Earl because of his flowing auburn beard. 
He was a very serious man, devoted to the public ser- 
vice and exceedingly capable. He almost adored Mr. 
Gladstone and grieved over the growing opposition in 
the Cabinet. 

The guests at the dinner were all Gladstonians and 
lamenting these differences and full of apprehension that 
they might result in a split in the party. The earl asked 
me if we ever had such conditions in the United States. 
I answered: "Yes." Mr. Blaine, at that time at the head 
of President Harrison's Cabinet as secretary of state, 
had very serious differences with his chief, and the 
people wondered why he remained. Mr. Blaine told 
me this story apropos of the situation: The author of a 



RECOLLECTIONS FROM ABROAD 267 

play invited a friend of his to witness the first produc- 
tion and sent him a complimentary ticket. During the 
first act there were signs of disapproval, which during 
the second act broke out into a riot. An excited man 
sitting alongside the guest of the playwright said: "Stran- 
ger, are you blind or deaf, or do you approve of the 
play?" The guest replied: "My friend, my sentiments 
and opinion in regard to this play do not differ from 
yours and the rest, but I am here on a free ticket. If 
you will wait a little while till I go out and buy a ticket, 
I will come back and help you raise hell." 

The most brilliant member of Mr. Gladstone's Cabinet 
and one of the most accomplished, versatile, and elo- 
quent men in Great Britain was Lord Rosebery. I saw 
much of him when he was foreign minister and also after 
he became prime minister. Lord Rosebery was not only 
a great debater on political questions, he was also the 
most scholarly orator of his country on educational, lit- 
erary, and patriotic subjects. He gathered about him 
always the people whom a stranger pre-eminently de- 
sired to meet. 

I recall one of my week-end visits to his home at 
Mentmore, which is one of the most delightful of my 
reminiscences abroad. He had taken down there the 
leaders of his party. The dinner lasted, the guests all 
being men, except Lady Rosebery, who presided, until 
after twelve o'clock. Every one privileged to be there 
felt that those four hours had passed more quickly and 
entertainingly than any in their experience. 

It was a beautiful moonlight night and the very best 
of English weather, and we adjourned to the terrace. 
There were recalled personal experiences, incidents of 
travel from men who had been all over the world and in 



268 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

critical situations in many lands, diplomatic secrets re- 
vealing crises seriously threatening European wars, and 
how these had been averted, alliances made and terri- 
tories acquired, adventures of thrilling interest and per- 
sonal episodes surpassing fiction. The company reluc- 
tantly separated when the rising sun admonished them 
that the night had passed. 

It has been my good fortune to be the guest of emi- 
nent men in many lands and on occasions of memorable 
interest, but the rarest privilege for any one was to be 
the guest of Lord Rosebery, either at his city house or 
one of his country residences. The wonderful charm of 
the host, his tact with his guests, his talent for drawing 
people out and making them appear at their best, linger 
in their memories as red-letter days and nights of their 
lives. 

All Americans took great interest in the career of Lord 
Randolph Churchill. His wife was one of the most 
beautiful and popular women in English society, and an 
American. I knew her father, Leonard Jerome, very 
well. He was a successful banker and a highly educated 
and cultured gentleman. His brother, William Jerome, 
was for a long time the best story-teller and one of the 
wittiest of New Yorkers. 

Lord Randolph Churchill advanced very rapidly in 
British politics and became not only one of the most 
brilliant debaters but one of the leaders of the House of 
Commons. On one of my visits abroad I received an 
invitation from the Churchills to visit them at their 
country place. When I arrived I found that they occu- 
pied a castle built in the time of Queen Elizabeth, and 
in which few modern alterations had been made. It 
was historically a very unique and interesting structure. 



RECOLLECTIONS FROM ABROAD 269 

Additions had been made to it by succeeding genera- 
tions, each being another house with its own methods 
of ingress and egress. Lord Randolph said: "I welcome 
you to my ancestral home, which I have rented for three 
months." 

Though this temporary residence was very ancient, 
yet its hospitalities were dispensed by one of the most 
up-to-date and progressive couples in the kingdom. In 
the intimacy of a house-party, not too large, one could 
enjoy the versatility, the charm, the wide information, 
the keen political acumen of this accomplished and mag- 
netic British statesman. It was unfortunate for his 
country that from overwork he broke down so early in 
life. 

No one during his period could surpass Baron Alfred 
Rothschild as host. His dinners in town, followed by 
exquisite musicales, were the social events of every sea- 
son. He was, however, most attractive at his superb 
place in the country. A week-end with him there met 
the best traditions of English hospitality. In the party 
were sure to be men and women of distinction, and just 
the ones whom an American had read about and was 
anxious to meet. 

Baron Rothschild was a famous musician and an 
ardent lover of music. He had at his country place a 
wonderfully trained orchestra of expert musicians. In 
the theatre he gave concerts for the enjoyment of his 
guests, and led the orchestra himself. Among the com- 
pany was sure to be one or more of the most famous 
artists from the opera at Covent Garden, and from these 
experts his own leadership and the performance of his 
perfectly trained company received unstinted praise and 
applause. Baron Rothschild had the art so necessary 



2 7 o CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

for the enjoyment of his guests of getting together the 
right people. He never risked the harmony of his house 
by inviting antagonists. 

Lord Rothschild, the head of the house, differed 
entirely from his amiable and accomplished brother. 
While he also entertained, his mind was engrossed in 
business and affairs. I had a conference with him at 
the time of the Spanish-American War, which might 
have been of historical importance. He asked me to 
come and see him in the Rothschild banking-house, 
where the traditions of a century are preserved and un- 
changed. He said to me: "We have been for a long time 
the bankers of Spain. We feel the responsibility for 
their securities, which we have placed upon the market. 
The United States is so all-powerful in its resources and 
spirit that it can crush Spain. This we desire to avert. 
Spain, though weak and poor compared to the United 
States, has nevertheless the proudest people in the 
world, and it is a question of Spanish pride we have to 
deal with." 

In answering him I said: "Lord Rothschild, it seems 
to me that if you had any proposition you should take 
it to Mr. John Hay, our accomplished minister." 

"No," he said; "then it would become a matter of 
diplomacy and publicity. Now the Spanish Govern- 
ment is willing to comply with every demand the United 
States can make. The government is willing to grant 
absolute independence to Cuba, or what it would prefer, 
a self-governing colony, with relations like that of Can- 
ada to Great Britain. Spain is willing to give to the 
United States Porto Rico and the Philippine Islands, 
but she must know beforehand if these terms will be 
accepted before making the offer, because if an offer so 



RECOLLECTIONS FROM ABROAD 271 

great as this and involving such a loss of territory and 
prestige should be rejected by the United States there 
would be a revolution in Spain which might overthrow 
not only the government but the monarchy. What 
would be regarded as an insult would be resented by 
every Spaniard to the bitter end. That is why I have 
asked you to come and wish you to submit this proposi- 
tion to your president. Of course, I remain in a posi- 
tion, if there should be any publicity about it, to deny 
the whole thing." 

The proposition unfortunately came too late, and Mr. 
McKinley could not stop the war. It was well known in 
Washington that he was exceedingly averse to hostilities 
and believed the difficulties could be satisfactorily set- 
tled by diplomacy, but the people were aroused to such 
an extent that they were determined not only to free 
Cuba but to punish those who were oppressing the 
Cubans. 

One incident which received little publicity at the time 
was in all probability the match which fired the magazine. 
One of the ablest and most level-headed members of the 
Senate was Senator Redfield Proctor, of Vermont. The 
solidity of his character and acquirements and his known 
sense and conservatism made him a power in Congress, 
and he had the confidence of the people. He visited 
Cuba and wrote a report in which he detailed as an eye- 
witness the atrocities which the government and the 
soldiers were perpetrating. He read this report to Mr. 
McKinley and Senator Hanna. They both said: "Sen- 
ator Proctor, if you read that to the Senate, our negotia- 
tions end and war is inevitable." 

The president requested the senator to delay reporting 
to the Senate. The excitement and interest in that body 



272 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

were never more unanimous and intense. I doubt if any 
senator could have resisted this rare opportunity not 
only to be the centre of the stage but to occupy the 
whole platform. Senator Proctor made his report and 
the country was aflame. 

One summer I arrived in London and was suffering from 
a fearful attack of muscular rheumatism. I knew per- 
fectly well that I had brought it on myself by overwork. 
I had suffered several attacks before, but this one was 
so acute that I consulted Sir Henry Thompson, at that 
time the acknowledged head of the British medical pro- 
fession. He made a thorough examination and with 
most satisfactory result as to every organ. 

"With your perfect constitution," he said, "this 
attack is abnormal. Now tell me of your day and every 
day at home. Begin with breakfast." 

" I breakfast at a quarter of eight," I said. 

"Then," continued the doctor, "give me the whole 
day." 

"I arrive at my office," I said, "at nine. Being presi- 
dent of a great railway company, there is a large corre- 
spondence to be disposed of. I see the heads of the dif- 
ferent departments and get in touch with every branch 
of the business. Then I meet committees of chambers 
of commerce or shippers, or of employees who have a 
grievance, and all this will occupy me until five o'clock, 
when I go home. I take a very short lunch, often at 
my desk, to save time. On arriving home I take a nap 
of ten or fifteen minutes, and then look over my engage- 
ments for the evening. If it is a speech, which will 
probably happen four evenings in a week, I prepare in 
the next hour and then deliver it at some public banquet 



RECOLLECTIONS FROM ABROAD 273 

or hall. If I have accepted a formal address or, as we 
call them in America, orations, it is ground out on odd 
evenings, Sunday afternoon and night." 

The doctor turned to me abruptly and said: "You 
ought to be dead. Now, you have the most perfect con- 
stitution and less impaired than any I have examined at 
your time of life. If you will follow the directions which 
I give you, you can be perfectly well and sound at the 
age of one hundred. If you continue your present life 
until seventy, you will have a nervous breakdown, and 
thereafter become a nuisance to yourself and everybody 
else. I advise absolute rest at a remote place in Switzer- 
land. There you will receive no newspapers, and you 
will hear nothing from the outside world. You will 
meet there only English who are seeking health, and 
they will not speak to you. Devote your day to walk- 
ing over the mountains, adding to your tramp as your 
strength increases, and lie for hours on the bank of a 
quiet stream there, and be intensely interested as you 
throw pebbles into it to see how wide you can make 
the circles from the spot where the pebble strikes the 
water." 

I thought I understood my temperament better than 
the doctor, and that any rest for me was not solitude 
but entire change of occupation. So I remained in Lon- 
don and lunched and dined out every day for several 
weeks, with a week-end over every Sunday. In other 
ways, however, I adopted the doctor's directions and 
not only returned home cured, but have been free from 
rheumatism ever since. 

I was in London at both the queen's fiftieth anniver- 
sary of her reign and her jubilee. The reverence and 
love the English people had for Queen Victoria was a 



274 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

wonderful exhibition of her wisdom as a sovereign and 
of her charm and character as a woman. The sixty 
years of her reign were a wonderful epoch in the growth 
of her empire and in its relations to the world. 

Once I said to a member of the Cabinet, who, as min- 
ister of foreign affairs had been brought in close contact 
with the queen: "I am very much impressed with the 
regard which the people have for Queen Victoria. What 
is her special function in your scheme of government?" 

"She is invaluable," he answered, "to every prime 
minister and the Cabinet. The prime minister, after 
the close of the debate in the House of Commons every 
night, writes the queen a full report of what has occurred 
at that session. This has been going on for more than 
half a century. The queen reads these accounts care- 
fully and has a most retentive memory. If these com- 
munications of the prime ministers were ever available 
to the public, they would present a remarkable contrast 
of the minds and the methods of different prime min- 
isters and especially those two extreme opposites, Glad- 
stone and Disraeli. The queen did not like Gladstone, 
because she said he always preached, but she had an 
intense admiration for Disraeli, who threw into his 
nightly memoranda all his skill not only as a statesman 
but a novelist. The queen also has been consulted dur- 
ing all these years on every crisis, domestic or foreign, 
and every matter of Cabinet importance. The result is 
that she is an encyclopaedia. Very often there will be a 
dispute with some of the great powers or lesser ones, 
which is rapidly growing to serious proportions. We 
can find no report of its beginning. The queen, how- 
ever, will remember just when the difficulty began, and 
why it was pushed aside and not settled, and who were 



RECOLLECTIONS FROM ABROAD 275 

the principal actors in the negotiations. With that 
data we often arrive at a satisfactory settlement." 

I remember one garden-party at Buckingham Palace. 
The day was perfect and the attendance phenomenally 
large and distinguished. While there were places on 
the grounds where a luncheon was served, the guests 
neglected these places and gathered about a large tent 
where the royalties had their refreshments. It was an 
intense curiosity, not so much to see their sovereign eat 
and drink, as to improve the opportunity to reverently 
gaze upon her at close range. The queen called various 
people whom she knew from this circle of onlookers for 
a familiar talk. 

When the luncheon was served the attendant pro- 
duced an immense napkin, which she spread over herself, 
almost from her neck to the bottom of her dress. A 
charming English lady, who stood beside me, said: "I 
know you are laughing at the economy of our Queen." 

"On the contrary," I said, "I am admiring an example 
of carefulness and thrift which, if it could be universally 
known, would be of as great benefit in the United States 
as in Great Britain." 

"Well," she continued, "I do wish that the dear old 
lady was not quite so careful." 

At a period when the lives of the continental rulers 
were in great peril from revolutionists and assassins, the 
queen on both her fiftieth anniversary and her jubilee 
rode in an open carriage through many miles of London 
streets, with millions of spectators on either side pressing 
closely upon the procession, and there was never a 
thought that she was in the slightest danger. She was 
fearless herself, but she had on the triple armor of the 
overmastering love and veneration of the whole people. 



276 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

Americans remembered that in the crisis of our Civil 
War it was the influence of the queen, more than any 
other, which prevented Great Britain recognizing the 
Southern Confederacy. 

Among the incidents of her jubilee was the greatest 
naval demonstration ever known. The fleets of Great 
Britain were summoned from all parts of the globe and 
anchored in a long and imposing line in the English 
Channel. Mr. Ismay, at that time the head of the 
White Star Line, took the Teutonic, which had just been 
built and was not yet in regular commission, as his pri- 
vate yacht. He had on board a notable company, rep- 
resenting the best, both of men and women, of English 
life. He was the most generous of hosts, and every care 
taken for the individual comfort of his guests. In the 
intimacy for several days of such an excursion we all 
became very well acquainted. There were speeches at 
the dinners and dances afterwards on the deck for the 
younger people. The war-ships were illuminated at 
night by electric lights, and the launch of the Teutonic 
took us down one lane and up another through the long 
lines of these formidable defenders of Great Britain. 

One day there was great excitement when a war-ship 
steamed into our midst and it was announced that it was 
the German emperor's. Even as early as that he excited 
in the English mind both curiosity and apprehension. 
One of the frequent questions put to me, both then and 
for years afterwards at English dinners, was: "What do 
you think of the German emperor?" 

Shortly after his arrival he came on to the Teutonic 
with the Prince of Wales, afterwards King Edward VII. 
The prince knew many of the company and was most 
cordial all around. The emperor was absorbed in an 



RECOLLECTIONS FROM ABROAD 277 

investigation of this new ship and her possibilities both 
in the mercantile marine and as a cruiser. I heard him 
say to the captain: "How are you armed?" The cap- 
tain told him that among his equipment he had a new 
invention, a quick-firing gun. The emperor was imme- 
diately greatly excited. He examined the gun and ques- 
tioned its qualities and possibilities until he was master 
of every detail. Then he turned to one of his officers 
and gave a quick order that the gun should be immedi- 
ately investigated and all that were required should be 
provided for Germany. 

I heard a picturesque story from a member of the 
court, of Queen Victoria's interest in all public affairs. 
There was then, as there is generally in European rela- 
tions, some talk of war. The queen was staying at her 
castle at Osborne on the Isle of Wight. He said she 
drove alone down to the shore one night and sat there 
a long time looking at this great fleet, which was the 
main protection of her empire and her people. It would 
be interesting if one could know what were her thoughts, 
her fears, and her hopes. 

The queen was constantly assisting the government in 
the maintenance of friendly relations with foreign powers 
by entertaining their representatives at Windsor Castle. 
When General Grant, after he retired from the presi- 
dency, made his trip around the world, the question 
which disturbed our American minister, when General 
Grant arrived in London, was how he could be properly 
received and recognized. Of course, under our usage, 
he had become a private citizen, and was no more en- 
titled to official recognition than any other citizen. This 
was well known in the diplomatic circles. When the 
ambassadors and ministers of foreign countries in Lon- 



278 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

don were appealed to, they unanimously said that as 
they represented their sovereigns they could not yield 
precedence to General Grant, but he must sit at the foot 
of the table. The Prince of Wales solved this question 
with his usual tact and wisdom. Under the recognized 
usage at any entertainment, the Prince of Wales can 
select some person as his special guest to sit at his right, 
and, therefore, precede everybody else. The prince 
made this suggestion to our minister and performed this 
courteous act at all functions given to General Grant. 
Queen Victoria supplemented this by extending the same 
invitation to General and Mrs. Grant to dine and spend 
the night with her at Windsor Castle, which was ex- 
tended only to visiting royalty. 

I remember that the Army of the Potomac was hold- 
ing its annual meeting and commemoration at one of 
our cities when the cable announced that General Grant 
was being entertained by Queen Victoria at Windsor 
Castle. The conventions of diplomacy, which requires 
all communications to pass through the ambassador of 
one's country to the foreign minister of another country 
before it can reach the sovereign were not known to 
these old soldiers, so they cabled a warm message to 
General Grant, care of Queen Victoria, Windsor Castle, 
England. 

One of the most delightful bits of humor in my recol- 
lections of journalistic enterprise was an editorial by a 
Mr. Alden, one of the editors of the New York Times. 
Mr. Alden described with great particularity, as if giv- 
ing the details of the occurrence, that the messenger-boy 
arrived at Windsor Castle during the night and rang 
the front door-bell; that Her Majesty called out of the 
window in quite American style, "Who is there?" and 



RECOLLECTIONS FROM ABROAD 279 

the messenger-boy shouted, "Cable for General Grant. 
Is he staying at this house?" I can only give a sugges- 
tion of Alden's fun, which shook the whole country. 

One of the court officers said to me during the jubilee: 
"Royalties are here from every country, and among 
those who have come over is Liliuokalani, Queen of the 
Hawaiian Islands. She is as insistent of her royal rights 
as the Emperor of Germany. We have consented that 
she should be a guest at a dinner of our queen and spend 
the night at Windsor Castle. We have settled her place 
among the royalties in the procession through London 
and offered her the hussars as her guard of honor. She 
insists, however, that she shall have the same as the 
other kings, a company of the guards. Having recog- 
nized her, we are obliged to yield." The same officer 
told me that at the dinner the dusky queen said to 
Queen Victoria: "Your Majesty, I am a blood relative 
of yours." 

"How so?" was the queen's astonished answer. 

'Why," said Liliuokalani, "my grandfather ate your 
Captain Cook." 

One of the most interesting of the many distinguished 
men who were either guests on the Teutonic or visited us 
was Admiral Lord Charles Beresford. He was a typical 
sailor of the highest class and very versatile. He made 
a good speech, either social or political, and was a de- 
lightful companion on all occasions. He had remark- 
able adventures all over the world, and was a word 
painter of artistic power. He knew America well and 
was very sympathetic with our ideals. I met him many 
times in many relations and always with increasing 
regard and esteem. 



280 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

I was entertained by Lord Beresford once in the most 
original way. He had a country place about an hour 
from London and invited me to come down on a Sunday 
afternoon and meet some friends. It was a delightful 
garden-party on an ideal English summer day. He 
pressed me to stay for dinner, saying: "There will be a 
few friends coming, whom I am anxious for you to 
know." 

The friends kept coming, and after a while Lady 
Beresford said to him: "We have set all the tables we 
have and the dining-room and the adjoining room can 
hold. How many have you invited?" 

The admiral answered: "I cannot remember, but if 
we delay the dinner until a quarter of nine, I am sure 
they will all be here." 

When we sat down we numbered over fifty. Lord 
Charles's abounding and irresistible hospitality had in- 
cluded everybody whom he had met the day before. 

The butler came to Lord Charles shortly after we sat 
down and said: "My lord, it is Sunday night, and the 
shops are all closed. We can add nothing to what we 
have in the house, and the soup has given out." 

"Well," said this admirable strategist, "commence 
with those for whom you have no soup with the fish. 
When the fish gives out, start right on with the next 
course, and so to the close of the dinner. In that way 
everybody will get something." 

After a while the butler again approached the admiral 
and said: "My lord, the champagne is all gone." 

"Well," said Lord Charles, "start in on cider." 

It was a merry company, and they all caught on to 
the situation. The result was one of the most hilarious, 
enjoyable, and original entertainments of my life. It 



RECOLLECTIONS FROM ABROAD 281 

lasted late, and everybody with absolute sincerity de- 
clared he or she had had the best time ever. 

I was asked to meet Lord John Fisher, in a way a 
rival of Lord Beresford. Both were exceedingly able 
and brilliant officers and men of achievement, but they 
were absolutely unlike; one had all the characteristics 
of the Celt and the other of the Saxon. 

One of the most interesting things in Lord Fisher's 
talk, especially in view of later developments, was his 
description of the discoveries and annexations to the 
British Empire, made by the British navy. In regard 
to this he said: "The British navy had been acquiring 
positions of strategic importance to the safety and 
growth of the empire from time immemorial, and some 
fool of a prime minister on a pure matter of sentiment is 
always giving away to our possible enemies one or the 
other of these advantageous positions." He referred 
especially to Heligoland, the gift of which to Germany 
had taken place not long before. If Heligoland, fortified 
like Gibraltar, had remained in the possession of the 
British Government, Germany would not have ventured 
upon the late war. 

Lord Fisher exemplified what I have often met with 
in men who have won eminent distinction in some career, 
whose great desire was to have fame in another and 
entirely different one. Apparently he wished his friends 
and those he met to believe that he was the best story- 
teller in the world; that he had the largest stock of origi- 
nal anecdotes and told them better than anybody else. 
I found that he was exceedingly impatient and irritable 
when any one else started the inevitable "that reminds 
me," and he was intolerant with the story the other was 
trying to tell. But I discovered, also, that most of his 



282 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

stories, though told with great enthusiasm, were very 
familiar, or, as we Americans would say, "chestnuts." 

During my summer vacations I spent two weeks or 
more at Homburg, the German watering-place. It was 
at that time the most interesting resort on the continent. 
The Prince of Wales, afterwards King Edward VII, was 
always there, and his sister, the Dowager Empress of 
Germany, had her castle within a few miles. It was 
said that there was a quorum of both Houses of Parlia- 
ment in Homburg while the prince was there, but his 
presence also drew representatives from every depart- 
ment of English life, the bench and the bar, writers of 
eminence of both sexes, distinguished artists, and people 
famous on both the dramatic and the operatic stage. 
The prince, with keen discrimination, had these interest- 
ing people always about him. There were also social 
leaders, whose entertainments were famous in London, 
who did their best to add to the pleasure of the visit of 
the prince. I met him frequently and was often his 
guest at his luncheons and dinners. He fell in at once 
in the Homburg way. 

The routine of the cure was to be at the springs every 
morning at seven o'clock, to take a glass of water, walk 
half an hour with some agreeable companion, and repeat 
this until three glasses had been consumed. Then 
breakfast, and after that the great bathing-house at 
eleven o'clock. The bathing-house was a meeting-place 
for everybody. Another meeting-place was the open- 
air concerts in the afternoon. In the evening came the 
formal dinners and some entertainment afterwards. 

Both for luncheon and dinner the prince always had 
quite a large company. He was a host of great charm, 
tact, and character. He had a talent of drawing out the 



RECOLLECTIONS FROM ABROAD 283 

best there was in those about his table, and especially of 
making the occasion very agreeable for a stranger. Any 
one at his entertainments always carried away either in 
the people he met or the things that were said, or both, 
permanent recollections. 

I do not think the prince bothered about domestic 
questions. He was very observant of the limitations 
and restrictions which the English Government imposes 
upon royalty. He was, however, very keen upon his 
country's foreign relations. In the peace of Europe he 
was an important factor, being so closely allied with the 
imperial houses of Germany and Russia. There is no 
doubt that he prevented the German Emperor from ac- 
quiring a dangerous control over the Czar. He was very 
fixed and determined to maintain and increase friendly 
relations between the United States and Great Britain. 
He succeeded, after many varied and long-continued 
efforts, in doing away with the prejudices and hostilities 
of the French towards the English, an accomplishment 
of infinite value to his country in these later years. 

I was told that the prince required very little sleep, 
that he retired to bed late and was an early riser. I 
was awakened one night by his equerry calling me up, 
saying the prince was on the terrace of the Kursaal and 
wanted to see me. The lights were all out, everybody 
had gone, and he was sitting alone at a table illuminated 
by a single candle. What he desired was to discuss 
American affairs and become more familiar with our 
public men, our ideals, our policies, and especially any 
causes which could possibly be removed of irritation be- 
tween his own country and ours. This discussion lasted 
till daylight. 

Meeting him on the street one day, he stopped and 



284 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

asked me to step aside into an opening there was in the 
hedge. He seemed laboring under considerable excite- 
ment, and said: "Why do the people in the United 
States want to break up the British Empire?" 

I knew he referred to the Home Rule bill for Ireland, 
which was then agitating Parliament and the country, 
and also the frequent demonstrations in its favor which 
were occurring in the United States. 

I said to him: "Sir, I do not believe there is a single 
American who has any thought of breaking up the 
British Empire. We are wedded to the federal princi- 
ple of independent States, which are sovereign in their 
local affairs and home matters, but on everything you 
call imperial the United States is supreme. To vindicate 
this principle we fought a Civil War, in which we lost 
more lives, spent more money, destroyed more property, 
and incurred more debt than any contest of modern 
time. The success of the government has been so com- 
plete that the States which were in rebellion and their 
people are quite as loyal to the general government as 
those who fought to preserve it. The prosperity of the 
country, with this question settled, has exceeded the 
bounds of imagination. So Americans think of your 
trouble with Ireland in terms of our federated States, 
and believe that all your difficulties could be adjusted in 
the same way." 

We had a long discussion in which he asked innu- 
merable questions, and never referred to the subject 
again. I heard afterwards among my English friends 
that he who had been most hostile was becoming a Home 
Ruler. 

At another time he wanted to know why our govern- 
ment had treated the British ambassador, Lord Sack- 



RECOLLECTIONS FROM ABROAD 285 

ville West, so badly and ruined his career. The Sack- 
ville West incident was already forgotten, though it was 
the liveliest question of its time. 

Cleveland was president and a candidate for re-elec- 
tion. Sackville West was the British ambassador. A 
little company of shrewd Republican politicians in Cali- 
fornia thought if they could get an admission that the 
British Government was interfering in our election in 
favor of Cleveland, it would be a fine asset in the cam- 
paign, and so they wrote to Lord Sackville West, telling 
him they were Englishmen who had become naturalized 
American citizens. In voting they were anxious to vote 
for the side which would be best for their native land; 
would he kindly and very confidentially advise them 
whether to support the Democratic or the Republican 
ticket. Sackville West swallowed the bait without in- 
vestigation, and wrote them a letter advising them to 
vote the Democratic ticket. 

There never had been such consternation in diplo- 
matic circles in Washington. Of course, Mr. Cleveland 
and his supporters had to get out from under the situa- 
tion as quickly and gracefully as possible. 

The administration instantly demanded that the 
British Government should recall Lord Sackville West, 
which was done, and he was repudiated for his activity 
in American politics. It was curious that the prince 
had apparently never been fully informed of the facts, 
but had been misled by Sackville West's explanation, 
and the prince was always loyal to a friend. 

One year Mr. James G. Blaine visited Homburg, and 
the prince at once invited him to luncheon. Blaine's 
retort to a question delighted every American in the 
place. One of the guests was the then Duke of Man- 



286 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

Chester, an old man and a great Tory. When the duke 
grasped that Blaine was a leading American and had 
been a candidate for the presidency of the United States, 
all his old Toryism was aroused, and he was back in the 
days of George III. To the horror of the prince, the 
duke said to Mr. Blaine: "The most outrageous thing in 
all history was your rebellion and separation from the 
best government on earth." He said much more before 
the prince could stop him. 

Blaine, with that grace and tact for which he was so 
famous, smilingly said: "Well, your Grace, if George III 
had had the sense, tact, and winning qualities of his 
great-grandson, our host, it is just possible that we 
might now be a self-governing colony in the British 
Empire. ,, 

The answer relieved the situation and immensely 
pleased the host. Lord Rosebery once said in a speech 
that, with the tremendous growth in every element of 
greatness of the United States, if the American colonies 
had remained in the British Empire, with their pre- 
ponderating influence and prestige, the capital of Great 
Britain might have been moved to New York and Buck- 
ingham Palace rebuilt in Central Park. 

At another dinner one of the guests of the prince sud- 
denly shot at me across the table the startling question: 
"Do you know certain American heiresses" — naming 
them — "now visiting London?" 

I answered "Yes" — naming one especially, a very 
beautiful and accomplished girl who was quite the most 
popular debutante of the London season. 

"How much has she?" he asked. 

I named the millions which she would probably in- 
herit. "But," I added, "before you marry an American 



RECOLLECTIONS FROM ABROAD 287 

heiress, you better be sure that she can say the Lord's 
Prayer." 

He said with great indignation that he would be 
astonished if any American girl could be recognized in 
English society who had been so badly brought up that 
she was not familiar with the Lord's Prayer. 

"All of them are," I replied, "but few heiresses, unless 
they have come into their inheritance and can say 'Our 
Father, who art in heaven,' will inherit much, because 
American fathers are very speculative." 

He continued to express his astonishment at this lack 
of religious training in an American family, while the 
prince enjoyed the joke so much that I was fearful in his 
convulsive laughter he would have a fit of apoplexy. 

Once, at a dinner given by the prince, an old lady of 
very high rank and leading position said suddenly to me, 
and in a way which aroused the attention of the whole 
company: "Is it true that divorces are very common in 
America?" 

I knew that a denial by me would not convince her or 
any others who shared in this belief, then very common 
in Europe. Of course, the prince knew better. I saw 
from his expression that he wished me to take advantage 
of the opportunity. I made up my mind quickly that 
the best way to meet this belief was by an exaggeration 
which would show its absurdity. 

Having once started, the imaginative situation grew 
beyond my anticipation. I answered: 'Yes, divorces 
are so common with us that the government has set 
aside one of our forty-odd States for this special purpose. 
It is the principal business of the authorities. Most of 
these actions for divorce take place at the capital, which 
is always crowded with great numbers of people from all 



288 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

parts of the country seeking relief from their marital 
obligations." 

"Did you ever visit that capital?" asked the prince. 

"Yes, several times," I answered, "but not for di- 
vorce. My domestic relations have always been very 
happy, but it is also a famous health resort, and I went 
there for the cure." 

"Tell us about your visit," said the prince. 

"Well," I continued, "it was out of season when I 
was first there, so the only amusement or public occa- 
sions of interest were prayer-meetings." 

The old lady asked excitedly: "Share meetings?" 
She had been a large and unfortunate investor in Ameri- 
can stocks. 

I relieved her by saying: "No, not share meetings, but 
religious prayer-meetings. I remember one evening that 
the gentleman who sat beside me turned suddenly to his 
wife and said: 'We must get out of here at once; the air 
is too close.* 'Why, no,' she said; 'the windows are all 
open and the breeze is fresh.' 'Yes,' he quickly re- 
marked, ' but next to you are your two predecessors from 
whom I was divorced, and that makes the air too close 
for me.'" 

The old lady exclaimed: "What a frightful condition!" 

"Tell us more," said the prince. 

"Well," I continued, "one day the mayor of the city 
invited me to accompany him to the station, as the 
divorce train was about to arrive. I found at the sta- 
tion a judge and one of the court attendants. The 
attendant had a large package of divorce decrees to 
which the seal of the court had been attached, and also 
the signature of the judge. They only required to have 
the name of the party desiring divorce inserted. Along- 



RECOLLECTIONS FROM ABROAD 289 

side the judge stood a clergyman of the Established 
Church in full robes of his sacred office. When the pas- 
sengers had all left the cars, the conductor jumped on 
to one of the car platforms and shouted to the crowd: 
'All those who desire divorce will go before the judge 
and make their application.' 

" When they had all been released by the court the con- 
ductor again called out: 'All those who have been accom- 
panied by their partners, or where both have been to-day 
released from their former husbands and wives to be 
remarried, will go before the rector.' He married them 
in a body, whereupon they all resumed their places on 
the train. The blowing of the whistle and the ringing 
of the bell on the locomotive was the music of their 
first, second, or third honeymoon journey." 

The old lady threw up her hands in horror and cried: 
"Such an impious civilization must come speedily not 
only to spiritual and moral destruction, but chaos." 

Most of the company saw what an amazing caricature 
the whole story was and received it with great hilarity. 
The effect of it was to end, for that circle, at least, and 
their friends, a serious discussion of the universality of 
American divorces. 

The prince was always an eager sportsman and a very 
chivalric one. At the time of one of the races at Cowes 
he became very indignant at the conduct of an Ameri- 
can yachtsman who had entered his boat. It was 
charged by the other competitors that this American 
yachtsman violated all the unwritten laws of the contest. 

After the race the prince said to me: "A yacht is a 
gentleman's home, whether it is racing or sailing about 
for pleasure. The owner of this yacht, to make her 
lighter and give her a better chance, removed all the 



2 9 o CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

furniture and stripped her bare. He even went so far, 
I am told, that when he found the steward had left in 
his stateroom a tooth-brush, he threw it out of the port 
window.'* 

It will be seen from these few anecdotes how intensely 
human was the Prince of Wales. He did much for his 
country, both as prince and king, and filled in a wise 
and able way the functions of his office. Certainly no 
official did quite so much for the peace of Europe during 
his time, and no royalty ever did more to make the 
throne popular with the people. I heard him speak at 
both formal and informal occasions, and his addresses 
were always tactful and wise. 

While at Homburg we used to enjoy the delightful 
excursions to Nauheim, the famous nerve-cure place. I 
met there at one time a peculiar type of Americans, quite 
common in former years. They were young men who, 
having . inherited fortunes sufficient for their needs, had 
no ambitions. After a strenuous social life at home and 
in Europe, they became hypochondriacs and were chas- 
ing cures for their imaginary ills from one resort to 
another. 

One of them, who had reached middle life, had, of 
course, become in his own opinion a confirmed invalid. 
I asked him: "What brought you here? You look very 
well." 

"That is just my trouble," he answered. "I look 
very well and so get no sympathy, but my nervous sys- 
tem is so out of order that it only takes a slight shock to 
completely disarrange it. For instance, the cause of my 
present trouble. I was dining in Paris at the house of 
a famous hostess, and a distinguished company was 
present. The only three Americans were two ladies and 



RECOLLECTIONS FROM ABROAD 291 

myself. I was placed between them. You know one of 
these ladies, while a great leader at home, uses very 
emphatic language when she is irritated. The dinner, 
like most French dinners, with many courses, was unusu- 
ally long. Suddenly this lady, leaning over me, said to 
her sister: 'Damn it, Fan, will this dinner never end?' 
The whole table was shocked and my nerves were com- 
pletely shattered." The great war, as I think, exter- 
minated this entire tribe. 

I was delighted to find at Nauheim my old friends, 
Mark Twain and the Reverend Doctor Joseph Twichell, 
of Hartford, Conn. Doctor Twichell was Mark Twain's 
pastor at home. He was in college with me at Yale, and 
I was also associated with him in the governing corpora- 
tion of Yale University. He was one of the finest wits 
and remarkable humorists of his time. Wit and humor 
were with him spontaneous, and he bubbled over with 
them. Mark Twain's faculties in that line were more 
labored and had to be worked out. Doctor Twichell 
often furnished in the rough the jewels which afterwards 
in Mark Twain's workshop became perfect gems. 

I invited them to come over and spend the day and 
dine with me in the evening at Homburg. Mark Twain 
at that time had the reputation in England of being the 
greatest living wit and humorist. It soon spread over 
Homburg that he was in town and was to dine with me in 
the evening, and requests came pouring in to be invited. 
I kept enlarging my table at the Kursaal, with these 
requests, until the management said they could go no 
farther. I placed Mark Twain alongside Lady Cork, 
one of the most brilliant women in England. In the 
course of years of acquaintance I had met Mark Twain 
under many conditions. He was very uncertain in a 



292 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

social gathering. Sometimes he would be the life of the 
occasion and make it one to be long remembered, but 
generally he contributed nothing. At this dinner, when- 
ever he showed the slightest sign of making a remark, 
there was dead silence, but the remark did not come. 
He had a charming time, and so did Lady Cork, but the 
rest of the company heard nothing from the great 
humorist, and they were greatly disappointed. 

The next morning Mark Twain came down to the 
springs in his tramping-suit, which had fairly covered the 
continent. I introduced him to the Prince of Wales, 
and he was charmed with him in their hour of walk and 
talk. At dinner that evening the prince said to me: "I 
would have invited Mark Twain this evening, if I 
thought he had with him any dinner clothes." 

"At my dinner last night," I said, "he met every con- 
ventional requirement." 

"Then," continued the prince, "I would be much 
obliged if you would get him for dinner with me to- 
morrow evening." 

It was very much the same company as had dined 
with the prince the night before. Again Twain was for 
a long time a complete disappointment. I knew scores 
of good things of his and tried my best to start him off, 
but without success. The prince, who was unusually 
adroit and tactful in drawing a distinguished guest out, 
also failed. When the dinner was over, however, and 
we had reached the cigars, Mark Twain started in telling 
a story in his most captivating way. His peculiar drawl, 
his habit in emphasizing the points by shaking his bushy 
hair, made him a dramatic narrator. He never had 
greater success. Even the veteran Mark himself was 
astonished at the uproarious laughter which greeted 



RECOLLECTIONS FROM ABROAD 293 

almost every sentence and was overwhelming when he 
closed. 

There are millions of stories in the world, and several 
hundred of them good ones. No one knew more of them 
than Mark Twain, and yet out of this vast collection he 
selected the one which I had told the night before to the 
same company. The laughter and enjoyment were not 
at the story, but because the English had, as they 
thought, caught me in retailing to them from Mark 
Twain's repertoire one of his stories. It so happened 
that it was a story which I had heard as happening upon 
our railroad in one of my tours of inspection. I had 
told it in a speech, and it had been generally copied in 
the American newspapers. Mark Twain's reputation as 
the greatest living humorist caused that crowd to doubt 
the originality of my stories. 

Mark had declined the cigars, but the prince was so 
delighted that he offered him one of the highly prized 
selection from his own case. This drew from him a 
story, which I have not seen in any of his books. I have 
read Mark Twain always with the greatest pleasure. 
His books of travel have been to me a source of endless 
interest, and his "Personal Recollections of Joan of Arc" 
is the best representation of the saint and heroine that 
I know. 

When the prince offered him the cigar, Mark said: 
"No, prince, I never smoke. I have the reputation in 
Hartford, Conn., of furnishing at my entertainments the 
worst of cigars. When I was going abroad, and as I 
would be away for several years, I gave a reception and 
invited all my friends. I had the governor of the State 
of Connecticut and the judges of the highest courts, and 
the most distinguished members of the legislature. I 



294 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

had the leading clergymen and other citizens, and also 
the president and faculty of Yale University and Trinity 
College. 

"At three o'clock in the afternoon my butler, who is a 
colored man, Pompey by name, came to me and said: 
'Mr. Clemens, we have no cigars.' Just then a pedler's 
wagon stopped at the gate. In England they call them 
cheap jacks. I hailed the merchant and said: 'What 
have you in your wagon?' 'Well,' he answered, 'I have 
some Gobelin tapestries, Sevres china, and Japanese 
cloisonne vases, and a few old masters.' Then I said to 
him : ' I do not want any of those, but have you cigars, 
and how much?' The pedler answered: 'Yes, sir, I 
have some excellent cigars, which I will sell you at sev- 
enteen cents a barrel.' I have to explain that a cent is 
an English farthing. Then I told him to roll a barrel 
in. 

" It was a great occasion, one of the greatest we ever 
had in the old State of Connecticut," continued Mark, 
"but I noticed that the guests left unusually early after 
supper. The next morning I asked the butler why they 
left so early. 'Well,' he said, 'Mr. Clemens, everybody 
enjoyed the supper, and they were all having a good 
time until I gave them the cigars. After the gentleman 
had taken three puffs, he said: "Pomp, you infernal nig- 
ger, get me my hat and coat quick." When I went out, 
my stone walk, which was one hundred yards long from 
the front door to the gate, was just paved with those 
cigars.' " This specimen of American exaggeration told 
in Mark Twain's original way made a great hit. 

I met Mark Twain at a theatrical supper in London 
given by Sir Henry Irving. It was just after his pub- 
lishing firm had failed so disastrously. It was a notable 



RECOLLECTIONS FROM ABROAD 295 

company of men of letters, playwrights, and artists. 
Poor Mark was broken in health and spirits. He tried 
to make a speech, and a humorous one, but it saddened 
the whole company. 

I met him again after he had made the money on his 
remarkable lecture tour around the world, with which 
he met and paid all his debts. It was an achievement 
worthy of the famous effort of Sir Walter Scott. Jubi- 
lant, triumphant, and free, Mark Twain that night was 
the hero never forgotten by any one privileged to be 
present. 

One year, after strenuous work and unusual difficul- 
ties, which, however, had been successfully met, I was 
completely exhausted. I was advised to take a short 
trip to Europe, and, as usual, the four weeks' change of 
air and occupation was a complete cure. I decided to 
include Rome in my itinerary, though I felt that my 
visit would be something like the experience of Phineas 
Fogg, who did the whole of Europe and saw all there was 
of it in ten days. 

When I arrived in the Eternal City, my itinerary gave 
me four days there. I wanted to see everything and 
also to meet, if possible, one of the greatest of popes, 
Leo XIII. I was armed only with a letter from my 
accomplished and distinguished friend, Archbishop Cor- 
rigan. I secured the best-known guide, who informed 
me that my efforts to see the sights within my limited 
time would be impossible. Nevertheless, the incentive 
of an extra large commission dependent upon distances 
covered and sights seen, led to my going through the 
streets behind the best team of horses in Rome and pur- 
sued by policemen and dogs, and the horses urged on by 



296 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

a driver frantic for reward, and a guide who profession- 
ally and financially was doing the stunt of his life. It 
was astounding how much ground was really covered in 
the city of antiquities and art by this devotion to speed 
and under competent guidance. 

When I asked to see the pope, I was informed that his 
health was not good and audiences had been suspended. 
I wrote a letter to the cardinal-secretary, enclosing Arch- 
bishop Corrigan's letter, and stated my anxiety to meet 
His Holiness and the limited time I had. A few hours 
afterwards I received a letter from the cardinal, stating 
that the Holy Father appreciated the circumstances, 
and would be very glad to welcome me in private audi- 
ence at eleven o'clock the next morning. 

When I arrived at the Vatican I was received as a dis- 
tinguished visitor. The papal guards were turned out, 
and I was finally ushered into the room of Cardinal 
Merry del Val. He was a young man then and an 
accomplished diplomat, and most intimately informed 
on all questions of current interest. Literature, music, 
drama, political conditions in Europe were among his 
accomplishments. He said the usual formula when a 
stranger is presented to the pope is for the guest to kneel 
and kiss his ring. The pope has decided that all this 
will be omitted in your case. He will receive you ex- 
actly as an eminent foreigner calling by appointment 
upon the President of the United States. 

When I was ushered into the presence of the pope he 
left his throne, came forward, grasped me cordially by 
the hand, and welcomed me in a very charming way. 
He was not a well man, and his bloodless countenance 
was as white and pallid as his robes. This was all re- 
lieved, however, by the brilliancy of his wonderful eyes. 



RECOLLECTIONS FROM ABROAD 297 

After a few preliminary remarks he plunged into the 
questions in which he was deeply interested. He feared 
the spread of communism and vividly described its 
efforts to destroy the church, ruin religion, extirpate 
faith, and predicted that if successful it would destroy 
civilization. 

I told him that I was deeply interested in the encyclical 
he had recently issued to reconcile or make more harmo- 
nious the relations between capital and labor. He com- 
menced speaking upon that subject, and in a few min- 
utes I saw that I was to be privileged to hear an address 
from one who as priest and bishop had been one of the 
most eloquent orators of the age. In his excitement he 
leaned forward, grasping the arms of the throne, the 
color returned to his cheeks, his eyes flashed, his voice 
was vibrant, and I was the audience, the entranced audi- 
ence of the best speech I ever heard upon the question 
of labor and capital. 

I was fearful on account of his health, that the exer- 
tion might be too great, and so arose to leave. He again 
said to me, and taking my hand: "I know all about you 
and am very grateful to you that in your official capacity 
as president of the New York Central Railroad you are 
treating so fairly the Catholics. I know that among 
your employees twenty-eight thousand are of the Catho- 
lic faith, and not one of them has ever known any dis- 
crimination because of their belief, but all of them have 
equal opportunities with the others for the rewards of 
their profession and protection in their employment." 

The next day he sent a special messenger for a renewal 
of the conversation, but unhappily I had left Rome the 
night before. 

During my stay in Rome of four days I had visited 



298 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

most of its antiquities, its famous churches, and spent 
several hours in the Vatican gallery. Our American 
minister, one of the most accomplished of our diplomats, 
Mr. William Potter, had also given me a dinner, where 
I was privileged to meet many celebrities of the time. 

Among English statesmen I found in Lord Salisbury 
an impressive figure. In a long conversation I had with 
him at the Foreign Office he talked with great freedom 
on the relations between the United States and Great 
Britain. He was exceedingly anxious that friendly con- 
ditions should continue and became most cordial. 

The frequent disposition on the part of American poli- 
ticians to issue a challenge or create eruptions disturbed 
him. I think he was in doubt when President Cleveland 
made his peremptory demands on the Venezuela bound- 
ary question if the president recognized their serious 
importance both for the present and the future. He, 
however, reluctantly yielded to the arbitration, won a 
complete victory, and was satisfied that such irritating 
questions were mainly political and for election purposes, 
and had better be met in a conciliatory spirit. 

I remember a garden-party at Hatfield House, the his- 
torical home of the Cecils, given in honor of King Victor 
Emmanuel III, who had recently come to the throne. 
Lord Salisbury was of gigantic proportions physically, 
while the king was undersized. The contrast between 
the two was very striking, especially when they were in 
animated conversation — the giant prime minister talk- 
ing down to His Majesty, and he with animated gestures 
talking up to the premier. 

It is not too great a stretch of imagination, when one 
knows how traditional interviews and conversations be- 



RECOLLECTIONS FROM ABROAD 299 

tween European rulers affect their relations, present and 
future, to find in that entertainment and conference 
that the seed there was sown for the entrance of Italy, 
at one of the crises of the Great War, on the side of the 
Allies and against Germany, to whom she was bound by 
the Triple Alliance. 

Mr. Gladstone said to me at one time: "I have re- 
cently met a most interesting countryman of yours. He 
is one of the best-informed and able men of any country 
whom I have had the pleasure of talking with for a long 
time, and he is in London now. I wish you would tell 
me all about him." 

Mr. Gladstone could not recall his name. As there 
were a number of American congressmen in London, I 
asked: "Was he a congressman?" 

"No," he answered; "he had a more important 
office." 

I then remembered that DeWitt Clinton, when a 
United States senator, resigned to become mayor of the 
City of New York. On that inspiration I asked: "Mayor 
of the City of New York?" 

"Yes, that is it," Mr. Gladstone answered. 

I then told him that it was Abram S. Hewitt, and 
gave him a description of Mr. Hewitt's career. Mr. 
Gladstone was most enthusiastic about him. 

It was my fortune to know Mr. Hewitt very well for 
many years. He richly merited Mr. Gladstone's enco- 
mium. He was one of the most versatile and able Ameri- 
cans in public or private life during his time. His father 
was an English tenant-farmer who moved with his family 
to the United States. Mr. Hewitt received a liberal 
education and became a great success both in business 
and public life. He was much more than a business 



3 oo CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

man, mayor of New York, or a congressman — he was 
public-spirited and a wise reformer. 

Mr. Hewitt told me two interesting incidents in his 
career. When he visited England he was received with 
many and flattering attentions. Among his invitations 
was a week-end to the home of the nobleman upon whose 
estates his father had been a tenant-farmer. When Mr. 
Hewitt told the nobleman, who was entertaining him as 
a distinguished American, about his father's former rela- 
tions as one of his tenants, the nobleman said: "Your 
father made a great mistake in giving up his farm and 
emigrating to the United States. He should have re- 
mained here." 

Mr. Hewitt said: "But, my lord, so far as I am con- 
cerned I do not think so." 

"Why?" asked his lordship. 

"Because," answered Mr. Hewitt, "then I could never 
have been a guest on equal terms in your house." 

Mr. Hewitt was one of the foremost iron founders and 
steel manufacturers of the country. At the time of our 
Civil War our government was very short of guns, and 
we were unable to manufacture them because we did 
not know the secret of gun-metal. 

The government sent Mr. Hewitt abroad to purchase 
guns. The English gunmakers at once saw the trouble 
he was in and took advantage of it. They demanded 
prices several times greater than they were asking from 
other customers, and refused to give him any informa- 
tion about the manufacture of gun-metal. 

After he had made the contract, with all its exorbitant 
conditions, he went to his hotel and invited the foreman 
of each department of the factory to meet him. They 
all came. Mr. Hewitt explained to them his mission, 



RECOLLECTIONS FROM ABROAD 301 

and found that they were sympathetic with Mr. Lincoln 
and his administration and the Union cause. Then he 
told them of the trouble he had had with their employ- 
ers, and the hard terms which they had imposed. He 
asked them then all about the manufacture of gun- 
metal. Each one of the foremen was very clear and 
explicit as to his part, and so when they had all spoken, 
Mr. Hewitt, with his expert knowledge of the business, 
knew all the secrets of the manufacture of gun-metal, 
which he, of course, gave to the government at Washing- 
ton for use in their several arsenals and shops. 

"Now," he said to his guests, "you have done me a 
great favor. I will return it. Your company is obliged 
by the contract to deliver this immense order within a 
limited time. They are going to make an enormous 
amount of money out of it. You strike and demand 
what you think is right, and you will get it immedi- 
ately." 

The gun company made a huge profit but had to share 
some of it with their workers. It was an early instance 
of the introduction of profit-sharing, which has now be- 
come common all over the world. 

One of the most interesting Englishmen, whom I saw 
much of both in London and in the United States, was 
Sir Henry Irving. The world of art, drama, and history 
owes much to him for his revival of Shakespeare. Ir- 
ving was a genius in his profession, and in private life 
perfectly delightful. 

He gave me a dinner and it was, like everything he 
did, original. Instead of the usual formal entertain- 
ment, he had the dinner at one of the old royal castles in 
the country, which had become a very exclusive hotel. 
He carried us out there in coaches. 



302 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

The company of authors, playwrights, and men of 
affairs made the entertainment late and the evening 
memorable. Returning home on the top of the coach, 
the full moon would appear and reappear, but was gen- 
erally under a cloud. Irving remarked: "I do much 
better with that old moon in my theatre. I make it 
shine or obscure it with clouds, as the occasion requires." 

I received a note from him at the time of his last visit 
to the United States, in which he said that a friend from 
the western part of the country was giving him a dinner 
at Delmonico's to precede his sailing in the early morning 
on his voyage home. The company was to be large and 
all good friends, and he had the positive assurance that 
there would be no speaking, and wished I would come. 

The dinner was everything that could be desired. 
The company was a wonderful one of distinguished rep- 
resentatives of American life. The hours passed along 
rapidly and joyously, as many of these original men 
contributed story, racy adventure, or song. 

Suddenly the host arose and said: "Gentlemen, we 
have with us to-night — " Of course, that meant an in- 
troductory speech about Irving and a reply from the 
guest. Irving turned to me, and in his deepest and 
most tragic Macbeth voice said: "God damn his soul to 
hell!" However, he rose to the occasion, and an hour 
or so afterwards, when everybody else had spoken, not 
satisfied with his first effort, he arose and made a much 
better and longer speech. He was an admirable after- 
dinner speaker as well as an unusual actor. His wonder- 
ful presentations, not only of Shakespeare's but of other 
dramas, did very much for the stage both in his own 
country and in ours. 

Those who heard him only in his last year had no 



RECOLLECTIONS FROM ABROAD 303 

conception of him in his prime. In his later years he 
fell into the fault, so common with public speakers and 
actors, of running words together and failing to articu- 
late clearly. I have known a fine speech and a superior 
sermon and a great part in a play ruined because of the 
failure to articulate clearly. The audience could not 
follow the speaker and so lost interest. 

Sir Henry told me a delightful story about Disraeli. 
A young relative of Irving's took orders and became a 
clergyman in the Established Church. At the request of 
Irving, Disraeli appointed this young man one of the 
curates at Windsor. 

One day the clergyman came to Irving in great distress 
and said: "The unexpected has happened. Every one 
has dropped out, and I have been ordered to preach on 
Sunday." 

Irving took him to see Disraeli for advice. The 
prime minister said to the young clergyman: "If you 
preach thirty minutes, Her Majesty will be bored. If 
you preach fifteen minutes, Her Majesty will be pleased. 
If you preach ten minutes, Her Majesty will be de- 
lighted." 

"But," said the young clergyman, "my lord, what 
can a preacher possibly say in only ten minutes?" 

"That," answered the statesman, "will be a matter of 
indifference to Her Majesty." 

Sir Frederick Leighton, the eminent English artist, 
and at one time president of the Royal Academy, was 
one of the most charming men of his time. His remi- 
niscences were delightful and told with rare dramatic 
effect. I remember a vivid description which he gave 
me of the wedding of one of the British royalties with a 



3 04 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

German princess. Sir Frederick was one of the large 
and distinguished delegation which accompanied the 
prince. 

The principality of the bride's father had been shorn 
of territory, power, and revenue during the centuries. 
Nevertheless, at the time of the wedding he maintained 
a ministry, the same as in the Middle Ages, and a minia- 
ture army. Palaces, built centuries before, housed the 
Cabinet. 

The minister of foreign affairs came to Sir Frederick 
and unbosomed himself of his troubles. He said: "Ac- 
cording to the usual procedure I ought to give a ball in 
honor of the union of our house with the royal family of 
England. My palace is large enough, but my salary is 
only eight hundred a year, and the expense would eat 
up the whole of it." 

Sir Frederick said: "Your Excellency can overcome 
the difficulty in an original way. The state band can 
furnish the music, and that will cost nothing. When the 
time comes for the banquet, usher the guests with due 
ceremony to a repast of beer and pretzels." 

The minister followed the instructions. The whole 
party appreciated the situation, and the minister was 
accredited with the most brilliant and successful ball 
the old capital had known for a century. 

For several years one of the most interesting men in 
Europe was the Duke d'Aumale, son of Louis Philippe. 
He was a statesman and a soldier of ability and a social 
factor of the first rank. He alone of the French royalty 
was relieved from the decree of perpetual banishment 
and permitted to return to France and enjoy his estates. 
In recognition of this he gave his famous chateau and 



RECOLLECTIONS FROM ABROAD 305 

property at Chantilly to the French Academy. The gift 
was valued at ten millions of dollars. In the chateau at 
Chantilly is a wonderful collection of works of art. 

I remember at one dinner, where the duke was the 
guest of honor, those present, including the host, were 
mostly new creations in the British peerage. After the 
conversation had continued for some time upon the fact 
that a majority of the House of Lords had been raised 
to the peerage during the reign of Queen Victoria, those 
present began to try and prove that on account of their 
ancient lineage they were exempt from the rule of par- 
venu peers. The duke was very tolerant with this dis- 
cussion and, as always, the soul of politeness. 

The host said: "Your Royal Highness, could you 
oblige us with a sketch of your ancestry?" 

"Oh, certainly," answered the duke; "it is very brief. 
My family, the Philippes, are descendants from yEneas 
of Troy, and ./Eneas was the son of Venus." The mush- 
rooms seemed smaller than even the garden variety. 

The duke was talking to me at one time very inter- 
estingly about the visit of his father to America. At the 
time of the French Revolution his father had to flee for 
his life and came to the United States. He was enter- 
tained at Mount Vernon by Washington. He told me 
that after his father became King of France, he would 
often hesitate, or refuse to do something or write some- 
thing which his ministers desired. The king's answer 
always was: "When I visited that greatest man of all the 
world, General Washington, at his home, I asked him at 
one time: 'General, is it not possible that in your long 
and wonderful career as a soldier and statesman that 
you have made mistakes?' The general answered: 'I 
have never done anything which I cared to recall or said 



3 o6 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

anything which I would not repeat,' and the king would 
say: 'I cannot do that or sign that, because if I do I 
cannot say for myself what General Washington said of 
himself/ " 

The duke asked me to spend a week-end with him at 
Chantilly, and it is one of the regrets of my life that I 
was unable to accept. 

I happened to be in London on two successive Sun- 
days. On the first I went to Westminster Abbey to hear 
Canon Farrar preach. The sermon was worthy of its 
wonderful setting. Westminster Abbey is one of the 
most inspiring edifices in the world. The orator has to 
reach a high plane to be worthy of its pulpit. I have 
heard many dull discourses there because the surround- 
ings refuse to harmonize with mediocrity. The sermon 
of Canon Farrar was classic. It could easily have taken 
a place among the gems of English literature. It seemed 
to me to meet whatever criticism the eminent dead, 
buried in that old mausoleum, might have of these mod- 
ern utterances. I left the Abbey spiritually and men- 
tally elated. 

The next Sunday I went to hear Charles Spurgeon. 
It was a wonderful contrast. Spurgeon's Metropolitan 
Tabernacle was a very plain structure of immense pro- 
portions but with admirable acoustics. There was none 
of the historic enshrining the church, which is the glory of 
Westminster Abbey, no church vestments or ceremonials. 

Mr. Spurgeon, a plain, stocky-looking man, came out 
on the platform dressed in an ordinary garb of black 
coat, vest, and trousers. It was a vast audience of 
what might be called middle-class people. Mr. Spur- 
geon's sermon was a plain, direct, and exceedingly forci- 



RECOLLECTIONS FROM ABROAD 307 

ble appeal to their judgment and emotions. There was 
no attempt at rhetoric, but hard, hammerlike blows. 
As he rose in his indignation and denunciation of some 
current evils, and illustrated his argument with the Old 
Testament examples of the punishment of sinners, the 
audience became greatly excited. One of the officers of 
the church, in whose pew I sat, groaned aloud and gripped 
his hands so that the nails left their mark. Others 
around him were in the same frame of mind and spirit. 

I saw there and then that the men who fought with 
Cromwell and won the battle of Naseby had in modern 
England plenty of descendants. They had changed 
only in outward deference to modern usages and condi- 
tions. If there had been occasion, Mr. Spurgeon could 
have led them for any sacrifice to what they believed to 
be right. I felt the power of that suppressed feeling — I 
would not say fanaticism, but intense conscientiousness 
— which occasionally in elections greatly surprises Eng- 
lish politicians. 

Canon Farrar's sermon easily takes its place among 
the selected books of the library. Spurgeon's address 
was straight from the shoulder, blow for blow, for the 
needs of the hour. 

One of the novel incidents of the generous hospitality 
which I enjoyed every year in London was a dinner at 
the Athenaeum Club given to me by one of the members 
of the government at that time. He was a gentleman 
of high rank and political importance. There were 
twenty-six at the dinner, and it was a representative 
gathering. 

At the conclusion our host made a very cordial speech 
on more intimate relations between the United States 



3 o8 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

and Great Britain, and then in a complimentary phrase 
introduced me, saying: "I hope you will speak freely and 
without limit." 

I was encouraged by a most sympathetic audience and 
had a good time during my effort. No one else was 
called upon. My host was complimentary and said: 
"Your speech was so satisfactory that I thought best not 
to have any more." 

Some time afterwards he said to me: "Many of my 
friends had heard of you but never heard you, so I made 
up my mind to give them the opportunity, and what was 
really a purely social affair for every other guest, I turned 
into an international occasion just to draw you out. 
However, the fraud, if it was a fraud, was an eminent 



success." 



No one in England did more for Americans than Sir 
Henry Lucy. Every American knew all about him, be- 
cause of his reputation, and particularly because he was 
the author of that most interesting column in Punch 
called the "Essence of Parliament." 

At his luncheons he gathered eminent men in public 
life and in the literary and journalistic activities of Great 
Britain. These luncheons were most informal, and under 
the hospitable genius of Lucy the guests became on inti- 
mate terms. There was no table in London where so 
many racy stories and sometimes valuable historical 
reminiscences could be heard. 

To be a guest at one of Sir Lucy's luncheons was for 
an American to meet on familiar terms with distin- 
guished men whom he knew all about and was most 
anxious to see and hear. 

At a large dinner I had a pleasant encounter with Sir 



RECOLLECTIONS FROM ABROAD 309 

Henry. In order to meet another engagement, he tried 
to slip quietly out while I was speaking. I caught sight 
of his retreating figure and called loudly the refrain of 
the familiar song, "Linger longer, Lucy." The shout 
of the crowd brought Sir Henry back, and the other 
entertainment lost a guest. 

In several of my visits to London I went to see not 
only places of interest but also houses and streets made 
famous in English literature. In one of my many trips 
to St. Paul's Cathedral I was looking at the tomb of the 
Duke of Wellington in the crypt and also at the modest 
tomb of Cruikshank, the artist, near by. 

The superintendent asked me who I was and many 
questions about America, and then said: "Many Ameri- 
cans come here, but the most remarkable of them all was 
Colonel Robert G. IngersoII. He was very inquisitive 
and wanted to know all about Wellington's tomb. I 
told him that the duke's body was first put in a wooden 
coffin, and this was incased in steel; that this had made 
for it a position in a stone weighing twenty tons and 
over that was a huge stone weighing forty tons. He 
gave me a slap on the back which sent me flying quite a 
distance and exclaimed: 'Old man, you have got him 
safe. If he ever escapes cable at my expense to Robert 
G. IngersoII, Peoria, Illinois, U. S. A.'" 

I had an opportunity to know that the war by Ger- 
many against France and England was a surprise to both 
countries. While in London during part of June, 1914, 
I met Cabinet ministers and members of Parliament, 
and their whole thought and anxiety were concentrated 
on the threatened revolution in Ireland. 



3 io CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

The Cabinet had asked the king to intervene and he 
had called representatives of all parties to meet him at 
Buckingham Palace. After many consultations he de- 
clared settlement or compromise were impossible. The 
situation was so critical that it absorbed the attention 
of the government, the press, and the public. 

About the first of July I was in Paris and found the 
French worried about their finances and the increase in 
their military expenses which were reaching threatening 
figures. The syndicate of French bankers were seriously 
alarmed. There was no suspicion of German purpose 
and preparations for attack. 

While in Geneva a few weeks afterwards I became 
alarmed by letters from relatives in Germany who were 
socially intimate with people holding very important 
positions in the government and the army, and their 
apprehensions from what their German friends told them 
and what they saw led to their joining us in Switzerland. 

One day the Swiss refused to take foreign money or to 
make exchange for Swiss, or to cash letters of credit or 
bank checks. I immediately concluded that the Swiss 
bankers knew of or suspected Germany's hostile inten- 
tions, and with only two hours, and two families with 
their trunks to pack, we managed to reach and secure 
accommodations on the regular train for Paris. There 
was nothing unusual either at the railroad station or in 
the city. 

One of the amusing incidents which are my life-pre- 
servers occurred at the station. Two elderly English 
spinsters were excitedly discussing the currency trouble. 
One of them smoothed out a bank of England note and 
said to her sister: "There, Sarah, is a bank of England 
note which has been good as gold all over the world 



RECOLLECTIONS FROM ABROAD 311 

since Christ came to earth, and these Swiss pigs won't 
take it." 

I told this incident afterwards to a banker in London. 
He said they were very ignorant women, there were no 
bank of England notes at that time. 

German hostility developed so rapidly that our train 
was the last which left Switzerland for France for nearly 
two months. We were due in Paris at ten o'clock in 
the evening, but did not arrive until the next morning 
because of the mobilization of French recruits. 

The excitement in Paris was intense. A French states- 
man said to me: "We are doing our best to avoid war. 
Our troops are kept ten kilometres from the frontier, 
but the Germans have crossed and seized strategic points. 
They will hear nothing and accept nothing and are deter- 
mined to crush us if they can." 

From all ranks of the people was heard: "We will 
fight to the last man, but we are outnumbered and will 
be destroyed unless England helps. Will England help? 
Will England help?" I have been through several 
crises but never witnessed nor felt such a reaction to 
ecstatic joy as occurred when Great Britain joined 
France. 

The restrictions on leaving Paris required time, pa- 
tience, and all the resources of our Embassy to get us 
out of France. The helpfulness, resourcefulness, and 
untiring efforts of our Ambassador, Myron T. Herrick, 
won the gratitude of all Americans whom the war had 
interned on the continent and who must get home. 

There was a remarkable change in England. When we 
left in July there was almost hysteria over the threaten- 
ing civil war. In October the people were calm though 
involved in the greatest war in their history. They 



312 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

did not minimize the magnitude of the struggle, or the 
sacrifices it would require. There was a characteristic 
grim determination to see the crisis through, regardless 
of cost. Cabinet ministers whom I met thought the 
war would last three years. 

The constant appeal to me, as to other Americans, 
was, "When will you join us? If we fail it is your turn 
next. It is autocracy and militarism against civilization, 
liberty, and representative government for the whole 
worId.' , 

We had a perilous and anxious voyage home and found 
few grasping the situation or working to be prepared for 
the inevitable, except Theodore Roosevelt and General 
Wood. 



XX 

ORATORS AND CAMPAIGN SPEAKERS 

During my college days at Yale Wendell Phillips, 
William Lloyd Garrison, and Henry Ward Beecher were 
frequent lecturers, and generally on the slavery question. 
I have heard most of the great orators of the world, but 
none of them produced such an immediate and lasting 
effect upon their audience as Wendell Phillips. He was 
the finest type of a cultured New Englander. He was 
the recipient of the best education possible in his time 
and with independent means which enabled him to pur- 
sue his studies and career. Besides, he was one of the 
handsomest men I ever saw upon the platform, and in 
his inspired moments met one's imaginative conception 
of a Greek god. 

Phillips rarely made a gesture or spoke above the 
conversational, but his musical voice reached the remot- 
est corners of the hall. The eager audience, fearful of 
losing a word, would bend forward with open mouths as 
well as attentive ears. It was always a hostile audience 
at the beginning of Mr. Phillips's address, but before the 
end he swayed them to applause, tears, or laughter, as a 
skilled performer upon a perfect instrument. His sub- 
ject was nearly always slavery, his views very extreme 
and for immediate abolition, but at that time he had a 
very small following. Nevertheless, his speeches, espe- 
cially because of the riots and controversies they caused, 
set people thinking, and largely increased the hostility 
to slavery, especially to its extension. 

313 



314 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

I met Mr. Phillips one evening, after a lecture, at the 
house of Professor Goodrich. He was most courtly and 
considerate to students and invited questions. While I 
was charmed, even captivated, by his eloquence, I had 
at that time very little sympathy with his views. I said 
to him: "Mr. Phillips, your attack to-night upon Caleb 
Cushing, one of the most eminent and able public men 
in the country, was very vitriolic and most destructive 
of character and reputation. It seems so foreign to all 
I know of you that, if you will pardon me, I would like 
to know why you did it." He answered: "I have found 
that people, as a rule, are not interested in principles or 
their discussions. They are so absorbed in their per- 
sonal affairs that they do very little thinking upon mat- 
ters outside their business or vocation. They embody a 
principle in some public man in whom they have faith, 
and so that man stands for a great body of truth or 
falsehood, and may be exceedingly dangerous because a 
large following connects the measure with the man, and, 
therefore, if I can destroy the man who represents a 
vicious principle I have destroyed the principle." It did 
not strike me favorably at the time, nor does it now. 
Nevertheless, in politics and in the battles of politics it 
represents a dynamic truth. 

The perfect preparation of a speech was, in Wendell 
Phillip's view, that one in which the mental operations 
were assisted in no way by outside aid. Only two or 
three times in his life did he prepare with pen and paper 
an address, and he felt that these speeches were the 
poorest of his efforts. He was constantly studying the 
art of oratory. In his daily walks or in his library meta- 
phors and similes were suggested, which he tucked away 
in his memory, and he even studied action as he watched 



ORATORS AND CAMPAIGN SPEAKERS 315 

the muscular movements of men whom he saw in public 
places. He believed that a perfect speech could be pre- 
pared only after intense mental concentration. Of 
course the mind must first be fortified by such reading 
as provided facts. Having thus saturated his mind with 
information, he would frequently lie extended for hours 
upon his sofa, with eyes closed, making mental arrange- 
ments for the address. In fact, he used to write his 
speeches mentally, as Victor Hugo is said to have writ- 
ten some of his poems. A speech thus prepared, Phillips 
thought, was always at the command of the speaker. It 
might vary upon every delivery, and could be altered to 
meet emergencies with the audience, but would always 
be practically the same. 

This method of preparation explains what has been a 
mystery to many persons. The several reports of Phil- 
lips's lecture on "The Lost Arts" differ in phraseology and 
even in arrangement. Mr. Phillips did not read his 
speeches in print, and, therefore, never revised one. He 
was firmly of the belief that the printed thought and the 
spoken thought should be expressed in different form, 
and that the master of one form could not be the master 
of the other. 

I met many young men like myself in the canvass of 
1856, and also made many acquaintances of great value 
in after-life. It was difficult for the older stump speak- 
ers to change the addresses they had been delivering for 
years, so that the young orators, with their fresh enthu- 
siasm, their intense earnestness and undoubting faith, 
were more popular with the audiences, who were keenly 
alive to the issues raised then by the new Republican 
party. 

The Republican party was composed of Whigs and 



316 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

anti-slavery Democrats. In this first campaign the old- 
timers among the Whigs and the Democrats could not 
get over their long antagonism and distrusted each other. 
The young men, whether their ancestry was Democratic 
or Whig, were the amalgam which rapidly fused all ele- 
ments, so that the party presented a united front in the 
campaign four years afterwards when Mr. Lincoln was 
elected. 

In the course of that campaign I had as fellow speak- 
ers many times on the platform statesmen of national 
reputation. These gentlemen, with few exceptions, made 
heavy, ponderous, and platitudinous speeches. If they 
ever had possessed humor they were afraid of it. The 
crowd, however, would invariably desert the statesman 
for the speaker who could give them amusement with 
instruction. The elder statesmen said by way of advice: 
"While the people want to be amused, they have no 
faith in a man or woman with wit or anecdote. When 
it comes to the election of men to conduct public affairs, 
they invariably prefer serious men." There is no doubt 
that a reputation for wit has seriously impaired the pros- 
pects of many of the ablest men in the country. 

The only exception to this rule was Abraham Lincoln. 
But when he ran for president the first time he was com- 
paratively unknown outside his State of Illinois. The 
campaign managers in their literature put forward only 
his serious speeches, which were very remarkable, espe- 
cially the one he delivered in Cooper Union, New York, 
which deeply impressed the thoughtful men of the East. 
He could safely tell stories and jokes after he had dem- 
onstrated his greatness as president. Then the people 
regarded his story-telling as the necessary relief and re- 
laxation of an overburdened and overworked public ser- 



ORATORS AND CAMPAIGN SPEAKERS 317 

vant. But before he had demonstrated his genius as an 
executive, they would probably have regarded these 
same traits as evidences of frivolity, unfitting the pos- 
sessor for great and grave responsibilities. 

I had a very interesting talk on the subject with Gen- 
eral Garfield, when he was running for president. He 
very kindly said to me: "You have every qualification 
for success in public life; you might get anywhere and to 
the highest places except for your humor. I know its 
great value to a speaker before an audience, but it is 
dangerous at the polls. When I began in politics, soon 
after graduation, I found I had a keen sense of humor, 
and that made me the most sought-after of all our neigh- 
borhood speakers, but I also soon discovered it was seri- 
ously impairing the public opinion of me for responsible 
positions, so I decided to cut it out. It was very diffi- 
cult, but I have succeeded so thoroughly that I can no 
longer tell a story or appreciate the point of one when 
it is told to me. Had I followed my natural bent I 
should not now be the candidate of my party for Presi- 
dent of the United States." 

The reason so few men are humorists is that they are 
very shy of humor. My own observations in studying 
the lives and works of our public men demonstrate how 
thoroughly committed to this idea they have been. 
There is not a joke, nor a mot, nor a scintilla of humor 
irradiating the Revolutionary statesmen. There is a 
stilted dignity about their utterances which shows that 
they were always posing in heroic attitudes. If they 
lived and moved in family, social, and club life, as we 
understand it, the gloom of their companionship ac- 
counts for the enjoyment which their contemporaries took 
in the three hours' sermons then common from the pulpit. 



3 i8 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

As we leave the period of Washington, Hamilton, Jef- 
ferson, and the Adamses, we find no humor in the next 
generation. The only relief from the tedium of argu- 
ment and exhaustless logic is found in the savage sarcasm 
of John Randolph, which was neither wit nor humor. 

A witty illustration or an apt story will accomplish 
more than columns of argument. The old-time audience 
demanded a speech of not less than two hours' ■ duration 
and expected three. The audience of to-day grows res- 
tive after the first hour, and is better pleased with forty 
minutes. It prefers epigrams to arguments and humor 
to rhetoric. It is still true, however, that the press pre- 
sents to readers from a speaker who indulges in humor 
only the funny part of his effort, and he is in serious dan- 
ger of receiving no credit for ability in the discussion of 
great questions, no matter how conspicuous that ability 
may be. The question is always presented to a frequent 
speaker whether he shall win the applause of the audi- 
ence and lose the flattering opinion of the critics, or bore 
his audience and be complimented by readers for wisdom. 

When I look back over sixty-five years on the plat- 
form in public speaking, and the success of different 
methods before audiences, political, literary, business, or 
a legislative committee, or a legislature itself, and espe- 
cially when I consider my own pleasure in the efforts, 
the results and compensations have been far greater than 
the attainment of any office. For, after all, a man might 
be dull and a bore to himself and others for a lifetime 
and have the reputation of being a serious thinker and 
a solid citizen, and yet never reach the presidency. 

It was always a delight to listen to George W. Curtis. 
He was a finished orator of the classic type, but not of 
the Demosthenian order. His fine personal appearance, 



ORATORS AND CAMPAIGN SPEAKERS 319 

his well-modulated and far-reaching voice, and his 
refined manner at once won the favor of his audience. 
He was a splendid type of the scholar in politics. In 
preparing a speech he took as much pains as he did 
with a volume which he was about to publish. 

I accepted under great pressure the invitation to de- 
liver the oration at the unveiling of the Bartholdi Stat- 
ue of Liberty in New York harbor, because the time 
was so short, only a few days. Mr. Curtis said to me 
afterwards: "I was very much surprised that you ac- 
cepted that invitation. I declined it because there was 
only a month left before the unveiling. I invariably 
refuse an invitation for an important address unless I 
can have three months. I take one month to look up 
authorities and carefully prepare it and then lay it on 
the shelf for a month. During that period, while you 
are paying no attention to the matter, your mind is un- 
consciously at work upon it. When you resume cor- 
recting your manuscript you find that in many things 
about which you thought well you have changed your 
mind. Leisurely corrections and additions will perfect 
the address." 

As my orations and speeches have always been the 
by-product of spare evenings and Sundays taken from 
an intensely active and busy life, if I had followed any 
of these examples my twelve volumes of speeches would 
never have seen the light of day. 

One of the greatest orators of his generation, and I 
might say of ours, was Robert G. IngersoII. I was privi- 
leged to meet Colonel IngersoII many times, and on 
several occasions to be a speaker on the same platform. 
The zenith of his fame was reached by his "plumed- 
knight" speech, nominating James G. Blaine for presi- 



320 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

dent at the national Republican convention in 1876. 
It was the testimony of all the delegates that if the vote 
could have been taken immediately at the conclusion of 
the speech, Mr. Blaine would have been elected. 

Colonel IngersoII carried off the oratorical honors of 
that campaign in a series of speeches, covering the whole 
country. I say a series of speeches; he really had but 
one, which was the most effective campaign address I 
ever heard, but which he delivered over and over again, 
and every time with phenomenal success, a success the 
like of which I have never known. He delivered it to 
an immense audience in New York, and swept them off 
their feet. He repeated this triumph the next day at 
an open-air meeting in Wall Street, and again the next 
day at a great gathering in New Jersey. The news- 
papers printed the speech in full every day after its de- 
livery, as if it had been a new and first utterance of the 
great orator. 

I spoke with him several times when he was one of the 
speakers after an important dinner. It was a rare treat 
to hear him. The effort apparently was impromptu, 
and that added to its effect upon his auditors. That it 
was thoroughly prepared I found by hearing it several 
times, always unchanged and always producing the 
same thrilling effect. 

He spoke one night at Cooper Institute at a celebra- 
tion by the colored people of Mr. Lincoln's proclamation 
emancipating them from slavery. As usual he was mas- 
ter of the occasion and of his audience. He was then 
delivering a series of addresses attacking the Bible. His 
mind was full of that subject, and apparently he could 
not help assailing the faith of the negroes by asking, if 
there was a God of justice and mercy, why did he leave 



ORATORS AND CAMPAIGN SPEAKERS 321 

them so long in slavery or permit them ever to be 
slaves. 

To an emotional audience like the one before him it 
was a most dangerous attack upon faith. I was so fond 
of the colonel and such an intense admirer of him, I 
hated to controvert him, but felt it was necessary to do 
so. The religious fervor which is so intense with the 
colored people, made it comparatively easy to restore 
their faith, if it had been weakened, and to bring them 
to a recognition of the fact that their blessings had all 
come from God. 

Probably the most brilliant speaker of the period im- 
mediately preceding the Civil War was Thomas Corwin, 
of Ohio. We have on the platform in these times no 
speaker of his type. He had remarkable influence when- 
ever he participated in debate in the House of Represen- 
tatives. On the stump or hustings he would draw audi- 
ences away from Henry Clay or any of the famous 
speakers of the time. I sometimes wonder if our more 
experienced and more generally educated audiences of 
to-day would be swayed by Corwin's methods. He had 
to the highest degree every element of effective speech. 
He could put his audience in tears or hilarious laughter, 
or arouse cheers. He told more stories and told them 
better than any one else, and indulged freely in what is 
called Fourth of July exaggeration. He would relieve a 
logical presentation which was superb and unanswerable 
by a rhetorical flight of fancy, or by infectious humor. 
Near the close of his life he spoke near New York, and 
his great reputation drew to the meeting the representa- 
tives of the metropolitan press. He swept the audience 
off their feet, but the comment of the journals was very 
critical and unfavorable, both of the speech and the 



322 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

orator. It was an illustration of what I have often met 
with: of a speech which was exactly the right thing for 
the occasion and crowd, but lost its effect in publication. 
Corwin's humor barred his path to great office, and he 
saw many ordinary men advance ahead of him. 

The most potent factor in the destruction of his ene- 
mies and buttressing his own cause was his inimitable 
wit and humor. In broad statesmanship, solid require- 
ments, and effective eloquence, he stood above the suc- 
cessful mediocrity of his time — the Buchanans and the 
Polks, the Franklin Pierces and the Winfield Scotts — 
like a star of the first magnitude above the Milky Way. 
But in later years he thought the failure to reach the 
supreme recognition to which he was entitled was due 
to his humor having created the impression in the minds 
of his countrymen that he was not a serious person. 

Wayne MacVeagh was a very interesting and original 
speaker. He had a finished and cultured style and a 
very attractive delivery. He was past master of sarcasm 
as well as of burning eloquence on patriotic themes. 
When I was a freshman at Yale he was a senior. I 
heard him very often at our debating society, the Lino- 
nian, where he gave promise of his future success. His 
father-in-law was Simon Cameron, secretary of war, and 
he was one of the party which went with Mr. Lincoln to 
Gettysburg and heard Lincoln's famous address. He 
told me that it did not produce much impression at the 
time, and it was long after before the country woke up to 
its surpassing excellence, and he did not believe the story 
still current that Mr. Lincoln wrote it on an envelope 
while on the train to Gettysburg. 

MacVeagh became one of the leaders of the American 
bar and was at one time attorney-general of the United 



ORATORS AND CAMPAIGN SPEAKERS 323 

States. He was successful as a diplomat as minister to 
Turkey and to Italy. 

I heard him on many occasions and spoke with him on 
many after-dinner platforms. As an after-dinner speaker 
he was always at his best if some one attacked him, be- 
cause he had a very quick temper. He got off on me a 
witticism which had considerable vogue at the time. 
When I was elected president of the New York Central 
Railroad, the Yale Association of New York gave me a 
dinner. It was largely attended by distinguished Yale 
graduates from different parts of the country. Mac- 
Veagh was one of the speakers. In the course of his 
speech he said: "I was alarmed when I found that our 
friend Chauncey had been elected president of the most 
unpopular railroad there is in the country. But rest 
assured, my friends, that he will change the situation, 
and before his administration is closed make it the most 
popular of our railroad corporations, because he will 
bring the stock within the reach of the poorest citizen 
of the land." The stock was then at the lowest point in 
its history on account of its Iife-and-death fight with the 
West Shore Railroad, and so, of course, the reverse of 
my friend MacVeagh's prediction was not difficult. 

One of the greatest and most remarkable orators of 
his time was Henry Ward Beecher. I never met his 
equal in readiness and versatility. His vitality was in- 
fectious. He was a big, healthy, vigorous man with the 
physique of an athlete, and his intellectual fire and vigor 
corresponded with his physical strength. There seemed 
to be no limit to his ideas, anecdotes, illustrations, and 
incidents. He had a fervid imagination and wonderful 
power of assimilation and reproduction and the most ob- 
servant of eyes. He was drawing material constantly 



324 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

from the forests, the flowers, the gardens, and the domes- 
tic animals in the fields and in the house, and using them 
most effectively in his sermons and speeches. An inti- 
mate friend of mine, a country doctor and great admirer 
of Mr. Beecher, became a subscriber to the weekly paper 
in which was printed his Sunday sermon, and carefully 
guarded a file of them which he made. He not only 
wanted to read the sermons of his favorite preacher, but 
he believed him to have infinite variety, and was con- 
stantly examining the efforts of his idol to see if he could 
not find an illustration, anecdote, or idea repeated. 

Mr. Beecher seemed to be teeming with ideas all the 
time, almost to the point of bursting. While most ora- 
tors are relying upon their libraries and their common- 
place book, and their friends for material, he apparently 
found more in every twenty-four hours than he could 
use. His sermons every Sunday appeared in the press. 
He lectured frequently; several times a week he delivered 
after-dinner speeches, and during such intervals as he 
had he made popular addresses, spoke at meetings on 
municipal and general reform, and on patriotic occasions. 
One of the most effective, and for the time one of the 
most eloquent addresses I ever heard in my life was the 
one he delivered at the funeral of Horace Greeley. 

When the sentiment in England in favor of the South 
in our Civil War seemed to be growing to a point where 
Great Britain might recognize the Southern Confederacy, 
Mr. Lincoln asked Mr. Beecher to go over and present 
the Union side. Those speeches of Mr. Beecher, a 
stranger in a strange country, to hostile audiences, were 
probably as extraordinary an evidence of oratorical 
power as was ever known. He captured audiences, he 
overcame the hostility of persistent disturbers of the 



ORATORS AND CAMPAIGN SPEAKERS 325 

meetings, and with his ready wit overwhelmed the 
heckler. 

At one of the great meetings, when the sentiment was 
rapidly changing from hostility to favor, a man arose 
and asked Mr. Beecher: "If you people of the North are 
so strong and your cause is so good, why after all these 
years of fighting have you not licked the South?" Mr. 
Beecher's instant and most audacious reply was: "If the 
Southerners were Englishmen we would have licked 
them." With the English love of fair play, the retort 
was accepted with cheers. 

While other orators were preparing, he seemed to be 
seeking occasions for talking and drawing from an over- 
flowing reservoir. Frequently he would spend an hour 
with a crowd of admirers, just talking to them on any 
subject which might be uppermost in his mind. I knew 
an authoress who was always present at these gatherings, 
who took copious notes and reproduced them with great 
fidelity. There were circles of Beecher worshippers in 
many towns and in many States. This authoress used 
to come to New Haven in my senior year at Yale, and in 
a circle of Beecher admirers, which I was permitted to 
attend, would reproduce these informal talks of Mr. 
Beecher. He was the most ready orator, and with his 
almost feminine sympathies and emotional nature would 
add immensely to his formal speech by ideas which 
would occur to him in the heat of delivery, or with com- 
ment upon conversations which he had heard on the 
way to church or meeting. 

I happened to be on a train with him on an all-day 
journey, and he never ceased talking in the most inter- 
esting and effective way, and pouring out from his rich 
and inexhaustible stores with remarkable lucidity and 



326 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

eloquence his views upon current topics, as well as upon 
recent literature, art, and world movements. 

Beecher's famous trial on charges made by Theodore 
Tilton against him on relations with Tilton's wife en- 
grossed the attention of the world. The charge was a 
shock to the religious and moral sense of countless mil- 
lions of people. When the trial was over the public was 
practically convinced of Mr. Beecher's innocence. The 
jury, however, disagreed, a few holding out against him. 
The case was never again brought to trial. The trial 
lasted six months. 

One evening when I was in Peekskill I went from our 
old homestead into the crowded part of the village, to be 
with old friends. I saw there a large crowd and also the 
village military and fire companies. I asked what it 
was all about, and was informed that the whole town 
was going out to Mr. Beecher's house, which was about 
one and one-half miles from the village, to join in a 
demonstration for his vindication. I took step with one 
of the companies to which I belonged when I was a boy, 
and marched out with the crowd. 

The president of the village and leading citizens, one 
after another, mounted the platform, which was the 
piazza of Mr. Beecher's house, and expressed their con- 
fidence in him and the confidence of his neighbors, the 
villagers. Then Mr. Beecher said to me: "You were 
born in this town and are known all over the country. 
If you feel like saying something it would travel far." 
Of course, I was very glad of the opportunity because I 
believed in him. In the course of my speech I told a 
story which had wonderful vogue. I said: "Mr. Lincoln 
told me of an experience he had in his early practice 
when he was defending a man who had been accused of 



ORATORS AND CAMPAIGN SPEAKERS 327 

a vicious assault upon a neighbor. There were no wit- 
nesses, and under the laws of evidence at that time the 
accused could not testify. So the complainant had it 
all his own way. The only opportunity Mr. Lincoln had 
to help his client was to break down the accuser on a 
cross-examination. Mr. Lincoln said he saw that the 
accuser was a boastful and bumptious man, and so 
asked him: 'How much ground was there over which 
you and my client fought?' The witness answered 
proudly: 'Six acres, Mr. Lincoln.' 'Well,' said Lin- 
coln, 'don't you think this was a mighty small crop of 
fight to raise on such a large farm?' Mr. Lincoln said 
the judge laughed and so did the district attorney and 
the jury, and his client was acquitted." 

The appositeness was in the six acres of ground of 
the Lincoln trial and of the six months of the Beecher 
trial. As this was a new story of Lincoln's, which had 
never been printed, and as it related to the trial of the 
most famous of preachers on the worst of charges that 
could be made against a preacher, the story was printed 
all over the country, and from friends and consular 
agents who sent me clippings I found was copied in 
almost every country in the world. 

Mr. Beecher was one of the few preachers who was 
both most effective in the pulpit and, if possible, more 
eloquent upon the platform. When there was a moral 
issue involved he would address political audiences. In 
one campaign his speeches were more widely printed 
than those of any of the senators, members of the House, 
or governors who spoke. I remember one illustration of 
his about his dog, Noble, barking for hours at the hole 
from which a squirrel had departed, and was enjoying 
the music sitting calmly in the crotch of a tree. The 



328 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

illustration caught the fancy of the country and turned, 
the laugh upon the opposition. 

Hugh J. Hastings, at one time editor and proprietor, 
of the Albany Knickerbocker, and subsequently of the 
New York Commercial Advertiser, was full of valuable 
reminiscences. He began life in journalism as a very 
young man under Thurlow Weed. This association 
made him a Whig. Very few Irishmen belonged to that 
party. Hastings was a born politician and organized 
an Irish Whig club. He told me that he worshipped 
Daniel Webster. 

Webster, he said, once stopped over at Albany while 
passing through the State, and became a guest of one of 
Albany's leading citizens and its most generous host and 
entertainer. The gentleman gave in Webster's honor a 
large dinner at which were present all the notables of 
the capital. 

Hastings organized a procession which grew to enor- 
mous proportions by the time it reached the residence 
where Mr. Webster was dining. When the guests came 
out, it was evident, according to Hastings, that they had 
been dining too well. This was not singular, because 
then no dinner was perfect in Albany unless there were 
thirteen courses and thirteen different kinds of wine, and 
the whole closed up with the famous Regency rum, 
which had been secured by Albany bon-vivants before 
the insurrection in the West Indies had stopped its 
manufacture. There was a kick in it which, if there had 
been no other brands preceding, was fatal to all except 
the strongest heads. I tested its powers myself when I 
was in office in Albany fifty-odd years ago. 

Hastings said that when Webster began his speech he 
was as near his idol as possible and stood right in front 



ORATORS AND CAMPAIGN SPEAKERS 329 

of him. When the statesman made a gesture to empha- 
size a sentence he lost his hold on the balustrade and 
pitched forward. The young Irishman was equal to the 
occasion, and interposed an athletic arm, which pre- 
vented Mr. Webster from falling, and held him until he 
had finished his address. The fact that he could con- 
tinue his address under such conditions increased, if that 
was possible, the admiration of young Hastings. Web- 
ster was one of the few men who, when drunk all over, 
had a sober head. 

The speech was very effective, not only to that audi- 
ence, but, as reported, all over the country. Hastings 
was sent for and escorted to the dining-room, where the 
guests had reassembled. Webster grasped him by the 
hand, and in his most Jovian way exclaimed: "Young 
man, you prevented me from disgracing myself. I thank 
you and will never forget you." Hastings reported his 
feelings as such that if he had died that night he had 
received of life all it had which was worth living for. 

I do not know what were Mr. Webster's drinking 
habits, but the popular reports in regard to them had a 
very injurious effect upon young men and especially 
young lawyers. It was the universal conversation that 
Webster was unable to do his best work and have his 
mind at its highest efficiency except under the influence 
of copious drafts of brandy. Many a young lawyer 
believing this drank to excess, not because he loved 
alcohol, but because he believed its use might make him 
a second Webster. 

Having lived in that atmosphere, I tried the experi- 
ment myself. Happily for me, I discovered how utterly 
false it is. I tried the hard liquors, brandy, whiskey, 
and gin, and then the wines. I found that all had a de- 



330 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

pressing and deadening effect upon the mind, but that 
there was a certain exhilaration, though not a healthy 
one, in champagne. I also discovered, and found the 
same was true with every one else, that the mind works 
best and produces the more satisfactory results without 
any alcohol whatever. 

I doubt if any speaker, unless he has become depen- 
dent upon stimulants, can use them before making an 
important effort without having his mental machinery 
more or less clogged. I know it is reported that Addi- 
son, whose English has been the model of succeeding 
generations, in writing his best essays wore the carpet 
out while walking between sentences from the sideboard 
where the brandy was to his writing-table. But they 
had heroic constitutions and iron-clad digestive appara- 
tus in those times, which have not been transmitted to 
their descendants. 

I heard another story of Webster from Horace F. 
Clarke, a famous lawyer of New York, and a great friend 
of his. Mr. Clarke said that he had a case involving 
very large interests before the chancellor. He discov- 
ered that Mr. Webster was at the Astor House, and 
called upon him. Mr. Webster told him that his public 
and professional engagements were overwhelming, and 
that it was impossible for him to take up anything new. 
Clarke put a thousand dollars on the table and pleaded 
with Mr. Webster to accept a retainer. Clarke said that 
Webster looked longingly at the money, saying: "Young 
man, you cannot imagine, and I have no words which can 
express how much I need that money, but it is impossi- 
ble. However, let me see your brief." Webster read it 
over and then said to Clarke: "You will not win on that 
brief, but if you will incorporate this, I think your case 



ORATORS AND CAMPAIGN SPEAKERS 331 

is all right." Clarke said that when he presented the 
brief and made his argument before the chancellor, the 
chancellor decided in his favor, wholly on the suggestion 
made by Mr. Webster. An eminent lawyer told me that 
studying Mr. Webster's arguments before the Supreme 
Court and the decisions made in those cases, he discov- 
ered very often that the opinion of the court followed 
the reasoning of this marvellous advocate. 

Henry J. Raymond told me the following story of Mr. 
William H. Seward. He said that one morning a mes- 
senger came to his office (Raymond at that time was 
editor of the New York Times) and said that Mr. Seward 
was at the Astor House and wanted to see me. When I 
arrived Mr. Seward said: "I am on my way to my home 
at Auburn, where I am expected to deliver a speech for 
the whole country in explanation and defense of our 
administration. [Johnson was president.] When I am 
ready I will wire you, and then send me one of your best 
reporters." About two weeks afterwards Mr. Ray- 
mond received this cryptic telegram from Mr. Seward: 
"Send me the man of whom I spoke." 

When the reporter returned he said to Mr. Raymond: 
"When I arrived at Auburn I expected that a great 
meeting had been advertised, but there were no hand- 
bills, notices, or anything in the local papers, so I went 
up to Mr. Seward's house. He said to me: 'I am very 
glad to see you. Have you your pencil and note-book? 
if so, we will make a speech.' After the dictation Mr. 
Seward said: 'Please write that out on every third line, 
so as to leave room for corrections, and bring it back to 
me in the morning.' When I gave the copy to Mr. 
Seward, he took it and kept it during the day, and when 
I returned in the evening the vacant space had been 



332 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

filled with corrections and new matter. Mr. Seward 
said to me: 'Now make me a clean copy as corrected.' 
When I returned with the corrected copy he remarked: 
'I think you and I made a very poor speech. Let us 
try it again.' The same process was repeated a second 
time, and this corrected copy of the speech was delivered 
in part to a few friends who were called into Mr. Seward's 
library for the occasion. The next morning these head- 
lines appeared in all the leading papers in the country: 
'Great Speech on Behalf of the Administration 
by the Secretary of State at a Big Mass Meeting 
at Auburn, N. Y.'" 

In the career of a statesman a phrase will often make 
or unmake his future. In the height of the slavery ex- 
citement and while the enforcement of the fugitive-slave 
law was arousing the greatest indignation in the North, 
Mr. Seward delivered a speech at Rochester, N. Y., 
which stirred the country. In that speech, while pay- 
ing due deference to the Constitution and the laws, he 
very solemnly declared that "there is a higher law." 
Mr. Seward sometimes called attention to his position by 
an oracular utterance which he left the people to inter- 
pret. This phrase, "the higher law," became of first- 
class importance, both in Congress, in the press, and on 
the platform. On the one side, it was denounced as 
treason and anarchy. On the other side, it was the call 
of conscience and of the New Testament's teaching of 
the rights of man. It was one of the causes of his defeat 
for the presidency. 

Senator Henry Wilson, of Massachusetts, afterwards 
vice-president, was in great demand. He was clear in 
his historical statements and emphatic in his expression 
of views. If he had any apprehension of humor he never 



ORATORS AND CAMPAIGN SPEAKERS 333 

showed it in his speeches. His career had been very 
picturesque — from unskilled laborer to the Senate and 
the vice-presidency. The impression he gave was of 
an example of American opportunity, and he was more 
impressive and influential by his personality and history 
than by what he said. 

One of the most picturesque and popular stump 
speakers was Daniel S. Dickinson. He had been a 
United States senator and party leader, and was a 
national figure. His venerable appearance gave force to 
his oratory. He seemed to be of great age, but was 
remarkably vigorous. His speeches were made up of 
epigrams which were quotable and effective. He jumped 
rapidly from argument to anecdote and was vitriolic in 
attack. 

I had an interesting experience with Mr. Dickinson 
when running for secretary of state in 1863. The draw- 
ing card for that year, and the most sought-after and 
popular for campaign speaking, was Governor Andrews, 
of Massachusetts. He had a series of appointments in 
New York State, but on account of some emergency can- 
celled them all. The national and State committees 
selected me to fill his appointments. The most unsat- 
isfactory and disagreeable job in the world is to meet 
the appointments of a popular speaker. The expecta- 
tions of the audience have been aroused to a degree by 
propaganda advertising the genius and accomplishments 
of the expected speaker. The substitute cannot meet 
those expectations, and an angry crowd holds him re- 
sponsible for their disappointment. 

When I left the train at the station I was in the midst 
of a mass-meeting of several counties at Deposit, N. Y. 
A large committee, profusely decorated with campaign 



334 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

badges, were on the platform to welcome the distin- 
guished war governor of Massachusetts. I did not meet 
physically their expectations of an impressive statesman 
of dignified presence, wearing a Prince Albert suit and a 
top hat. I had been long campaigning, my soft hat was 
disreputable, and I had added a large shawl to my cam- 
paigning equipment. Besides that, I was only twenty- 
eight and looked much younger. The committee ex- 
pected at least sixty. Finally the chairman rushed up 
to me and said: "You were on the train. Did you see 
Governor Andrews, of Massachusetts?" I answered 
him: "Governor Andrews is not coming; he has cancelled 
all his engagements, and I have been sent to take his 
place." The chairman gasped and then exclaimed: "My 
God !" He very excitedly summoned his fellow mem- 
bers of the committee and said to them: "Gentlemen, 
Governor Andrews is not coming, but the State commit- 
tee has sent this" pointing to me. I was the party can- 
didate as secretary of state, and at the head of the ticket, 
but nobody asked me who I was, nor did I tell them. I 
was left severely alone. 

Some time after, the chairman of the committee came 
to me and said: "Young fellow, we won't be hard on 
you, but the State committee has done this once before. 
We were promised a very popular speaker well known 
among us, but in his place they sent the damnedest fool 
who ever stood before an audience. However, we have 
sent to Binghamton for Daniel S. Dickinson, and he will 
be here in a short time and save our big mass-meeting." 

Mr. Dickinson came and delivered a typical speech; 
every sentence was a bombshell and its explosion very 
effective. He had the privilege of age, and told a story 
which I would not have dared to tell, the audience being 



ORATORS AND CAMPAIGN SPEAKERS 335 

half women. He said: "Those constitutional lawyers, 
who are proclaiming that all Mr. Lincoln's acts are un- 
constitutional, don't know any law. They remind me 
of a doctor we have up in Binghamton, who has a large 
practice because of his fine appearance, his big words, 
and gold-headed cane. He was called to see a young lad 
who was sitting on his grandmother's lap. After looking 
at the boy's tongue and feeling his pulse, he rested his 
head in deep thought for a while on his gold-headed cane 
and then said: 'Madam, this boy has such difficulties 
with the epiglottis and such inflamed larynx that we will 
have to apply phlebotomy.' The old lady clasped the 
boy frantically to her bosom and cried: 'For heaven's 
sake, doctor, what on earth can ail the boy that you are 
going to put all that on his bottom?' " 

Mr. Dickinson introduced me as the head of the State 
ticket. My speech proved a success, and the chairman 
paid me the handsome compliment of saying: "We are 
glad they sent you instead of Governor Andrews." 

One of the most effective of our campaign speakers 
was General Bruce, of Syracuse, N. Y. The general had 
practically only one speech, which was full of picturesque 
illustrations, striking anecdotes, and highly wrought-up 
periods of patriotic exaltation. He delivered this speech, 
with necessary variations, through many campaigns. I 
was with the general, who was Canal commissioner when 
I was secretary of state, on our official tour on the Canal. 

One night the general said to me: "Mr. Blank, who 
has a great reputation, is speaking in a neighboring town, 
and I am going to hear him." He came back enraged 
and unhappy. In telling me about it, he said: "That 
infernal thief delivered my speech word for word, and 
better than I can do it myself. I am too old to get up 



336 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

another one, and, as I love to speak, I am very un- 
happy." 

This illustrated one of the accidents to which a cam- 
paign speaker is liable. The man who stole the general's 
speech afterwards played the same trick on me. He 
came into our State from New England with a great 
reputation. He was a very fine elocutionist, of excellent 
presence and manner, but utterly incapable of original 
thought. He could not prepare a speech of any kind. 
However, he had a phenomenal memory. He could lis- 
ten to a speech made by another and repeat it perfectly. 
His attractive appearance, good voice, and fine elocution 
made the speech a great success. Several orators told me 
that when they found their efforts a failure they asked 
for the cause, and discovered that this man had delivered 
their speeches a few nights before, and the audience, of 
course, thought the last speaker was a fraud and a thief. 

General Bruce told me a good campaign story of 
Senator James W. Nye, of Nevada. Nye was a promi- 
nent lawyer of western New York, and the most eloquent 
and witty member of the bar of that section, and also 
the most popular campaign speaker. He moved to 
Nevada and so impressed the people of that young State 
that he was elected United States senator. In the Sen- 
ate he became a notable figure. 

Nye and General Bruce were sent by the national 
committee to canvass New England. Nye had become 
senatorial in his oratory, with much more dignity and 
elevation of style than before. He began his first speech 
at Bridgeport, Conn., in this way: "Fellow citizens, I 
have come three thousand miles from my mountain 
home, three thousand feet above the level of the sea, to 
discuss with you these vital questions for the safety of 



ORATORS AND CAMPAIGN SPEAKERS 337 

our republic." The next night, at New Haven, he said: 
"I have come from my mountain home, five thousand 
feet above the level of the sea, to discuss with you these 
vital questions of the safety of our republic." Bruce 
interrupted him, saying: "Why, senator, it was only 
three thousand feet last night." Nye turned savagely 
on Bruce: "Bruce, you go to the devil!" Resuming 
with the audience, he remarked very impressively: "As 
I was saying, fellow citizens, I have come from my 
mountain home, ten thousand feet above the level of 
the sea, to, etc." 

A story which illustrates and enforces the argument 
helps a political speech, and it is often the only part of 
the speech which is remembered. I have often heard 
people say to me: "I heard you speak thirty, forty, or 
fifty years ago, and this is the story you told." Some- 
times, however, the story may prove a boomerang in the 
most unexpected way. 

For many years, when I spoke in northern New York 
I was always met at the Syracuse station by a superin- 
tendent of the Lackawanna Railroad with a special train 
filled with friends. He carried me up to my destination 
and brought me back in the morning. It was his great 
day of the year, and during the trip he was full of rem- 
iniscences, and mainly of the confidences reposed in him 
by the president of the road, my old and valued friend, 
Samuel Sloan. 

One fall he failed to appear, and there was no special 
train to meet me. I was told by friends that the reason 
was his wife had died and he was in mourning. The 
morning after the meeting I started to call upon him, 
but was informed that he was very hostile and would not 
see me. I was not going to lose an old friend like that 



338 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

and went up to his office. As soon as I entered, he said : 
"Go away, I don't want to see you again." I appealed 
to him, saying: "I cannot lose so good a friend as you. 
If there is anything I have done or said, I will do every- 
thing in my power to make it right." He turned on me 
sharply and with great emotion told this story: "My 
wife and I lived in loving harmony for over thirty years, 
and when she died recently I was heartbroken. The 
whole town was sympathetic; most of the business houses 
closed during the hour of the funeral. I had arranged to 
have ministers whom my wife admired, and with them 
selected passages of scriptures and hymns to which she 
was devoted. A new minister in town was invited by 
the others to participate, and without my knowledge. 
I looked over the congregation, all Mary's friends. I 
listened to the services, which Mary herself would have 
chosen, and said to Mary's spirit, which I knew to be 
hovering about: 'We are all paying you a loving tribute.' 
Then the new minister had for his part the announce- 
ment and reading of a hymn. At the last Republican 
convention at Saratoga, in order to illustrate the condi- 
tion of the Democratic party, you told a story about a 
boy walking among the children's graves in the old ceme- 
tery at Peekskill, eating green apples and whistling 
'Nearer, my God, to Thee.' The new minister gave that 
hymn, 'Nearer, my God, to Thee.' Your story came up 
in my mind, and I burst out laughing. I disgraced my- 
self, insulted the memory of Mary, and I never want to 
see you again." 



XXI 
NATIONAL REPUBLICAN CONVENTIONS 

When the Republican convention met in 191 2 I was 
again a delegate. In my fifty-six years of national con- 
ventions I never had such an intensely disagreeable ex- 
perience. I felt it my duty to support President Taft 
for renomination. I thought he had earned it by his 
excellent administration. I had many ties with him, be- 
ginning with our associations as graduates of Yale, and 
held for him a most cordial regard. I was swayed by 
my old and unabated love for Roosevelt. In that com- 
promise and harmony were impossible. I saw that, with 
the control of the organization and of the convention on 
the side of Mr. Taft, and with the wild support for 
Roosevelt of the delegates from the States which could 
be relied upon to give Republican majorities, the nom- 
ination of either would be sure defeat. 

I was again a delegate to the Republican convention 
of 19 16. The party was united. Progressives and con- 
servatives were acting together, and the convention was 
in the happiest of moods. It was generally understood 
that Justice Hughes would be nominated if he could be 
induced to resign from the Supreme Court and accept. 
The presiding officer of the convention was Senator 
Warren G. Harding. He made a very acceptable key- 
note speech. His fine appearance, his fairness, justice, 
and good temper as presiding officer captured the con- 
vention. There was a universal sentiment that if 
Hughes declined the party could do no better than to 

339 



340 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

nominate Senator Harding. It was this impression 
among the delegates, many of whom were also members 
of the convention of 1920, which led to the selection as 
the convention's candidate for president of Warren G. 
Harding. 

My good mother was a Presbyterian and a good Cal- 
vinist. She believed and impressed upon me the cer- 
tainty of special Providence. It is hard for a Republican 
to think that the election of Woodrow Wilson was a 
special Providence, but if our candidate, Mr. Hughes, 
had been elected he would have had a hostile Demo- 
cratic majority in Congress. 

When the United States went into the war, as it must 
have done, the president would have been handicapped 
by this pacifist Congress. The draft would have been 
refused, without which our army of four millions could 
not have been raised. The autocratic measures neces- 
sary for the conduct of the war would have been denied. 
With the conflict between the executive and Congress, 
our position would have been impossible and indefensible. 

I had a personal experience in the convention. Chair- 
man Harding sent one of the secretaries to me with a 
message that there was an interval of about an hour 
when the convention would have nothing to do. It was 
during such a period the crank had his opportunity 
and the situation was dangerous, and he wished me to 
come to the platform and fill as much of that hour as 
possible. I refused on the ground that I was wholly 
unprepared, and it would be madness to attempt to 
speak to fourteen thousand people in the hall and a 
hundred million outside. 

A few minutes afterwards Governor Whitman, chair- 
man of the New York delegation, came to me and said: 



NATIONAL REPUBLICAN CONVENTIONS 341 

"You must be drafted. The chairman will create some 
business to give you fifteen minutes to think up your 
speech." I spurred my gray matter as never before, 
and was then introduced and spoke for forty-five min- 
utes. I was past eighty-two. The speech was a suc- 
cess, but when I returned to my seat I remembered what 
General Garfield had so earnestly said to me: "You are 
the only man of national reputation who will speak with- 
out preparation. Unless you peremptorily and deci- 
sively stop yielding you will some day make such a 
failure as to destroy the reputation of a lifetime." 

In a letter President Harding has this to say in refer- 
ence to the occasion: "Just about a year ago (19 16) it 
was my privilege as chairman of the Republican con- 
vention at Chicago to call upon you for an address. 
There was a hiatus which called for a speech, and you 
so wonderfully met the difficult requirements that I sat 
in fascinated admiration and have been ready ever since 
to pay you unstinted tribute. You were ever eloquent 
in your more active years, but I count you the old man 
eloquent and incomparable in your eighties. May many 
more helpful and happy years be yours." 

I was again a delegate to the convention in June, 1920. 
The Republicans had been for eight years out of office 
during Mr. Wilson's two terms. The delegates were ex- 
ceedingly anxious to make no mistake and have no fric- 
tion in the campaign. 

The two leading candidates, General Wood and Gov- 
ernor Lowden, had nearly equal strength and were sup- 
ported by most enthusiastic admirers and advocates. 
As the balloting continued the rivalry and feeling grew 
between their friends. It became necessary to har- 
monize the situation, and it was generally believed that 



342 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

this could be best done by selecting Senator Warren G. 
Harding. 

Very few conventions have a dramatic surprise, but 
the nomination of Governor Coolidge, of Massachusetts, 
for vice-president came about in a very picturesque way. 
He had been named for president among the others, and 
the speech in his behalf by Speaker Frederick H. Gillett 
was an excellent one. Somehow the convention did not 
seem to grasp all that the governor stood for and how 
strong he was with each delegate. When the nomina- 
tions for vice-president were called for, Senator Medill 
McCormick presented Senator Lenroot, of Wisconsin, in 
an excellent speech. There were also very good ad- 
dresses on behalf of the Governor of Kansas and others. 

When the balloting was about to start, a delegate 
from Oregon who was in the rear of the hall arose and 
said: "Mr. Chairman." The chairman said: "The gen- 
tleman from Oregon." The Oregon delegate, in a far- 
reaching voice, shouted: "Mr. Chairman, I nominate for 
vice-president Calvin Coolidge, a one-hundred-per-cent 
American." The convention went off its feet with a 
whoop and Coolidge was nominated hands down. 

I again had a personal experience. The committee on 
resolutions, not being prepared to report, there was that 
interval of no business which is the despair of presiding 
officers of conventions. The crowd suddenly began 
calling for me. While, of course, I had thought much 
on the subject, I had not expected to be called upon and 
had no prepared speech. Happily, fifteen thousand 
faces and fifteen thousand voices giving uproarious wel- 
come both steadied and inspired me. Though I was 
past eighty-six years of age, my voice was in as good 
condition as at forty, and was practically the only one 



NATIONAL REPUBLICAN CONVENTIONS 343 

which did fill that vast auditorium. The press of the 
country featured the effort next day in a way which was 
most gratifying. 

Among the thousands who greeted me on the streets 
and in the hotel lobbies with congratulations and efforts 
to say something agreeable and complimentary, I selected 
one compliment as unique. He was an enthusiast. 
"Chauncey Depew," he said, "I have for over twenty 
years wanted to shake hands with you. Your speech 
was a wonder. I was half a mile off, way up under the 
roof, and heard every word of it, and it was the only 
one I was able to hear. That you should do this in 
your eighty-seventh year is a miracle. But then my 
father was a miracle. On his eighty-fifth birthday he 
was in just as good shape as you are to-day, and a week 
afterwards he was dead.'* 



XXII 

JOURNALISTS AND FINANCIERS 

In reminiscences of my journalistic friends I do not 
include many of the most valued who are still living. 
Of those who have passed away one of the most faithful 
and devoted was Edward H. Butler, editor and pro- 
prietor of the Buffalo Evening News. 

Mr. Butler began at the bottom as a newspaper man, 
and very early and rapidly climbed to the top. He 
secured control of the Evening News and soon made it 
one of the most, if not the most, widely circulated, influ- 
ential, and prosperous papers of western New York. 
Personally and through his paper he was for many years 
my devoted friend. To those he loved he had an un- 
bounded fidelity and generosity. He possessed keen in- 
sight and kept thoroughly abreast of public affairs, and 
was a journalist of high order. 

It was my privilege to know Charles A. Dana very 
well. I first met him when he was on the New York 
Tribune and closely allied with Horace Greeley. He 
made the New York Sun one of the brightest, most origi- 
nal, and most quoted newspapers in the United States. 
His high culture, wonderful command of English, and 
refined taste gave to the Sun a high literary position, 
and at the same time his audacity and criticism made 
him a terror to those with whom he differed, and his 
editorials the delight of a reader. 

Personally Mr. Dana was one of the most attractive 
and charming of men. As assistant secretary of war 

344 



JOURNALISTS AND FINANCIERS 345 

during Lincoln's administration he came in intimate 
contact with all the public men of that period, and as a 
journalist his study was invaded and he received most 
graciously men and women famous in every department 
of intellectual activity. His reminiscences were wonder- 
ful and his characterizations remarkable. He might 
have published an autobiography of rare value and 
interest. 

When the elder James Gordon Bennett died the news- 
paper world recognized the loss of one of the most re- 
markable and successful of journalists and publishers. 
His son had won reputation in the field of sport, but his 
contemporaries doubted his ability to maintain, much 
less increase, the sphere of the New York Herald. But 
young Bennett soon displayed rare originality and enter- 
prise. He made his newspaper one of national and 
international importance. By bringing out an edition in 
Paris he conferred a boon upon Americans abroad. For 
many years there was little news from the United States 
in foreign newspapers, but Americans crazy for news 
from home found it in the Paris edition of the New York 
Herald. 

Mr. Bennett was a good friend of mine for half a cen- 
tury. He was delightful company, with his grasp of 
world affairs and picturesque presentation of them. A 
President of the United States who wished to change the 
hostile attitude of the Herald towards his administration 
and himself asked me to interview Mr. Bennett. The 
editor was courteous, frank, but implacable. But some 
time afterwards the Herald became a cordial supporter 
of the president. The interview and its subsequent 
' result displayed a characteristic of Bennett. He would 
not recognize that his judgment or action could be influ- 



346 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

enced, but his mind was so open and fair that when con- 
vinced that he was wrong he would in his own way and 
at his own time do the right thing. 

Mr. Bennett did me once an essential service. It was 
at the time when I was a candidate for re-election to the 
United States Senate. I cabled him in Paris and asked 
that he would look into the situation through his confi- 
dential friends, reporters, and employees, and if he found 
the situation warranted his taking a position to do so. 
Of course the Herald was an independent and not a party 
journal and rarely took sides. But not long afterwards, 
editorially and reportorially, the emphatic endorsement 
of the Herald came, and positive prediction of success, 
and were of great help. He was one of my groomsmen 
at my wedding in 1901. 

Among the thousands of stories which appear and dis- 
appear like butterflies, it is a curious question what 
vogue and circulation one can have over others. By an 
accident I broke one of the tendons of my heel and was 
laid up in my house for some time, unable to walk. The 
surgeon fixed the bandage in place by a liquid cement, 
which soon solidified like glass. 

Julian Ralph, a brilliant young newspaper reporter, 
wrote a long story in the New York Sun about a wonder- 
ful glass leg, which had been substituted for the natural 
one and did better work. The story had universal pub- 
lication not only in the United States but abroad, and 
interested scientists and surgeons. My mail grew to 
enormous proportions with letters from eager inquirers 
wanting to know all the particulars. The multitude of 
unfortunates who had lost their legs or were dissatisfied 
with artificial ones wrote to me to find out where these 
wonderful glass legs could be obtained. 



JOURNALISTS AND FINANCIERS 347 

The glass-leg story nearly killed me, but it gave Ralph 
such a reputation that he was advanced to positions both 
at home and abroad, where his literary genius and imagi- 
nation won him many honors, but he never repeated his 
success with my glass leg. 

I suppose, having been more than half a century in 
close contact with matters of interest to the public, or 
officially in positions where I was a party to corporate 
activities or movements which might affect the market, I 
have been more interviewed than any one living and seen 
more reporters. No reporter has ever abused the con- 
fidence I reposed in him. He always appreciated what 
I told him, even to the verge of indiscretion, and knew 
what was proper for him to reveal and what was not for 
publication. In the critical situations which often oc- 
curred in railway controversies, this cordial relationship 
with reporters was of great value in getting our side 
before the public. 

One reporter especially, a space writer, managed for 
a long time to get from me one-half to a column nearly 
every day, sometimes appearing as interviews and at 
other times under the general phrase: "It has been 
learned from a reliable source." 

I recall a personal incident out of the ordinary. I was 
awakened one stormy winter night by a reporter who 
was well known to me, a young man of unusual promise. 
I met him in dressing gown and slippers in my library. 
There he told me that his wife was ill, and to save her 
life the doctor informed him that he must send her West 
to a sanitarium. 

"I have no money," he continued, "and will not bor- 
row nor beg, but you must give me a story I can sell." 

We discussed various matters which a paper would 



34 8 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

like to have, and finally I gave him a veiled but still in- 
telligible story, which we both knew the papers were 
anxious to get. He told me afterwards that he sold the 
interview for enough to meet his present needs and his 
wife's journey. Some time after he entered Wall Street 
and made a success. 

I have known well nearly all the phenomenally suc- 
cessful business men of my time. It is a popular idea 
that luck or chance had much to do with their careers. 
This is a mistake. All of them had vision not possessed 
by their fellows. They could see opportunities where 
others took the opposite view, and they had the courage 
of their convictions. They had standards of their own 
which they lived up to, and these standards differed 
widely from the ethical ideas of the majority. 

Russell Sage, who died in the eighties, had to his 
credit an estate which amounted to a million dollars for 
every year of his life. He was not always a money- 
maker, but he was educated in the art as a banker, was 
diverted into politics, elected to Congress, and became 
a very useful member of that body. When politics 
changed and he was defeated, he came to New York 
and speedily found his place among the survival of the 
fittest. Mr. Sage could see before others when bad 
times would be followed by better ones and securities 
rise in value, and he also saw before others when dis- 
asters would follow prosperity. Relying upon his own 
judgment, he became a winner, whether the market 
went up or down. 

I met Mr. Sage frequently and enjoyed his quick and 
keen appreciation of men and things. Of course, I knew 
that he cultivated me because he thought that from my 



JOURNALISTS AND FINANCIERS 349 

official position he might possibly gain information which 
he could use in the market. I never received any points 
from him, or acted upon any of his suggestions. I think 
the reason why I am in excellent health and vigor in my 
eighty-eighth year is largely due to the fact that the 
points or suggestions of great financiers never interested 
me. I have known thousands who were ruined by them. 
The financier who gives advice may mean well as to the 
securities which he confidentially tells about, but an un- 
expected financial storm may make all prophecies worth- 
less, except for those who have capital to tide it over. 

One of the most certain opportunities for fortune was 
to buy Erie after Commodore Vanderbilt had secured 
every share and the shorts were selling wildly what they 
did not have and could not get. An issue of fraudulent 
and unauthorized stock suddenly flooded the market 
and thousands were ruined. 

As Mr. Sage's wealth increased, the generous and 
public-spirited impulses which were his underlying char- 
. acteristics, became entirely obscured by the craze for 
accumulation. His wife, to whom he was devotedly 
attached, was, fortunately for him, one of the most gen- 
erous, philanthropic, and open-minded of women. She 
was most loyal to the Emma Willard School at Troy, 
N. Y., from which she graduated. Mrs. Sage wrote 
me a note at one time, saying: "Mr. Sage has promised 
to build and give to the Willard School a building which 
will cost one hundred and fifty thousand dollars, and he 
wants you to deliver the address at the laying of the 
corner-stone. ,, I wrote back that I was so overwhelmed 
with business that it was impossible for me to accept. 
She replied: "Russell vows he will not give a dollar un- 
less you promise to deliver the address. This is the first 



350 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

effort in his life at liberal giving. Don't you think he 
ought to be encouraged?" I immediately accepted. 

Mrs. Sage was a Mayflower descendant. At one of 
the anniversaries of the society she invited me to be her 
guest and to make a speech. She had quite a large com- 
pany at her table. When the champagne corks began 
to explode all around us, she asked what I thought she 
ought to do. I answered: "As the rest are doing." 
Mr. Sage vigorously protested that it was a useless and 
wasteful expense. However, Mrs. Sage gave the order, 
and Mr. Sage and two objecting gentlemen at the table 
were the most liberal participants of her hospitality. 
The inspiration of the phizz brought Sage to his feet, 
though not on the programme. He talked until the 
committee of arrangements succeeded in persuading him 
that the company was entirely satisfied. 

Jay Gould told me a story of Sage. The market had 
gone against him and left him under great obligations. 
The shock sent Sage to bed, and he declared that he was 
ruined. Mr. Gould and Mr. Cyrus W. Field became 
alarmed for his life and went to see him. They found 
him broken-hearted and in a serious condition. Gould 
said to him: "Sage, I will assume all your obligations 
and give you so many millions of dollars if you will 
transfer to me the cash you have in banks, trust, and 
safe-deposit companies, and you keep all your securities 
and all your real estate." The proposition proved to be 
the shock necessary to counteract Sage's panic and save 
his life. He shouted, "I won't do it!" jumped out of 
bed, met all his obligations, and turned defeat into a 
victory. 

Sage could not personally give away his fortune, so he 
left it all, without reservations, to his wife. The world 



JOURNALISTS AND FINANCIERS 351 

is better and happier by her wise distribution of his 
accumulations. 

One of Mr. Sage's lawyers was an intimate friend of 
mine, and he told me this story. Sage had been per- 
suaded by his fellow directors in the Western Union 
Telegraph Company to make a will. As he was attor- 
ney for the company, Sage came to him to draw it. 

The lawyer began to write: "I, Russell Sage, of the 
City of New York, being of sound mind" . . . (Sage 
interrupted him in his quick way by saying, "Nobody will 
dispute that") "do publish and devise this to be my 
last will and testament as follows: First, I direct that all 
my just debts will be paid." . . . ("That's easy," said 
Sage, "because I haven't any.") "Also my funeral ex- 
penses and testamentary expenses." ("Make the funeral 
simple. I dislike display and ostentation, and especially 
at funerals," said Sage.) "Next," said the lawyer, "I 
give, devise, and bequeath' 1 . . . (Sage shouted: "I 
won't do it ! I won't do it !" and left the office.) 

Nothing is so absorbing as the life of Wall Street. It 
is more abused, misunderstood, and envied than any 
place in the country. Wall Street means that the sharp- 
est wits from every State in the Union, and many from 
South America and Europe, are competing with each 
other for the great prizes of development, exploitation, 
and speculation. 

I remember a Wall Street man who was of wide read- 
ing and high culture, and yet devoted to both the opera- 
tion and romance of the Street. He rushed into my 
room one night at Lucerne in Switzerland and said: "I 
have just arrived from Greece and have been out of 
touch with everything for six weeks. I am starving for 
news of the market." 



352 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

I enlightened him as well as I could, and then he 
remarked: "Do you know, while in Athens our little 
party stood on the Acropolis admiring the Parthenon, 
and one enthusiastic Grecian exclaimed: * There is the 
wonder of the world. For three thousand years its per- 
fection has baffled and taught the genius of every gen- 
eration. It can be copied, but never yet has been 
equalled. Surely, notwithstanding your love of New 
York and devotion to the ticker, you must admire the 
Parthenon/ I answered him, if I could be transported 
at this minute to Fifth Avenue and Broadway and could 
look up at the Flatiron Building, I would give the money 
to rebuild that old ruin." 

While conditions in the United States because of the 
World War are serious, they are so much better than in 
the years following the close of the Civil War, that we 
who have had the double experience can be greatly en- 
couraged. Then one-half of our country was devastated, 
its industries destroyed or paralyzed; now we are united 
and stronger in every way. Then we had a paper cur- 
rency and dangerous inflation, now we are on a gold 
standard and with an excellent banking and credit sys- 
tem. The development of our resources and wonderful 
inventions and discoveries since the Civil War place us 
in the foremost position to enter upon world commerce 
when all other nations have come as they must to co- 
operation and co-ordination upon lines for the preserva- 
tion of peace and the promotion of international pros- 
perity. 

Many incidents personal to me occur which illustrate 
conditions following the close of the war between the 
States. I knew very rich men who became paupers, 
and strong institutions and corporations which went into 



JOURNALISTS AND FINANCIERS 353 

bankruptcy. I was in the Union Trust Company of New 
York when our financial circles were stunned by the 
closing of its doors following the closing of the New 
York Stock Exchange. 

One of my clients was Mr. Augustus Schell, one of the 
ablest and most successful of financiers and public-spirited 
citizens. The panic had ruined him. As we left the 
Union Trust Company he had his hat over his eyes, and 
his head was buried in the upturned collar of his coat. 
When opposite Trinity Church he said: "Mr. Depew, 
after being a rich man for over forty years, it is hard to 
walk under a poor man's hat." When we reached the 
Astor House a complete reaction had occurred. His 
collar was turned down, his head came out confident 
and aggressive, his hat had shifted to the back of his head 
and on a rakish angle. The hopeful citizen fairly shouted : 
"Mr. Depew, the world has always gone around, it al- 
ways will go around." He managed with the aid of 
Commodore Vanderbilt to save his assets from sacrifice. 
In a few years they recovered normal value, and Mr. 
Schell with his fortune intact found "the world had gone 
around" and he was on top again. 

I have often felt the inspiration of Mr. SchelPs confi- 
dence and hope and have frequently lifted others out of 
the depths of despair by narrating the story and empha- 
sizing the motto "The world always has gone around, 
the world always will go around." 

Illustrating the wild speculative spirit of one financial 
period, and the eagerness with which speculators grasped 
at what they thought points, the following is one of my 
many experiences. 

Running down Wall Street one day because I was late 
for an important meeting, a well-known speculator 



354 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

stopped me and shouted: "What about Erie?" I threw 
him off impatiently, saying, "Damn Erie!" and rushed 
on. I knew nothing about Erie speculatively and was 
irritated at being still further delayed for my meeting. 

Sometime afterwards I received a note from him in 
which he said : " I never can be grateful enough for the 
point you gave me on Erie. I made on it the biggest 
kill of my life." 

I have often had quoted to me that sentence about 
"fortune comes to one but once, and if rejected never 
returns." When I declined President Harrison's offer of 
the position of secretary of state in his Cabinet, I had 
on my desk a large number of telegrams signed by distin- 
guished names and having only that quotation. There 
are many instances in the lives of successful men where 
they have repeatedly declined Dame Fortune's gift, and 
yet she has finally rewarded them according to their de- 
sires. I am inclined to think that the fickle lady is not 
always mortally offended by a refusal. I believe that 
there come in the life of almost everybody several op- 
portunities, and few have the judgment to wisely decide 
what to decline and what to accept. 

In 1876 Gardner Hubbard was an officer in the United 
States railway mail service. As this connection with 
the government was one of my duties in the New York 
Central, we met frequently. One day he said to me: 
"My son-in-law, Professor Bell, has made what I think a 
wonderful invention. It is a talking telegraph. We 
need ten thousand dollars, and I will give you one-sixth 
interest for that amount of money." 

I was very much impressed with Mr. Hubbard's de- 
scription of the possibilities of Professor Bell's invention. 
Before accepting, however, I called upon my friend, Mr. 



JOURNALISTS AND FINANCIERS 355 

William Orton, president of the Western Union Telegraph 
Company. Orton had the reputation of being the best- 
informed and most accomplished electrical expert in the 
country. He said to me: "There is nothing in this 
patent whatever, nor is there anything in the scheme 
itself, except as a toy. If the device has any value, the 
Western Union owns a prior patent called the Gray's 
patent, which makes the Bell device worthless." 

When I returned to Mr. Hubbard he again convinced 
me, and I would have made the investment, except that 
Mr. Orton called at my house that night and said to me: 
"I know you cannot afford to lose ten thousand dollars, 
which you certainly will if you put it in the Bell patent. 
I have been so worried about it that contrary to my 
usual custom I have come, if possible, to make you 
promise to drop it." This I did. 

The Bell patent was sustained in the courts against 
the Gray, and the telephone system became immediately 
popular and profitable. It spread rapidly all over the 
country, and innumerable local companies were organ- 
ized, and with large interests for the privilege to the 
parent company. 

I rarely ever part with anything, and I may say that 
principle has brought me so many losses and so many 
gains that I am as yet, in my eighty-eighth year, un- 
decided whether it is a good rule or not. However, if I 
had accepted my friend Mr. Hubbard's offer, it would 
have changed my whole course of life. With the divi- 
dends, year after year, and the increasing capital, I would 
have netted by to-day at least one hundred million dol- 
lars. I have no regrets. I know my make-up, with its 
love for the social side of life and its good things, and for 
good times with good fellows. I also know the necessity 



356 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

of activity and work. I am quite sure that with this 
necessity removed and ambition smothered, I should 
long ago have been in my grave and lost many years of a 
life which has been full of happiness and satisfaction. 

My great weakness has been indorsing notes. A 
friend comes and appeals to you. If you are of a sym- 
pathetic nature and very fond of him, if you have no 
money to loan him, it is so easy to put your name on 
the back of a note. Of course, it is rarely paid at ma- 
turity, because your friend's judgment was wrong, and 
so the note is renewed and the amount increased. When 
finally you wake up to the fact that if you do not stop 
you are certain to be ruined, your friend fails when the 
notes mature, and you have lost the results of many 
years of thrift and saving, and also your friend. 

I declined to marry until I had fifty thousand dollars. 
The happy day arrived, and I felt the fortunes of my 
family secure. My father-in-law and his son became 
embarrassed in their business, and, naturally, I indorsed 
their notes. A few years afterwards my father-in-law 
died, his business went bankrupt, I lost my fifty thou- 
sand dollars and found myself considerably in debt. As 
an illustration of my dear mother's belief that all mis- 
fortunes are sent for one's good, it so happened that the 
necessity of meeting and recovering from this disaster 
led to extraordinary exertions, which probably, except 
under the necessity, I never would have made. The 
efforts were successful. 

Horace Greeley never could resist an appeal to indorse 
a note. They were hardly ever paid, and Mr. Greeley 
was the loser. I met him one time, soon after he had 
been a very severe sufferer from his mistaken kindness. 
He said to me with great emphasis: "Chauncey, I want 



JOURNALISTS AND FINANCIERS 357 

you to do me a great favor. I want you to have a bill 
put through the legislature, and see that it becomes a 
law, making it a felony and punishable with imprison- 
ment for life for any man to put his name by way of 
indorsement on the back of another man's paper." 

Dear old Greeley kept the practice up until he died, 
and the law was never passed. There was one instance, 
which I had something to do with, where the father of 
a young man, through whom Mr. Greeley lost a great 
deal of money by indorsing notes, arranged after Mr. 
Greeley's death to have the full amount of the loss paid 
to Mr. Greeley's heirs. 



XXIII 
ACTORS AND MEN OF LETTERS 

One cannot speak of Sir Henry Irving without recall- 
ing the wonderful charm and genius of his leading lady, 
Ellen Terry. She never failed to be worthy of sharing 
in Irving's triumphs. Her remarkable adaptability to 
the different characters and grasp of their characteristics 
made her one of the best exemplifiers of Shakespeare of 
her time. She was equally good in the great characters 
of other playwrights. Her effectiveness was increased 
by an unusual ability to shed tears and natural tears. I 
was invited behind the scenes one evening when she had 
produced a great impression upon the audience in a very 
pathetic part. I asked her how she did what no one 
else was ever able to do. 

"Why," she answered, "it is so simple when you are 

portraying " (mentioning the character), "and such 

a crisis arises in your life, that naturally and immediately 
the tears begin to flow." So they did when she was il- 
lustrating the part for me. 

It was a privilege to hear Edwin Booth as Richelieu 
and Hamlet. I have witnessed all the great actors of my 
time in those characters. None of them equalled Edwin 
Booth. For a number of years he was exiled from the 
stage because his brother, Wilkes Booth, was the assas- 
sin of President Lincoln. His admirers in New York felt 
that it was a misfortune for dramatic art that so con- 
summate an artist should be compelled to remain in pri- 
vate life. In order to break the spell they united and in- 

358 



ACTORS AND MEN OF LETTERS 359 

vited Mr. Booth to give a performance at one of the 
larger theatres. The house, of course, was carefully 
ticketed with selected guests. 

The older Mrs. John Jacob Astor, a most accomplished 
and cultured lady and one of the acknowledged leaders 
of New York society, gave Mr. Booth a dinner in honor 
of the event. The gathering represented the most emi- 
nent talent of New York in every department of the 
great city's activities. Of course, Mr. Booth had the 
seat of honor at the right of the hostess. On the left 
was a distinguished man who had been a Cabinet min- 
ister and a diplomat. During the dinner Mr. Evarts 
said to me: "I have known so and so all our active lives. 
He has been a great success in everything he has under- 
taken, and the wonder of it is that if there was ever an 
opportunity for him to say or do the wrong thing he 
never failed." 

Curiously enough, the conversation at the dinner ran 
upon men outliving their usefulness and reputations. 
Several instances were cited where a man from the height 
of his fame gradually lived on and lived out his reputa- 
tion. Whereupon our diplomat, with his fatal facility 
for saying the wrong thing, broke in by remarking in a 
strident voice: "The most remarkable instance of a man 
dying at the right time for his reputation was Abraham 
Lincoln." Then he went on to explain how he would 
have probably lost his place in history through the mis- 
takes of his second term. Nobody heard anything be- 
yond the words "Abraham Lincoln." Fortunately for 
the evening and the great embarrassment of Mr. Booth, 
the tact of Mrs. Astor changed the subject and saved 
the occasion. 

Of all my actor friends none was more delightful either 



360 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

on the stage or in private life than Joseph Jefferson. He 
early appealed to me because of his Rip Van Winkle. I 
was always devoted to Washington Irving and to the 
Hudson River. All the traditions which have given a 
romantic touch to different points on that river came 
from Irving' s pen. In the days of my youth the influ- 
ence of Irving upon those who were fortunate enough to 
have been born upon the banks of the Hudson was very 
great in every way. 

As I met Jefferson quite frequently, I recall two of his 
many charming stories. He said he thought at one time 
that it would be a fine idea to play Rip Van Winkle at 
the village of Catskill, around which place was located 
the story of his hero. His manager selected the super- 
numeraries from among the farmer boys of the neighbor- 
hood. At the point of the play where Rip wakes up and 
finds the lively ghosts of the Hendrick Hudson crew play- 
ing bowls in the mountains, he says to each one of them, 
who all look and are dressed alike: "Are you his brother?" 

"No," answered the young farmer who impersonated 
one of the ghosts, "Mr. Jefferson, I never saw one of 
these people before." As ghosts are supposed to be 
silent, this interruption nearly broke up the performance. 

During the Spanish-American War I came on the same 
train with Mr. Jefferson from Washington. The interest 
all over the country at that time was the remarkable vic- 
tory of Admiral Dewey over the Spanish fleet in the har- 
bor of Manila. People wondered how Dewey could sink 
every Spanish ship and never be hit once himself. Jef- 
ferson said in his quaint way : " Everybody, including 
the secretary of the navy and several admirals, asked me 
how that could have happened. I told them the prob- 
lem might be one which naval officers could not solve, 



ACTORS AND MEN OF LETTERS 361 

but it was very simple for an actor. The failure of the 
. Spanish admiral was entirely due to his not having 
rehearsed. Success is impossible without frequent re- 
hearsals." 

Returning for a moment to Washington Irving, one of 
the most interesting spots near New York is his old 
home, Wolfert's Roost, and also the old church at Tarry- 
town where he worshipped, and of which he was an 
officer for many years. The ivy which partially covers 
the church was given to Mr. Irving by Sir Walter Scott, 
from Abbots ford. At the time when the most famous 
of British reviewers wrote, "Whoever read or reads an 
American book?" Sir Walter Scott announced the merit 
and coming fame of Washington Irving. But, as Rip 
Van Winkle says, when he returns after twenty years to 
his native village, "how soon we are forgot." 

There was a dinner given in New York to celebrate 
the hundredth anniversary of Washington Irving's birth. 
I was one of the speakers. In an adjoining room was a 
company of young and very successful brokers, whose 
triumphs in the market were the envy of speculative 
America. While I was speaking they came into the 
room. When I had finished, the host at the brokers' 
dinner called me out and said: "We were much inter- 
ested in your speech. This Irving you talked about 
must be a remarkable man. What is the dinner about?" 

I answered him that it was in celebration of the hun- 
dredth anniversary of the birth of Washington Irving. 

"Well," he said, pointing to an old gentleman who 
had sat beside me on the speakers' platform, "it is aston- 
ishing how vigorous he looks at that advanced age." 

It was my good fortune to hear often and know per- 
sonally Richard Mansfield. He was very successful in 



362 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

many parts, but his presentation of Doctor Jekyll and 
Mr. Hyde was wonderful. At one time he came to me 
with a well-thought-out scheme for a national theatre in 
New York, which would be amply endowed and be the 
home of the highest art in the dramatic profession, and 
at the same time the finest school in the world. He 
wanted me to draw together a committee of the leading 
financiers of the country and, if possible, to impress them 
so that they would subscribe the millions necessary for 
carrying out his ideas. I was too busy a man to under- 
take so difficult a project. 

One of the colored porters in the Wagner Palace Car 
service, who was always with me on my tours of inspec- 
tion over the railroad, told me an amusing story of Mr. 
Mansfield's devotion to his art. He was acting as porter 
on Mansfield's car, when he was making a tour of the 
country. This porter was an exceedingly intelligent 
man. He appreciated Mansfield's achievements and 
played up to his humor in using him as a foil while 
always acting. When they were in a station William 
never left the car, but remained on guard for the protec- 
tion of its valuable contents. 

After a play at Kansas City Mansfield came into the 
car very late and said: "William, where is my man- 
ager?" 

"Gone to bed, sir, and so have the other members of 
the company," answered William. 

Then in his most impressive way Mansfield said: 
'William, they fear me. By the way, were you down 
at the depot to-night when the audience from the sub- 
urbs were returning to take their trains home?" 

'Yes, sir," answered William, though he had not been 
out of the car. 



ACTORS AND MEN OF LETTERS 363 

"Did you hear any remarks made about my play?" 

"Yes, sir." 

"Can you give me an instance?" 

"Certainly," replied William; "one gentleman re- 
marked that he had been to the theatre all his life, but 
that your acting to-night was the most rotten thing he 
had ever heard or seen." 

"William," shouted Mansfield, "get my Winchester 
and find that man." 

So Mansfield and William went out among the crowds, 
and when William saw a big, aggressive-looking fellow 
whom he thought would stand up and fight, he said: 

1 here he is. 

Mansfield immediately walked up to the man, covered 
him with his rifle, and shouted: "Hold up your hands, 
you wretch, and take back immediately the insulting 
remark you made about my play and acting and apolo- 
gize. 

The man said: "Why, Mr. Mansfield, somebody has 
been lying to you about me. Your performance to-night 
was the best thing I ever saw in my life." 

"Thank you," said Mansfield, shouldering his rifle, 
and added in the most tragic tone: "William, lead the 
way back to the car." 

Among the most interesting memories of old New 
Yorkers are the suppers which Mr. Augustin Daly gave 
on the one hundredth performance of a play. Like 
everything which Daly did, the entertainment was per- 
fect. A frequent and honored guest on these occasions 
was General Sherman, who was then retired from the 
army and living in New York. Sherman was a military 
• genius but a great deal more. He was one of the most 
sensitive men in the world. Of course, the attraction at 



364 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

these suppers was Miss Rehan, Daly's leading lady. Her 
personal charm, her velvet voice, and her inimitable co- 
quetry made every guest anxious to be her escort. She 
would pretend to be in doubt whether to accept the 
attentions of General Sherman or myself, but when the 
general began to display considerable irritation, the brow 
of Mars was smoothed and the warrior made happy by 
a gracious acceptance of his arm. 

On one of these occasions I heard the best after-dinner 
speech of my life. The speaker was one of the most 
beautiful women in the country, Miss Fanny Daven- 
port. That night she seemed to be inspired, and her 
eloquence, her wit, her humor, her sparkling genius, to- 
gether with the impression of her amazing beauty were 
very effective. 

P. T. Barnum, the showman, was a many-sided and 
interesting character. I saw much of him as he rented 
from the Harlem Railroad Company the Madison Square 
Garden, year after year. Barnum never has had an 
equal in his profession and was an excellent business 
man. In a broad way he was a man of affairs, and with 
his vast fund of anecdotes and reminiscences very enter- 
taining socially. 

An Englishman of note came to me with a letter of 
introduction, and I asked him whom he would like to 
meet. He said: "I think principally Mr. P. T. Barnum." 
I told this to Barnum, who knew all about him, and 
said: "As a gentleman, he knows how to meet me." 
When I informed my English friend, he expressed his 
regret and at once sent Barnum his card and an invita- 
tion for dinner. At the dinner Barnum easily carried 
off the honors with his wonderful fund of unusual ad- 
ventures. 



ACTORS AND MEN OF LETTERS 365 

My first contact with Mr. Barnum occurred many 
years before, when I was a boy up in Peekskill. At that 
time he had a museum and a show in a building at the 
corner of Ann Street and Broadway, opposite the old 
Astor House. By skilful advertising he kept people all 
over the country expecting something new and wonder- 
ful and anxious to visit his show. 

There had been an Indian massacre on the Western 
plains. The particulars filled the newspapers and led to 
action by the government in retaliation. Barnum ad- 
vertised that he had succeeded in securing the Sioux 
warriors whom the government had captured, and who 
would re-enact every day the bloody battle in which 
they were victorious. 

It was one of the hottest afternoons in August when I 
appeared there from the country. The Indians were on 
the top floor, under the roof. The performance was 
sufficiently blood-curdling to satisfy the most exacting 
reader of a penny-dreadful. After the performance, 
when the audience left, I was too fascinated to go, and 
remained in the rear of the hall, gazing at these dreadful 
savages. One of them took off his head-gear, dropped 
his tomahawk and scalping-knife, and said in the broad- 
est Irish to his neighbor: "Moike, if this weather don't 
cool off, I will be nothing but a grease spot." This was 
among the many illusions which have been dissipated 
for me in a long life. Notwithstanding that, I still have 
faith, and dearly love to be fooled, but not to have the 
fraud exposed. 

Wyndham, the celebrated English actor, was playing 
one night in New York. He saw me in the audience 
and sent a messenger inviting me to meet him at supper 



366 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

at the Hoffman House. After the theatre I went to 
the hotel, asked at the desk in what room the theatrical 
supper was, and found there Bronson Howard, the play- 
wright, and some others. I told them the object of my 
search, and Mr. Howard said: "You are just in the right 
place." 

The English actor came later, and also a large number 
of other guests. I was very much surprised and flattered 
at being made practically the guest of honor. In the 
usual and inevitable after-dinner speeches I joined enthu- 
siastically in the prospects of American contributions to 
drama and especially the genius of Bronson Howard. 

It developed afterwards that the actors' dinner was 
set for several nights later, and that I was not invited 
or expected to this entertainment, which was given by 
Mr. Howard to my actor friend, but by concert of action 
between the playwright and the actor, the whole affair 
was turned into a dinner to me. Broadway was de- 
lighted at the joke, but did not have a better time over 
it than I did. 

The supper parties after the play which Wyndham 
gave were among the most enjoyable entertainments in 
London. His guests represented the best in society, 
government, art, literature, and drama. His dining- 
room was built and furnished like the cabin of a yacht 
and the illusion was so complete that sensitive guests 
said they felt the rolling of the sea. 

One evening he said to me: "I expect a countryman of 
yours, a charming fellow, but, poor devil, he has only 
one hundred and fifty thousand pounds a year. He is 
still young, and all the managing mothers are after him 
for their daughters." 

When the prosperous American with an income of 



ACTORS AND MEN OF LETTERS 367 

three-quarters of a million arrived, I needed no introduc- 
tion. I knew him very well and about his affairs. He 
had culture, was widely travelled, was both musical and 
artistic, and his fad was intimacy with prominent peo- 
ple. His dinners were perfection and invitations were 
eagerly sought. On the plea of delicate health he remained 
a brief period in the height of the season in London and 
Paris. But during those few weeks he gave all that could 
be done by lavish wealth and perfect taste, and did it on 
an income of twenty thousand dollars a year. 

Most of the year he lived modestly in the mountains 
of Switzerland or in Eastern travel, but was a welcome 
guest of the most important people in many lands. The 
only deceit about it, if it was a deceit, was that he never 
went out of his way to deny his vast wealth, and as he 
never asked for anything there was no occasion to pub- 
lish his inventory. The pursuing mothers and daughters 
never succeeded, before his flight, in leading him far 
enough to ask for a show-down. 

Many times during my visits to Europe I have been 
besieged to know the income of a countryman. On ac- 
count of the belief over there in the generality of enor- 
mous American fortunes, it is not difficult to create the 
impression of immense wealth. While the man would 
have to make a statement and give references, the lady's 
story is seldom questioned. I have known some hundreds 
and thousands of dollars become in the credulous eyes 
of suitors as many millions, and a few millions become 
multimillions. In several instances the statements of the 
lady were accepted as she achieved her ambition. 

For a tired man who has grown stale with years of 
unremitting work I know of no relief and recuperation 



368 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

equal to taking a steamer and crossing the ocean to 
Europe. I did this for a few weeks in midsummer many 
times and always with splendid and most refreshing 
results. With fortunate introductions, I became ac- 
quainted with many of the leading men of other coun- 
tries, and this was a liberal education. 

There is invariably a concert for charities to help the 
sailors on every ship. I had many amusing experiences 
in presiding on these occasions. I remember once we 
were having a rough night of it, and one of our artists, a 
famous singer, who had made a successful tour of the 
United States, was a little woman and her husband a 
giant. He came to me during the performance and said: 
"My wife is awfully seasick, but she wants to sing, and 
I want her to. In the intervals of her illness she is in 
pretty good shape for a little while. If you will stop 
everything when you see me coming in with her, she will 
do her part." 

I saw him rushing into the saloon with his wife in his 
arms, and immediately announced her for the next num- 
ber. She made a great triumph, but at the proper mo- 
ment was caught up by her husband and carried again 
to the deck. He said to me afterwards: "My wife was 
not at her best last night, because there is a peculiarity 
about seasickness and singers; the lower notes in which 
she is most effective are not at such times available or 
in working order." 

Augustin Daly did a great service to the theatre by 
his wonderful genius as a manager. He discovered tal- 
ent everywhere and encouraged it. He trained his com- 
pany with the skill of a master, and produced in his thea- 
tres here and in London a series of wonderful plays. He 
did not permit his artists to take part, as a rule, in these 



ACTORS AND MEN OF LETTERS 369 

concerts on the ship, but it so happened that on one 
occasion we celebrated the Fourth of July. I went to 
Mr. Daly and asked him if he would not as an American 
take the management of the whole celebration. This 
appealed to him, and he selected the best talent from his 
company. Among them was Ada Rehan. I knew Miss 
Rehan when she was in the stock company at Albany in 
her early days. With Mr. Daly, who discovered her, 
she soon developed into a star of the first magnitude. 

Mr. Daly persisted on my presiding and introducing 
the artists, and also delivering the Fourth of July ora- 
tion. The celebration was so successful in the saloon 
that Mr. Daly had it repeated the next night in the sec- 
ond cabin, and the night after that in the steerage. The 
steerage did its best, and was clothed in the finest things 
which it was carrying back to astonish the old folks in 
the old country, and its enthusiasm was greater, if pos- 
sible, than the welcome which had greeted the artists 
among the first and second cabin passengers. 

After Miss Rehan had recited her part and been 
encored and encored, I found her in tears. I said: "Miss 
Rehan, your triumph has been so great that it should be 
laughter." 

"Yes," she said, "but it is so pathetic to see these 
people who probably never before met with the highest art." 

Among the many eminent English men of letters who 
at one time came to the United States was Matthew 
Arnold. The American lecture promoters were active in 
securing these gentlemen, and the American audiences 
were most appreciative. Many came with letters of 
introduction to me. 

Mr. Arnold was a great poet, critic, and writer, and 



370 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

an eminent professor at Oxford University and well 
known to our people. His first address was at Chicker< 
ing Hall to a crowded house. Beyond the first few rows 
no one could hear him. Explaining this he said to me: 
"My trouble is that my lectures at the university are 
given in small halls and to limited audiences." I advised 
him that before going any farther he should secure an 
elocutionist and accustom himself to large halls, other- 
wise his tour would be a disappointment. 

He gave me an amusing account of his instructor 
selecting Chickering Hall, where he had failed, and mak- 
ing him repeat his lecture, while the instructor kept a 
progressive movement farther and farther from the stage 
until he reached the rear seats, when he said he was 
satisfied. It is a tribute to the versatility of this great 
author that he learned his lesson so well that his subse- 
quent lectures in different parts of the country were very 
successful. 

Once Mr. Arnold said to me: "The lectures which I 
have prepared are for university audiences, to which I 
am accustomed. I have asked my American manager 
to put me only in university towns, but I wish you would 
look over my engagements." 

Having done this, I remarked: "Managers are looking 
for large and profitable audiences. There is no univer- 
sity or college in any of these towns, though one of them 
has an inebriate home and another an insane asylum. 
However, both of these cities have a cultured population. 
Your noisiest and probably most appreciative audience 
will be at the one which is a large railroad terminal. 
Our railroad people are up-to-date." 

I saw Mr. Arnold on his return from his tour. The 
description he gave of his adventures was very pictur- 



ACTORS AND MEN OF LETTERS 371 

esque and the income had been exceedingly satisfactory 
and beyond expectation. 

Describing the peculiarities of the chairmen who in- 
troduced him, he mentioned one of them who said: 
"Ladies and gentlemen, next week we will have in our 
course the most famous magician there is in the world, 
and the week after, I am happy to say, we shall be hon- 
ored by the presence of a great opera-singer, a wonderful 
artist. For this evening it is my pleasure to introduce 
to you that distinguished English journalist, Mr. Edwin 
Arnold." Mr. Arnold began his lecture with a vigorous 
denial that he was Edwin Arnold, whom I judged he did 
not consider in his class. 

Mr. Arnold received in New York and in the larger 
cities which he visited the highest social attention from 
the leading families. I met him several times and found 
that he never could be reconciled to our two most famous 
dishes — terrapin and canvasback duck — the duck nearly 
raw. He said indignantly to one hostess, who chided 
him for his neglect of the canvasback: "Madam, when 
your ancestors left England two hundred and fifty years 
ago, the English of that time were accustomed to eat 
their meat raw; now they cook it." To which the lady 
answered: "I am not familiar with the customs of my 
ancestors, but I know that I pay my chef, who cooked 
the duck, three hundred dollars a month." 

We were all very fond of Thackeray. He did not have 
the general popularity of Charles Dickens, nor did he 
possess Dickens's dramatic power, but he had a large 
and enthusiastic following among our people. It was an 
intellectual treat and revelation to listen to him. That 
wonderful head of his seemed to be an enormous and 
perennial fountain of wit and wisdom. 



372 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

They had a good story of him at the Century Club, 
which is our Athenaeum, that when taken there after a 
lecture by his friends they gave him the usual Centurion 
supper of those days: saddlerock oysters. The saddle- 
rock of that time was nearly as large as a dinner-plate. 
Thackeray said to his host: "What do I do with this 
animal?" 

The host answered: "We Americans swallow them 
whole." 

Thackeray, always equal to the demand of American 
hospitality, closed his eyes and swallowed the oyster, 
and the oyster went down. When he had recovered he 
remarked: "I feel as if I had swallowed a live baby." 

We have been excited at different times to an absorb- 
ing extent by the stories of explorers. None were more 
generally read than the adventures of the famous mis- 
sionary, David Livingstone, in Africa. When Livingstone 
was lost the whole world saluted Henry M. Stanley 
as he started upon his famous journey to find him. 
Stanley's adventures, his perils and escapes, had their 
final success in finding Livingstone. The story enrap- 
tured and thrilled every one. The British Government 
knighted him, and when he returned to the United States 
he was Sir Henry Stanley. He was accompanied by his 
wife, a beautiful and accomplished woman, and received 
with open arms. 

I met Sir Henry many times at private and public 
entertainments and found him always most interesting. 
The Lotos Club gave him one of its most famous din- 
ners, famous to those invited and to those who spoke. 

It was arranged that he should begin his lecture tour 
of the United States in New York. At the request of 
Sir Henry and his committee I presided and introduced 



ACTORS AND MEN OF LETTERS 373 

him at the Metropolitan Opera House. The great audi- 
torium was crowded to suffocation and the audience one 
of the finest and most sympathetic. 

We knew little at that time of Central Africa and its 
people, and the curiosity was intense to hear from Sir 
Henry a personal and intimate account of his wonderful 
discoveries and experiences. He thought that as his 
African life was so familiar to him, it must be the same 
to everybody else. As a result, instead of a thriller he 
gave a commonplace talk on some literary subject which 
bored the audience and cast a cloud over a lecture tour 
which promised to be one of the most successful. Of 
course Sir Henry's effort disappointed his audience the 
more because their indifference and indignation depressed 
him, and he did not do justice to himself or the uninter- 
esting subject which he had selected. He never again 
made the same mistake, and the tour was highly re- 
munerative. 

For nearly a generation there was no subject which so 
interested the American people as the adventures of ex- 
plorers. I met many of them, eulogized them in speeches 
at banquets given in their honor. The people every- 
where were open-eyed, open-eared, and open-mouthed in 
their welcome and eagerness to hear them. 

It is a commentary upon the fickleness of popular 
favor that the time was so short before these universal 
favorites dropped out of popular attention and recol- 
lection. 



XXIV 

SOCIETIES AND PUBLIC BANQUETS 

The most unique experience in my life has been the 
dinners given to me by the Montauk Club of Brooklyn 
on my birthday. The Montauk is a social club of high 
standing, whose members are of professional and busi- 
ness life and different political and religious faiths. 

Thirty years ago Mr. Charles H. Moore was president 
of the club. He was a prominent manufacturer and a 
gentleman of wide influence in political and social circles. 
Mr. McKinley offered him the position of secretary of 
the navy, which Mr. Moore declined. He came to me 
one day with a committee from the club, and said: "The 
Montauk wishes to celebrate your birthday. We know 
that it is on the 23d of April, and that you have two 
distinguished colleagues who also have the 23d as their 
birthday — Shakespeare and St. George. We do not care 
to include them, but desire only to celebrate yours." 

The club has continued these celebrations for thirty 
years by an annual dinner. The ceremonial of the occa- 
sion is a reception, then dinner, and, after an introduc- 
tion by the president, a speech by myself. To make a 
new speech every year which will be of interest to those 
present and those who read it, is not easy. 

These festivities had a fortunate beginning. In think- 
ing over what I should talk about at the first dinner, I 
decided to get some fun out of the municipality of 
Brooklyn by a picturesque description of its municipal 
conditions. It was charged in the newspapers that 

374 



SOCIETIES AND PUBLIC BANQUETS 375 

there had been serious graft in some public improve- 
ments which had been condoned by the authorities and 
excused by an act of the legislature. It had also been 
charged that the Common Council had been giving away 
valuable franchises to their favorites. Of course, this 
presented a fine field of contrast between ancient and 
modern times. In ancient times grateful citizens erected 
statues to eminent men who had deserved well of their 
country in military or civic life, but Brooklyn had im- 
proved upon the ancient model through the grant of 
public utilities. The speech caused a riot after the din- 
ner as to its propriety, many taking the ground that it 
was a criticism, and, therefore, inappropriate to the 
occasion. However, the affair illustrated a common ex- 
perience of mine that unexpected results will sometimes 
flow from a bit of humor, if the humor has concealed in 
it a stick of dynamite. 

The Brooklyn pulpit, which is the most progressive in 
the world, took the matter up and aroused public dis- 
cussion on municipal affairs. The result was the forma- 
tion of a committee of one hundred citizens to investi- 
gate municipal conditions. They found that while the 
mayor and some other officials were high-toned and 
admirable officers, yet the general administration of the 
city government had in the course of years become so 
bad that there should be a general reformation. The 
reform movement was successful; it spread over to New 
York and there again succeeded, and the movement for 
municipal reform became general in the country. 

The next anniversary dinner attracted an audience 
larger than the capacity of the club, and every one of the 
thirty has been an eminent success. For many years 
the affair has received wide publicity in the United 



376 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

States, and has sometimes been reported in foreign news- 
papers. I remember being in London with the late 
Lieutenant-Governor Woodruff, when we saw these 
head-lines at a news-stand on the Strand: " Speech by 
Chauncey Depew at his birthday dinner at the Montauk 
Club, Brooklyn." During this nearly third of a cen- 
tury the membership of the club has changed, sons have 
succeeded fathers and new members have been ad- 
mitted, but the celebration seems to grow in interest. 

During the last fourteen years the president of the 
club has been Mr. William H. English. He has done so 
much for the organization in every way that the mem- 
bers would like to have him as their executive officer for 
life. Mr. English is a splendid type of the American 
who is eminently successful in his chosen career, and 
yet has outside interest for the benefit of the public. 
Modest to a degree and avoiding publicity, he neverthe- 
less is the motive power of many movements progressive 
and charitable. 

Twenty-four years ago a company of public-spirited 
women in the city of Des Moines, Iowa, organized a 
club. They named it after me. For nearly a quarter of 
a century it has been an important factor in the civic life 
of Des Moines. It has with courage, intelligence, and 
independence done excellent work. At the time of its 
organization there were few if any such organizations in 
the country, and it may claim the position of pioneer in 
women's activity in public affairs. 

Happily free from the internal difficulties and disputes 
which so often wreck voluntary associations, the Chaun- 
cey Depew Club is stronger than ever. It looks forward 
with confidence to a successful celebration of its quarter 
of a century. 



SOCIETIES AND PUBLIC BANQUETS 377 

I have never been able to visit the club, but have had 
with it frequent and most agreeable correspondence. It 
always remembers my birthday in the most gratifying 
way. I am grateful to its members for bestowing upon 
me one of the most pleasurable compliments of my life. 

A public dinner is a fine form of testimonial. I have 
had many in my life, celebrating other things than my 
birthday. One of the most notable was given me by 
the citizens of Chicago in recognition of my efforts to 
make their great Columbian exhibition a success. Jus- 
tice John M. Harlan presided, and distinguished men 
were present from different parts of the country and 
representing great interests. Probably the speech which 
excited the most comment was a radical attack of 
Andrew Carnegie on the government of Great Britain, 
in submitting to the authority of a king or a queen. 
Canada was represented by some of the high officials of 
that self-governing colony. The Canadians are more 
loyal to the English form of government than the Eng- 
lish themselves. My peppery Scotch friend aroused a 
Canadian official, who returned his assault with vigor 
and interest. 

It is a very valuable experience for an American to 
attend the annual banquet of the American Chamber of 
Commerce in Paris. The French Government recognizes 
the affair by having a company of their most pictur- 
esquely uniformed soldiers standing guard both inside 
and outside the hall. The highest officials of the French 
Government always attend and make speeches. The 
American Ambassador replies in a speech partly in Eng- 
lish, and, if he is sufficiently equipped, partly in French. 
General Horace Porter and Henry White were equally 
happy both in their native language and in that of the 



378 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

French. The French statesmen, however, were so fond 
of Myron T. Herrick that they apparently not only 
grasped his cordiality but understood perfectly his elo- 
quence. The honor has several times been assigned to 
me of making the American speech in unadulterated 
American. The French may not have understood, but 
with their quick apprehension the applause or laughter 
of the Americans was instantly succeeded by equal mani- 
festations on the part of the French. 

Among the many things which we have inherited from 
our English ancestry are public dinners and after-dinner 
speeches. The public dinner is of importance in Great 
Britain and utilized for every occasion. It is to the 
government the platform where the ministers can lay 
frankly before the country matters which they could not 
develop in the House of Commons. Through the dinner 
speech they open the way and arouse public attention 
for measures which they intend to propose to Parlia- 
ment, and in this way bring the pressure of public 
opinion to their support. 

In the same way every guild and trade have their 
festive functions with serious purpose, and so have reli- 
gious, philanthropic, economic, and sociological move- 
ments. We have gone quite far in this direction, but 
have not perfected the system as they have on the other 
side. I have been making after-dinner speeches for 
sixty years to all sorts and conditions of people, and on 
almost every conceivable subject. I have found these 
occasions of great value because under the good-fellow- 
ship of the occasion an unpopular truth can be sugar- 
coated with humor and received with applause, while in 
the processes of digestion the next day it is working with 
the audience and through the press in the way the pill 



SOCIETIES AND PUBLIC BANQUETS 379 

was intended. A popular audience will forgive almost 
anything with which they do not agree, if the humorous 
way in which it is put tickles their risibilities. 

Mr. Gladstone was very fine at the lord mayor's din- 
ner at Guild Hall, where the prime minister develops his 
policies. So it was with Lord Salisbury and Balfour, 
but the prince of after-dinner speakers in England is 
Lord Rosebery. Pie has the humor, the wit, and the 
artistic touch which fascinates and enraptures his audi- 
ence. 

I have met in our country all the men of my time who 
have won fame in this branch of public address. The 
most remarkable in effectiveness and inspiration was 
Henry Ward Beecher. A banquet was always a success 
if it could have among its speakers William M. Evarts, 
Joseph H. Choate, James S. Brady, Judge John R. 
Brady, General Horace Porter, or Robert G. IngersoII. 

After General Grant settled in New York he was fre- 
quently a guest at public dinners and always produced 
an impression by simple, direct, and effective oratory. 

General Sherman, on the other hand, was an orator as 
well as a fighter. He never seemed to be prepared, but 
out of the occasion would give soldierly, graphic, and pic- 
turesque presentations of thought and description. 

Not to have heard on these occasions Robert G. Inger- 
soII was to have missed being for the evening under the 
spell of a magician. I have been frequently asked if I 
could remember occasions of this kind which were of 
more than ordinary interest. 

After-dinner oratory, while most attractive at the 
time, is evanescent, but some incidents are interesting 
in memory. At the time of Queen Victoria's jubilee I 
was present where a representative of Canada was called 



380 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

upon for a speech. With the exception of the Canadian 
and myself the hosts and guests were all English. My 
Canadian friend enlarged upon the wonders of his coun- 
try. A statement of its marvels did not seem sufficient 
for him unless it was augmented by comparisons with 
other countries to the glory of Canada, and so he com- 
pared Canada with the United States. Canada had bet- 
ter and more enduring institutions, she had a more virile, 
intelligent, and progressive population, and she had pro- 
tected herself, as the United States did not, against un- 
desirable immigration, and in everything which consti- 
tuted an up-to-date, progressive, healthy, and hopeful 
commonwealth she was far in advance of the United 
States. 

I was called upon immediately afterwards and said I 
would agree with the distinguished gentleman from Can- 
ada that in one thing at least Canada was superior to 
the United States, and it was that she had far more 
land, but it was mostly ice. I regret to remember that 
my Canadian friend lost his temper. 

One of the historical dinners of New York, which no 
one will forget who was there, was just after the close of 
the Civil War, or, as my dear old friend, Colonel Wat- 
terson, called it, "The War between the States." The 
principal guests were General Sherman and Henry W. 
Grady of Atlanta, Ga. General Sherman, in his speech, 
described the triumphant return of the Union Army to 
Washington, its review by the President, and then its 
officers and men returning to private life and resuming 
their activities and industries as citizens. It was a word- 
picture of wonderful and startling picturesqueness and 
power and stirred an audience, composed largely of vet- 
erans who had been participants both in the battles and 



SOCIETIES AND PUBLIC BANQUETS 381 

in the parades, to the highest degree of enthusiasm. Mr. 
Grady followed. He was a young man with rare ora- 
torical gifts. He described the return of the Confed- 
erate soldiers to their homes after the surrender at 
Appomattox. They had been four years fighting and 
marching. They were ragged and poor. They returned 
to homes and farms, many of which had been devas- 
tated. They had no capital, and rarely animals or farm- 
ing utensils necessary to begin again. But with superb 
courage, not only on their own part but with the assis- 
tance of their wives, sisters, and daughters, they made 
the desert land flourish and resurrected the country. 

This remarkable description of Grady, which I only 
outline, came as a counterpart to the triumphant epic of 
General Sherman. The effect was electric, and beyond 
almost any that have ever occurred in New York or 
anywhere, and Grady sprang into international fame. 

Joseph H. Choate was a most dangerous fellow speaker 
to his associates who spoke before him. I had with him 
many encounters during fifty years, and many times 
enjoyed being the sufferer by his wit and humor. On 
one occasion Choate won the honors of the evening by 
an unexpected attack. There is a village in western 
New York which is named after me. The enterprising 
inhabitants, boring for what might be under the surface 
of their ground, discovered natural gas. According to 
American fashion, they immediately organized a com- 
pany and issued a prospectus for the sale of the stock. 
The prospectus fell into the hands of Mr. Choate. With 
great glee he read it and then with emphasis the name 
of the company: "The Depew Natural Gas Company, 
Limited," and waving the prospectus at me shouted: 
"Why limited?" 



382 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

There have been two occasions in Mr. Choate's after- 
dinner speeches much commented upon both in this 
country and abroad. As I was present on both evenings, 
it seems the facts ought to be accurately stated. The 
annual dinner of the "Friendly Sons of St. Patrick" 
occurred during one of the years when the Home Rule 
question was most acute in England and actively dis- 
cussed here. At the same time our Irish fellow citizens, 
with their talent for public life, had captured all the 
offices in New York City. They had the mayor, the 
majority of the Board of Aldermen, and a large majority 
of the judges. When Mr. Choate spoke he took up the 
Home Rule question, and, without indicating his own 
views, said substantially: "We Yankees used to be able 
to govern ourselves, but you Irish have come here and 
taken the government away from us. You have our 
entire city administration in your hands, and you do 
with us as you like. We are deprived of Home Rule. 
Now what you are clamoring for both at home and 
abroad is Home Rule for Ireland. With such demon- 
strated ability in capturing the greatest city on the west- 
ern continent, and one of the greatest in the world, why 
don't you go back to Ireland and make, as you would, 
Home Rule there a success?" 

I was called a few minutes afterwards to a confer- 
ence of the leading Irishmen present. I was an hon- 
orary member of that society, and they were in a high 
state of indignation. The more radical thought that 
Mr. Choate's speech should be resented at once. How- 
ever, those who appreciated its humor averted hostile 
action, but Mr. Choate was never invited to an Irish 
banquet again. 

The second historical occasion was when the Scotch 



SOCIETIES AND PUBLIC BANQUETS 383 

honored their patron saint, St. Andrew. The atten- 
dance was greater than ever before, and the interest more 
intense because the Earl of Aberdeen was present. The 
earl was at that time Governor-General of Canada, but 
to the Scotchmen he was much more than that, because 
he was the chief of the Clan Gordon. The earl came 
to the dinner in full Highland costume. Lady Aber- 
deen and the ladies of the vice-regal court were in the 
gallery. I sat next to the earl and Choate sat next 
to me. Choate said: "Chauncey, are Aberdeen's legs 
bare?" I looked under the table-cloth and discovered 
that they were naturally so because of his costume. I 
answered: "Choate, they are." 

I thought nothing of it until Choate began his speech, 
in which he said: "I was not fully informed by the 
committee of the importance of the occasion. I did not 
know that the Earl of Aberdeen was to be here as a guest 
of honor. I was especially and unfortunately ignorant 
that he was coming in the full panoply of his great office 
as chief of Clan Gordon. If I had known that I would 
have left my trousers at home." 

Aberdeen enjoyed it, the ladies in the gallery were 
amused, but the Scotch were mad, and Choate lost in- 
vitations to future Scotch dinners. 

Few appreciate the lure of the metropolis. It attracts 
the successful to win greater success with its larger op- 
portunities. It has resistless charm with the ambitious 
and the enterprising. New York, with its suburbs, 
which are really a part of itself, is the largest city in the 
world. It is the only true cosmopolitan one. It has 
more Irish than any city in Ireland, more Germans and 
Italians than any except the largest cities in Germany 
or Italy. It has more Southerners than are gathered in 



384 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

any place in any Southern State, and the same is true of 
Westerners and those from the Pacific coast and New- 
England, except in Chicago, San Francisco, or Boston. 
There is also a large contingent from the West Indies, 
South America, and Canada. 

The people who make up the guests at a great dinner 
are the survival of the fittest of these various settlers in 
New York. While thousands fail and go back home or 
drop by the way, these men have made their way by 
superior ability, foresight, and adaptability through the 
fierce competitions of the great city. They are unusu- 
ally keen-witted and alert. For the evening of the ban- 
quet they leave behind their business and its cares and 
are bent on being entertained, amused, and instructed. 
They are a most catholic audience, broad-minded, hos- 
pitable, and friendly to ideas whether they are in accord 
with them or not, providing they are well presented. 
There is one thing they will not submit to, and that is 
being bored. 

These functions are usually over by midnight, and 
rarely last so long; while out in the country and in 
other towns, it is no unusual thing to have a dinner with 
speeches run along until the early hours of the next 
morning. While public men, politicians, and aspiring 
orators seek their opportunities upon this platform in 
New York, few succeed and many fail. It is difficult for 
a stranger to grasp the situation and adapt himself at 
once to its atmosphere. I have narrated in preceding 
pages some remarkable successes, and will give a few 
instances of very able and distinguished men who lost 
touch of their audiences. 

One of the ablest men in the Senate was Senator John 
T. Morgan, of Alabama. I was fond of him personally 



SOCIETIES AND PUBLIC BANQUETS 385 

and admired greatly his many and varied talents. He 
was a most industrious and admirable legislator, and a 
debater of rare influence. He was a master of correct 
and scholarly English, and one of the very few who never 
went to the reporters' room to correct his speeches. As 
they were always perfect, he let them stand as they were 
delivered. 

Senator Morgan was a great card on a famous occa- 
sion among the many well-known men who were also to 
speak. Senator Elihu Root presided with his usual dis- 
tinction. Senator Morgan had a prepared speech which 
he read. It was unusually long, but very good. On 
account of his reputation the audience was, for such an 
audience, wonderfully patient and frequent and enthu- 
siastic in its applause. Mistaking his favorable recep- 
tion, Senator Morgan, after he had finished the manu- 
script, started in for an extended talk. After the hour 
had grown to nearly two, the audience became impa- 
tient, and the senator, again mistaking its temper, 
thought they had become hostile and announced that at 
many times and many places he had been met with 
opposition, but that he could not be put down or 
silenced. Mr. Root did the best he could to keep the 
peace, but the audience, who were anxious to hear the 
other speakers, gave up hope and began to leave, with 
the result that midnight saw an empty hall with a pre- 
siding officer and an orator. 

At another great political dinner I sat beside Governor 
Oglesby, of Illinois. He was famous as a war governor 
and as a speaker. There were six speakers on the dais, 
of whom I was one. Happily, my turn came early. 
The governor said to me: "How much of the gospel can 
these tenderfeet stand?" "Well, Governor," I answered, 



3 86 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

"there are six speakers to-night, and the audience will 
not allow the maximum of time occupied to be more 
than thirty minutes. Any one who exceeds that will 
lose his crowd and, worse than that, he may be killed 
by the eloquent gentlemen who are bursting with im- 
patience to get the floor, and who are to follow him." 

"Why," said the governor, "I don't see how any one 
can get started in thirty minutes." 

"Well," I cautioned, "please do not be too long." 

When the midnight hour struck the hall was again 
practically empty, the governor in the full tide of his 
speech, which evidently would require about three 
hours, and the chairman declared the meeting adjourned. 

Senator Foraker, of Ohio, who was one of the ap- 
pointed speakers, told me the next morning that at the 
Fifth Avenue Hotel, where he was stopping, he was just 
getting into bed when the governor burst into his room 
and fairly shouted: "Foraker, no wonder New York is 
almost always wrong. You saw to-night that it would 
not listen to the truth. Now I want to tell you what I 
intended to say." He was shouting with impassioned 
eloquence, his voice rising until, through the open win- 
dows, it reached Madison Square Park, when the watch- 
man burst in and said: "Sir, the guests in this hotel will 
not stand that any longer, but if you must finish your 
speech I will take you out in the park." 

During Cleveland's administration one of the New 
York banquets became a national affair. The principal 
speaker was the secretary of the interior, Lucius Q. C. 
Lamar, who afterwards became United States senator 
and justice of the Supreme Court. Mr. Lamar was one 
of the ablest and most cultured men in public life, and a 
fine orator. I was called upon so late that it was impos- 



SOCIETIES AND PUBLIC BANQUETS 387 

sible to follow any longer the serious discussions of the 
evening, and what the management and the audience 
wanted from me was some fun. 

Lamar, with his Johnsonian periods and the lofty 
style of Edmund Burke, furnished an opportunity for a 
little pleasantry. He came to me, when I had finished, 
in great alarm and said: "My appearance here is not an 
ordinary one and does not permit humor. I am sec- 
retary of the interior, and the representative of the 
president and his administration. My speech is really 
the message of the president to the whole country, 
and I wish you would remedy any impression which 
the country might otherwise receive from your hu- 
mor. 

This I was very glad to do, but it was an instance of 
which I have met many, of a very distinguished and 
brilliant gentleman taking himself too seriously. At 
another rather solemn function of this kind I performed 
the same at the request of the management, but with 
another protest from the orator and his enmity. 

In reminiscing, after he retired from the presidency, 
Mr. Cleveland spoke to me of his great respect and ad- 
miration for Mr. Lamar. Cleveland's speeches were al- 
ways short. His talent was for compression and con- 
centration, and he could not understand the necessity 
for an effort of great length. He told me that while 
Justice Lamar was secretary of the interior he came to 
him one day and said: "Mr. President, I have accepted 
an invitation to deliver an address in the South, and as 
your administration may be held responsible for what I 
say, I wish you would read it over and make any correc- 
tions or suggestions." 

Mr. Cleveland said the speech was extraordinarily 



388 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

long though very good, and when he returned it to Sec- 
retary Lamar he said to him: "That speech will take at 
least three hours to deliver. A Northern audience would 
never submit to over an hour. Don't you think you had 
better cut it down?" The secretary replied: "No, Mr. 
President; a Southern audience expects three hours, and 
would be better satisfied with five." 

Justice Miller, one of the ablest of the judges of the 
Supreme Court at that time, was the principal speaker 
on another occasion. He was ponderous to a degree, 
and almost equalled in the emphasis of his utterances 
what was once said of Daniel Webster, that every word 
weighed twelve pounds. I followed him. The Attorney- 
General of the United States, who went back to Washing- 
ton the next day with Justice Miller, told me that as 
soon as they had got on the train the justice commenced 
to complain that I had wholly misunderstood his speech, 
and that no exaggeration of interpretation would war- 
rant what I said. The judge saw no humor in my little 
effort to relieve the situation, and took it as a reply of 
opposing counsel. He said that the justice took it up 
from another phase after leaving Philadelphia, and re- 
sumed his explanation from another angle as to what he 
meant after they reached Baltimore. When the train 
arrived at its destination and they separated in the 
Washington station, the justice turned to the attorney- 
general and said: "Damn Depew ! Good-night." 

Such are the perils of one who good-naturedly yields 
to the importunities of a committee of management who 
fear the failure with their audience of their entertain- 
ment. 

The great dinners of New York are the Chamber of 
Commerce, which is a national function, as were also for 



SOCIETIES AND PUBLIC BANQUETS 389 

a long time, during the presidency of Mr. Choate, those 
of the New England Society. The annual banquets of 
the Irish, Scotch, English, Welsh, Holland, St. Nicholas, 
and the French, are also most interesting, and some- 
times by reason of the presence of a national or inter- 
national figure, assume great importance. The dinner 
which the Pilgrims Society tenders to the British am- 
bassador gives him an opportunity, without the formali- 
ties and conventions of his office, of speaking his mind 
both to the United States and to his own people. 

The annual banquets of the State societies are now 
assuming greater importance. Each State has thousands 
of men who have been or still are citizens, but who live 
in New York. Those dinners attract the leading poli- 
ticians of their several States. It is a platform for the 
ambitious to be president and sometimes succeeds. 

Garfield made a great impression at one of these State 
dinners, so did Foraker, and at the last dinner of the 
Ohio Society the star was Senator Warren G. Harding. 
On one occasion, when McKinley and Garfield were 
present, in the course of my speech I made a remark 
which has since been adopted as a sort of motto by the 
Buckeye State. Ohio, I think, has passed Virginia as a 
mother of presidents. It is remarkable that the candi- 
dates of both great parties are now of that State. I said 
in the closing of my speech, alluding to the distinguished 
guests and their prospects: "Some men have greatness 
thrust upon them, some are born great, and some are 
born in Ohio." 

One of the greatest effects produced by a speech was 
by Henry Ward Beecher at an annual dinner of the 
Friendly Sons of St. Patrick. At the time, the Home 
Rule question was more than ordinarily acute and 



390 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

Fenianism was rabid. While Mr. Beecher had great 
influence upon his audience, his audience had equal in- 
fluence upon him. As he enlarged upon the wrongs of 
Ireland the responses became more enthusiastic and 
finally positively savage. This stirred the orator up 
till he gave the wildest approval to direct action and 
revolution, with corresponding cheers from the diners, 
standing and cheering. Mr. Beecher was explaining that 
speech for about a year afterwards. I was a speaker on 
the same platform. 

Mr. Beecher always arrived late, and everybody 
thought it was to get the applause as he came in, but he 
explained to me that it was due to his method of prep- 
aration. He said his mind would not work freely until 
three hours after he had eaten. Many speakers have 
told me the same thing. He said when he had a speech 
to make at night, whether it was at a dinner or else- 
where, that he took his dinner in the middle of the day, 
and then a glass of milk and crackers at five o'clock, 
with nothing afterwards. Then in the evening his mind 
was perfectly clear and under absolute control. 

The Lotos Club has been for fifty years to New York 
what the Savage Club is to London. It attracts as its 
guests the most eminent men of letters who visit this 
country. Its entertainments are always successful. For 
twenty-nine years it had for its president Mr. Frank R. 
Lawrence, a gentleman with a genius for introducing 
distinguished strangers with most felicitous speeches, 
and a committee who selected with wonderful judgment 
the other speakers of the evening. A successor to Mr. 
Lawrence, and of equal merit, has been found in Chester 
S. Lord, now president of the Lotos Club. Mr. Lord 
was for more than a third of a century managing editor 



SOCIETIES AND PUBLIC BANQUETS 391 

of the New York Sun, and is now chancellor of the 
University of the State of New York. 

I remember one occasion where the most tactful man 
who ever appeared before his audience slipped his trol- 
ley, and that was Bishop Potter. The bishop was a 
remarkably fine preacher and an unusually attractive 
public speaker and past master of all the social amenities 
of life. The guest of the evening was the famous Canon 
Kingsley, author of "Hypatia" and other works at that 
time universally popular. The canon had the largest 
and reddest nose one ever saw. The bishop, among the 
pleasantries of his introduction, alluded to this headlight 
of religion and literature. The canon fell from grace 
and never forgave the bishop. 

On Lotos nights I have heard at their best Lord 
Houghton, statesman and poet, Mark Twain, Stanley 
the explorer, and I consider it one of the distinctions as 
well as pleasures of my life to have been a speaker at 
the Lotos on more occasions than any one else during 
the last half century. 

In Mr. Joseph Pulitzer's early struggles with his paper, 
the New York World, the editorial columns frequently had 
very severe attacks on Mr. William H. Vanderbilt and 
the New York Central Railroad. They were part, of 
course, of attacks upon monopoly. I was frequently in- 
cluded in these criticisms. 

The Lotos Club gave a famous dinner to George 
Augustus Sala, the English writer and journalist. I 
found myself seated beside Mr. Pulitzer, whom I had 
never met. When I was called upon to speak I intro- 
duced, in what I had to say about the distinguished guest, 
this bit of audacity. I said substantially, in addition to 
Mr. Sala: "We have with us to-night a great journalist 



392 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

who comes to the metropolis from the wild and woolly- 
West. After he had purchased the World he came to 
me and said, 'Chauncey Depew, I have a scheme, which 
I am sure will benefit both of us. Everybody is envious 
of the prestige of the New York Central and the wealth 
of Mr. Vanderbilt. You are known as his principal ad- 
viser. Now, if in my general hostility to monopoly I in- 
clude Mr. Vanderbilt and the New York Central as prin- 
cipal offenders, I must include you, because you are the 
champion in your official relationship of the corporation 
and of its policies and activities. I do not want you to 
have any feeling against me because of this. The policy 
will secure for the World everybody who is not a stock- 
holder in the New York Central, or does not possess mil- 
lions of money. When Mr. Vanderbilt finds that you 
are attacked, he is a gentleman and broad-minded enough 
to compensate you and will grant to you both significant 
promotion and a large increase in salary.' ' Then I 
added: "Well, gentlemen, I have only to say that Mr. 
Pulitzer's experiment has been eminently successful. He 
has made his newspaper a recognized power and a nota- 
ble organ of public opinion; its fortunes are made and 
so are his, and, in regard to myself, all he predicted has 
come true, both in promotion and in enlargement of 
income." When I sat down Mr. Pulitzer grasped me 
by the hand and said: "Chauncey Depew, you are a 
mighty good fellow. I have been misinformed about 
you. You will have friendly treatment hereafter in any 
newspaper which I control." 

The Gridiron Club of Washington, because of both its 
ability and genius and especially its national position, 
furnishes a wonderful platform for statesmen. Its genius 
in creating caricatures and fake pageants of current po- 



SOCIETIES AND PUBLIC BANQUETS 393 

Iftical situations at the capital and its public men is most 
remarkable. The president always attends, and most of 
the Cabinet and justices of the Supreme Court. The 
ambassadors and representatives of the leading govern- 
ments represented in Washington are guests, and so are 
the best-known senators and representatives of the time. 
The motto of the club is "Reporters are never present. 
Ladies always present." Though the association is made 
up entirely of reporters, the secrecy is so well kept that 
the speakers are unusually frank. 

There was a famous contest one night there, however, 
between President Roosevelt and Senator Foraker, who 
at the time were intensely antagonistic, which can never 
be forgotten by those present. There was a delightful 
interplay between William J. Bryan and President 
Roosevelt, when Bryan charged the president with steal- 
ing all his policies and ideas. 

If the speaker grasped the peculiarities of his audience 
and its temperament, his task was at once the most difficult 
and the most delightful, and my friend, Mr. Arthur Dunn, 
has performed most useful service in embalming a portion 
of Gridiron history in his volume, "Gridiron Nights." 

Pierpont Morgan, the greatest of American bankers, 
was much more than a banker. He had a wonderful col- 
lection in his library and elsewhere of rare books and 
works of art. He was always delightful on the social 
side. He was very much pleased when he was elected 
president of the New England Society. The annual din- 
ner that year was a remarkably brilliant affair. It was 
the largest in the history of the organization. The prin- 
cipal speaker was William Everett, brother of the famous 
Edward Everett and himself a scholar of great acquire- 
ments and culture. His speech was another evidence of 



394 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

a very superior man mistaking his audience. He was 
principal of the Cambridge School, that great prepara- 
tory institution for Harvard University, and he had 
greatly enlarged its scope and usefulness. 

Mr. Everett evidently thought that the guests of the 
New England Society of New York would be composed 
of men of letters, educators, and Harvard graduates. 
Instead of that, the audience before him were mainly 
bankers and successful business men whose Puritan 
characteristics had enabled them to win great success in 
the competitions in the great metropolis in every branch 
of business. They were out for a good time and little else. 

Mr. Everett produced a ponderous mass of manuscript 
and began reading on the history of New England educa- 
tion and the influence upon it of the Cambridge School. 
He had more than an hour of material and lost his audi- 
ence in fifteen minutes. No efforts of the chairman 
could bring them to attention, and finally the educator 
lost that control of himself which he was always teach- 
ing to the boys and threw his manuscript at the heads 
of the reporters. From their reports in their various 
newspapers the next day, they did not seem to have ab- 
sorbed the speech by this original method. 

Choate and I were both to speak, and Choate came 
first. As usual, he threw a brick at me. He mentioned 
that a reporter had come to him and said: "Mr. Choate, 
I have Depew's speech carefully prepared, with the ap- 
plause and laughter already in. I want yours." Of 
course, no reporter had been to either of us. Mr. 
Choate had in his speech an unusual thing for him, a 
long piece of poetry. When my turn came to reply I 
said: "The reporter came to me, as Mr. Choate has said, 
and made the remark: 'I already have Choate's speech. 



SOCIETIES AND PUBLIC BANQUETS 395 

It has in it a good deal of poetry.' I asked the reporter: 
'From what author is the poetry taken?' He answered: 
'I do not know the author, but the poetry is so bad I 
think Choate has written it himself.'" 

Mr. Choate told me a delightful story of his last inter- 
view with Mr. Evarts before he sailed for Europe to take 
up his ambassadorship at the Court of St. James. "I 
called," he said, "on Mr. Evarts to bid him good-by. 
He had been confined to his room by a fatal illness for 
a long time. 'Choate,' he said, 'I am delighted with 
your appointment. You eminently deserve it, and you 
are pre-eminently fit for the place. You have won the 
greatest distinction in our profession, and have har- 
vested enough of its rewards to enable you to meet the 
financial responsibilities of this post without anxiety. 
You will have a most brilliant and useful career in diplo- 
macy, but I fear I will never see you again.' ' 

Mr. Choate said: "Mr. Evarts, we have had a delight- 
ful partnership of over forty years, and when I retire 
from diplomacy and resume the practice of the law I 
am sure you and I will go on together again for many 
years in the same happy old way." 

Evarts replied: "No, Choate, I fear that cannot be. 
When I think what a care I am to all my people, lying 
so helpless here, and that I can do nothing any more to 
repay their kindness, or to help in the world, I feel like 
the boy who wrote from school to his mother a letter of 
twenty pages, and then added after the end : ' P. S. Dear 
mother, please excuse my longevity.'" 

Where one has a reputation as a speaker and is also 
known to oblige friends and to be hardly able to resist 
importunities, the demands upon him are very great. 
They are also sometimes original and unique. 



396 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

At one time, the day before Christmas, a representa- 
tive of the New York World came to see me and said: 
'We are going to give a dinner to-night to the tramps 
who gather between ten and eleven o'clock at the Vienna 
Restaurant, opposite the St. Denis Hotel, to receive the 
bread which the restaurant distributes at that hour." 
This line was there every night standing in the cold 
waiting their turn. I went down to the hotel, and a 
young man and young lady connected with the news- 
paper crossed the street and picked out from the line a 
hundred guests. 

It was a remarkable assemblage. The dinner pro- 
vided was a beautiful and an excellent one for Christmas. 
As I heard their stories, there was among them a repre- 
sentative of almost every department of American life. 
Some were temporarily and others permanently down 
and out. Every one of the learned professions was rep- 
resented and many lines of business. The most of them 
were in this condition, because they had come to New 
York to make their way, and had struggled until their 
funds were exhausted, and then they were ashamed to 
return home and confess their failure. 

I presided at this remarkable banquet and made not 
only one speech but several. By encouraging the guests 
we had several excellent addresses from preachers with- 
out pulpits, lawyers without clients, doctors without 
patients, engineers without jobs, teachers without 
schools, and travellers without funds. One man arose 
and said: "Chauncey Depew, the World has given us 
such an excellent dinner, and you have given us such a 
merry Christmas Eve, we would like to shake hands 
with you as we go out." 

I had long learned the art of shaking hands with the 



SOCIETIES AND PUBLIC BANQUETS 397 

public. Many a candidate has had his hands crushed 
and been permanently hurt by the vise-like grip of an 
ardent admirer or a vicious opponent. I remember Gen- 
eral Grant complaining of this, of how he suffered, and 
I told him of my discovery of grasping the hand first 
and dropping it quickly. 

The people about me were looking at these men as 
they came along, to see if there was any possible dan- 
ger. Toward the end of the procession one man said to 
me: "Chauncey Depew, I don't belong to this crowd. I 
am well enough off and can take care of myself. I am 
an anarchist. My business is to stir up unrest and dis- 
content, and that brings me every night to mingle with 
the crowd waiting for their dole of bread from Fleisch- 
mann's bakery. You do more than any one else in the 
whole country to create good feeling and dispel unrest, 
and you have done a lot of it to-night. I made up my 
mind to kill you right here, but you are such an infernal 
good fellow that I have not the heart to do it, so here's 
my hand." 

On one occasion I received an invitation to address a 
sociological society which was to meet at the house of 
one of the most famous entertainers in New York. My 
host said that Edward Atkinson, the well-known New 
England writer, philosopher, and sociologist, would ad- 
dress the meeting. When I arrived at the house I found 
Atkinson in despair. The audience were young ladies 
in full evening dress and young men in white vests, white 
neckties, and swallow-tails. There was also a band 
present. We were informed that this society had en- 
deavored to mingle instruction with pleasure, and it 
really was a dancing club, but they had conceived the idea 
of having something serious and instructive before the ball. 



398 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

Mr. Atkinson said to me: "What won me to come 
here is that in Boston we have a society of the same 
name. It is composed of very serious people who are 
engaged in settlement and sociological work. They are 
doing their best to improve the conditions of the young 
women and young men who are in clerical and other 
employment. I have delivered several addresses before 
that society, and before the audiences which they gather, 
on how to live comfortably and get married on the 
smallest possible margin. Now, for instance, for my lec- 
ture here to-night I have on a ready-made suit of clothes, 
for which I paid yesterday five dollars. In that large 
boiler there is a stove which I have invented. In the 
oven of the stove is beef and various vegetables, and to 
heat it is a kerosene lamp with a clockwork attached. A 
young man or a young woman, or a young married 
couple go to the market and buy the cheap cuts of beef, 
and then, according to my instructions, they put it in 
the stove with the vegetables, light the lamp, set the 
clockwork and go to their work. When they return at 
five, six, or seven o'clock they find a very excellent and 
very cheap dinner all ready to be served. Now, of what 
use is my five-dollar suit of clothes and my fifty-cent 
dinner for this crowd of butterflies?" 

However, Mr. Atkinson and I made up our minds to 
talk to them as if they needed it or would need it some 
day or other, and they were polite enough to ask ques- 
tions and pretend to enjoy it. I understand that after- 
wards at the midnight supper there was more cham- 
pagne and more hilarity than at previous gatherings of 
this sociological club. 

During one of our presidential campaigns some young 
men came up from the Bowery to see me. They said: 



SOCIETIES AND PUBLIC BANQUETS 399 

"We have a very hard time down in our district. The 
crowd is a tough one but intelligent, and we think would 
be receptive of the truth if they could hear it put to 
them in an attractive form. We will engage a large 
theatre attached to a Bowery beer saloon if you will 
come down and address the meeting. The novelty of 
your appearance will fill the theatre." 

I knew there was considerable risk, and yet it was a 
great opportunity. I believe that in meeting a crowd 
of that sort one should appear as they expect him to 
look when addressing the best of audiences. These peo- 
ple are very proud, and they resent any attempt on your 
part to be what they know you are not, but that you are 
coming down to their level by assuming a character 
which you presume to be theirs. So I dressed with un- 
usual care, and when I went on the platform a short- 
sleeved, short-haired genius in the theatre shouted: 
"Chauncey thinks he is in Carnegie Hall." 

The famous Tim Sullivan, who was several times a 
state senator and congressman, and a mighty good fel- 
low, was the leader of the Bowery and controlled its 
political actions. He came to see me and said: "I hope 
you will withdraw from that appointment. I do not 
want you to come down there. In the first place, I can- 
not protect you, and I don't think it is safe. In the 
second place, you are so well known and popular among 
our people that I am afraid you will produce an impres- 
sion, and if you get away with it that will hurt our 
machine." 

In the course of my speech a man arose whom I knew 
very well as a district leader, and who was frequently in 
my office, seeking positions for his constituents and other 
favors. That night he was in his shirt-sleeves among 



4 oo CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

the boys. With the old volunteer fireman's swagger and 
the peculiar patois of that part of New York, he said: 
"Chauncey Depew, you have no business here. You 
are the president of the New York Central Railroad, 
ain't you, hey? You are a rich man, ain't you, hey? 
We are poor boys. You don't know us and can't teach 
us anything. You had better get out while you can." 

My reply was this: "My friend, I want a little talk 
with you. I began life very much as you did. Nobody 
helped me. I was a country boy and my capital was 
this head," and I slapped it, " these legs," and I slapped 
them, "these hands," and I slapped them, "and by 
using them as best I could I have become just what you 
say I am and have got where you will never arrive." 

A shirt-sleeved citizen jumped up from the audience 
and shouted: "Go ahead, Chauncey, you're a peach." 
That characterization of a peach went into the news- 
papers and was attached to me wherever I appeared for 
many years afterwards, not only in this country but 
abroad. It even found a place in the slang column of 
the great dictionaries of the English language. The 
result of the meeting, however, was a free discussion in 
the Bowery, and for the first time in its history that par- 
ticular district was carried by the Republicans. 

After their triumph in the election I gave a dinner in 
the Union League Club to the captains of the election 
districts. There were about a hundred of them. The 
district captains were all in their usual business suits, 
and were as sharp, keen, intelligent, and up-to-date 
young men as one could wish to meet. The club mem- 
bers whom I had invited to meet my guests were, of 
course, in conventional evening dress. The novelty of 
the occasion was so enjoyed by them that they indulged 



SOCIETIES AND PUBLIC BANQUETS 401 

with more than usual liberality in the fluids and fizz and 
became very hilarious. Not one of the district captains 
touched a drop of wine. 

While the club members were a little frightened at the 
idea of these East-siders coming, my guests understood 
and met every convention of the occasion before, during, 
and after dinner, as if it was an accustomed social func- 
tion with them. The half dozen who made speeches 
showed a grasp of the political questions of the hour and 
an ability to put their views before an audience which 
was an exhibition of a high order of intelligence and self- 
culture. 

In selecting a few out-of-the-way occasions which were 
also most interesting and instructive, I recall one with a 
society which prided itself upon its absence of narrow- 
ness and its freedom of thought and discussion. The 
speakers were most critical of all that is generally 
accepted and believed. Professor John Fiske, the his- 
torian, was the most famous man present, and very 
critical of the Bible. My good mother had brought me 
up on the Bible and instilled in me the deepest reverence 
for the good book. The criticism of the professor stirred 
me to a rejoinder. I, of course, was in no way equal to 
meeting him, with his vast erudition and scholarly 
accomplishments. I could only give what the Bible 
critic would regard as valueless, a sledge-hammer ex- 
pression of faith. Somebody took the speech down. 
Doctor John Hall, the famous preacher and for many 
years pastor of the Fifth Avenue Presbyterian Church, 
told me that the Bible and the church societies in Eng- 
land had put the speech into a leaflet, and were distrib- 
uting many millions of them in the British Isles. 

It is singular what vogue and circulation a story of the 



402 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

hour will receive. Usually these decorations of a speech 
die with the occasion. There was fierce rivalry when it 
was decided to celebrate the four hundredth anniversary 
of the landing of Columbus in America, between New 
York and Chicago, as to which should have the exhibi- 
tion. Of course the Western orators were not modest in 
the claims which they made for the City by the Lakes. 
To dampen their ardor I embroidered the following 
story, which took wonderfully when told in my speech. 
It was at the Eagle Hotel in Peekskill, at which it was 
said George Washington stopped many times as a guest 
during the Revolutionary War, where in respect to his 
memory they preserved the traditions of the Revolu- 
tionary period. At that time the bill of fare was not 
printed, but the waiter announced to the guest what 
would be served, if asked for. A Chicago citizen was 
dining at the hotel. He ordered each of the many items 
announced to him by the waiter. When he came to the 
deserts the waiter said: "We have mince-pie, apple- 
pie, pumpkin-pie, and custard-pie." The Chicago man 
ordered mince-pie, apple-pie, and pumpkin-pie. The 
disgusted waiter remarked: "What is the matter with 
the custard?" Alongside me sat a very well-known 
English gentleman of high rank, who had come to this 
country on a sort of missionary and evangelistic errand. 
Of course, he was as solemn as the task he had under- 
taken, which was to convert American sinners. He 
turned suddenly to me and, in a loud voice, asked: 
"What was the matter with the custard-pie?" The 
story travelled for years, was used for many purposes, 
was often murdered in the narration, but managed to 
survive, and was told to me as an original joke by one 
of the men I met at the convention last June in Chicago. 



SOCIETIES AND PUBLIC BANQUETS 403 

After Chicago received from Congress the appoint- 
ment I did all I could to help the legislation and appro- 
priations necessary. The result was that when I visited 
the city as an orator at the opening of the exhibition I 
was voted the freedom of the city, was given a great 
reception, and among other things reviewed the school 
children who paraded in my honor. 

The Yale alumni of New York City had for many 
years an organization. In the early days the members 
met very infrequently at a dinner. This was a formal 
affair, and generally drew a large gathering, both of 
the local alumni and from the college and the country. 
These meetings were held at Delmonico's, then located 
in Fourteenth Street. The last was so phenomenally 
dull that there were no repetitions. 

The speakers were called by classes, and the oldest in 
graduation had the platform. The result was disastrous. 
These old men all spoke too long, and it was an endless 
stream of platitudes and reminiscences of forgotten days 
until nearly morning. Then an inspiration of the chair- 
man led him to say: "I think it might be well to have a 
word from the younger graduates." 

There was a unanimous call for a well-known humorist 
named Styles. His humor was aided by a startling ap- 
pearance of abundant red hair, an aggressive red mus- 
tache, and eyes which seemed to push his glasses off his 
nose. Many of the speakers, owing to the imperfection 
of the dental art in those days, indicated their false teeth 
by their trouble in keeping them in place, and the whis- 
tling it gave to their utterances. One venerable orator 
in his excitement dropped his into his tumbler in the 
midst of his address. 

Styles said to this tired audience: "At this early hour 



404 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

in the morning I will not attempt to speak, but I will 
tell a story. Down at Barnegat, N. J., where I live, our 
neighbors are very fond of apple-jack. One of them 
while in town had his jug filled, and on the way home 
saw a friend leaning over the gate and looking so thirsty 
that he stopped and handed over his jug with an offer of 
its hospitality. After sampling it the neighbor con- 
tinued the gurgling as the jug rose higher and higher, 
until there was not a drop left in it. The indignant 
owner said: 'You infernal hog, why did you drink up all 
my apple-jack?' His friend answered: 'I beg your par- 
don, Job, but I could not bite off the tap, because I have 
lost all my teeth.' : The aptness of the story was the 
success of the evening. 

Some years afterwards there was a meeting of the 
alumni to form a live association. Among those who 
participated in the organization were William Walter 
Phelps, afterwards member of Congress and minister to 
Austria; Judge Henry E. Howland; John Proctor Clarke, 
now chief justice of the Appellate Division; James R. 
Sheffield, then a rising young lawyer, now president of 
the Union League Club; and Isaac Bromley, one of the 
editors of the New York Tribune, one of the wittiest writ- 
ers of his time, and many others who have since won 
distinction. They elected me president, and I contin- 
ued as such by successive elections for ten years. 

The association met once a month and had a serious 
paper read, speeches, a simple supper, and a social eve- 
ning. These monthly gatherings became a feature and 
were widely reported in the press. We could rely upon 
one or more of the faculty, and there was always to be 
had an alumnus of national reputation from abroad. 
We had a formal annual dinner, which was more largely 



SOCIETIES AND PUBLIC BANQUETS 405 

attended than almost any function of the kind in the 
city, and, because of the variety and excellence of the 
speaking, always very enjoyable. 

The Harvard and Princeton alumni also had an asso- 
ciation at that time, with annual dinners, and it was 
customary for the officers of each of these organizations 
to be guests of the one which gave the dinner. The 
presidents of the colleges represented always came. 
Yale could rely upon President Dwight, Harvard upon 
President Eliot, and Princeton upon President McCosh. 

Of course, the interchanges between the representa- 
tives of the different colleges were as exciting and aggres- 
sive as their football and baseball contests are to-day. 
I recall one occasion of more than usual interest. It was 
the Princeton dinner, and the outstanding figure of the 
occasion was that most successful and impressive of col- 
lege executives, President McCosh. He spoke with a 
broad Scotch accent and was in every sense a Iiteralist. 
Late in the evening Mr. Beaman, a very brilliant lawyer 
and partner of Evarts and Choate, who was president of 
the Harvard Alumni Association, said to me: "These 
proceedings are fearfully prosaic and highbrow. When 
you are called, you attack President McCosh, and I will 
defend him." So in the course of my remarks, which 
were highly complimentary to Princeton and its rapid 
growth under President McCosh, I spoke of its remark- 
able success in receiving gifts and legacies, which were 
then pouring into its treasury every few months, and 
were far beyond anything which came either to Yale or 
Harvard, though both were in great need. Then I 
hinted that possibly this flow of riches was due to the 
fact that President McCosh had such an hypnotic influ- 
ence over the graduates of Princeton and their fathers, 



406 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

mothers, and wives that none of them felt there was a 
chance of a heavenly future unless Princeton was among 
the heirs. 

Mr. Beaman was very indignant and with the con- 
tinuing approval and applause of the venerable doctor 
made a furious attack upon me. His defense of the 
president was infinitely worse than my attack. He 
alleged that I had intimated that the doctor kept tab 
on sick alumni of wealth and their families, and at the 
critical moment there would be a sympathetic call from 
the doctor, and, while at the bedside he administered 
comfort and consolation, yet he made it plain to the 
patient that he could not hope for the opening of the 
pearly gates or the welcome of St. Peter unless Princeton 
was remembered. Then Beaman, in a fine burst of ora- 
tory, ascribed this wonderful prosperity not to any per- 
sonal effort or appeal, but because the sons of Princeton 
felt such reverence and gratitude for their president that 
they were only too glad of an opportunity to contribute 
to the welfare of the institution. 

The moment Beaman sat down the doctor arose, and 
with great intensity expressed his thanks and gratitude 
to the eloquent president of the Harvard alumni, and 
then shouted: "I never, never, never solicited a gift for 
Princeton from a dying man. I never, never, never sat 
by the bedside of a dying woman and held up the terrors 
of hell and the promises of heaven, according to the dis- 
position she made of her estate. I never, never looked 
with unsympathetic and eager anticipation whenever 
any of our wealthy alumni appeared in ill health." 

The doctor, however, retaliated subsequently. He in- 
vited me to deliver a lecture before the college, and 
entertained me most delightfully at his house. It was 



SOCIETIES AND PUBLIC BANQUETS 407 

a paid admission, and when I left in the morning he 
said: "I want to express to you on behalf of our college 
our thanks. We raised last evening through your lec- 
ture enough to fit our ball team for its coming contest 
with Yale." In that contest Princeton was trium- 
phant. 

The Yale Alumni Association subsequently evoluted 
into the Yale Club of New York, which has in every way 
been phenomenally prosperous. It is a factor of national 
importance in supporting Yale and keeping alive every- 
where appreciation and enthusiasm for and practice of 
Yale spirit. 

My class of 1856 at Yale numbered ninety-seven on 
graduation. Only four of us survive. In these pages 
I have had a continuous class meeting. Very few, if 
any, of my associates in the New York Legislature of 
1862 and 1863 are alive, and none of the State officers 
who served with me in the succeeding years. There is 
no one left in the service who was there when I became 
connected with the New York Central Railroad, and no 
executive officer in any railroad in the United States 
who held that position when I was elected and is still 
active. 

It is the habit of age to dwell on the degeneracy of 
the times and lament the good old days and their su- 
periority, but Yale is infinitely greater and broader 
than when I graduated sixty-five years ago. The New 
York Legislature and State executives are governing an 
empire compared with the problems which we had to 
solve fifty-nine years ago. 

I believe in the necessity of leadership, and while 
recognizing a higher general average in public life, re- 
gret that the world crisis through which. we have passed 



4 o8 CHAUNCEY M. DEPEW 

and which is not yet completed, has produced no Wash- 
ington, Lincoln, or Roosevelt. I rejoice that President 
Harding, under the pressure of his unequalled responsi- 
bilities, is developing the highest qualities of leadership. 
It is an exquisite delight to visualize each administra- 
tion from 1856 and to have had considerable intimacy 
with the leaders in government and the moulders of 
public opinion during sixty-five unusually laborious 
years. 

Many who have given their reminiscences have kept 
close continuing diaries. From these voluminous records 
they have selected according to their judgment. As I 
have before said, I have no data and must rely on my 
memory. This faculty is not logical, its operations are 
not by years or periods, but its films unroll as they are 
moved by association of ideas and events. 

It has been a most pleasurable task to bring back into 
my life these worthies of the past and to live over again 
events of greater or lesser importance. Sometimes an 
anecdote illumines a character more than a biography, 
and a personal incident helps an understanding of a 
period more than its formal history. 

Life has had for me immeasurable charms. I recog- 
nize at all times there has been granted to me the loving 
care and guidance of God. My sorrows have been al- 
leviated and lost their acuteness from a firm belief in 
closer reunion in eternity. My misfortunes, disappoint- 
ments, and losses have been met and overcome by abun- 
dant proof of my mother's faith and teaching that they 
were the discipline of Providence for my own good, and 
if met in that spirit and with redoubled effort to redeem 
the apparent tragedy they would prove to be blessings. 
Such has been the case. 



SOCIETIES AND PUBLIC BANQUETS 409 

While new friends are not the same as old ones, yet I 
have found cheer and inspiration in the close communion 
with the young of succeeding generations. They have 
made and are making this a mighty good world for 
me. 



INDEX 



INDEX 



Aberdeen, Earl of, 383 

Adams, Charles Francis, 91, 191 

Alden, 278, 279 

Aldrich, Senator Nelson W., 180, 190 

Alger, General Russell A., 219 

Andrews, Governor, 333, 334 

Andrews, Rufus C, 58, 59 

Appleton, Colonel, 218, 219 

Arnold, Matthew, 369-371 

Arthur [Chief, Locomotive Brother- 
hood], 245 

Arthur, Chester A., 101 ; Chapter IX, 
1 16-123 

Asquith, Mrs. Margot Tennent, 263 

Astor, Mrs. John Jacob, 359 

Athenaeum Club, 307, 308 

Atkinson, Edward, 397, 398 

Bacon, Reverend Doctor, 16 

Bacon, Senator, 175 

Bailey, Senator Joseph W., 183 

Balfour, Arthur J., 196 

Barlow, General Francis C, 40 

Barnum, P. T., 364, 365 

Beaman, C. C, 405, 406 

Beecher, Henry Ward, 313, 323-327, 

379. 389. 390 
Bell, Professor, 354, 355 
Bennett, James Gordon, 345, 346 
Beresford, Admiral Lord Charles, 

280 
Beveridge, Senator Albert J., 183 
Bigelow, John, 216 
Bissell, C. M., 253, 254 
Black, Governor Frank S., 160, 

218, 219 
Blaine, James G., 85, 100, 121, 

134, 139; Chapter XII, 141- 

266, 267, 285, 286 
Bliss, William, 235 
Booth, Edwin, 358, 359 
Brady, Judge John T., 70 
Brewer, Justice David J., 5 
Brewer, Doctor James, 11 



279, 



161, 

130. 
-146; 



Bromley, Isaac, 404 

Brotherhood of Locomotive Engineers, 

245-248 
Brown, Justice Henry Billings, 5 
Brown, John Mason, 6 
Brown, W. C, 250 
Browning, Robert, 193-195 
Bruce, General, 335~337 
Bryan, William Jennings, 152, 153 
Buckley, Doctor, 215, 216 
Buffalo Evening News, 344 
Burchard, Reverend Doctor, 144, 145 
Burlingame, Anson, 43-45 
Burroughs, John, 253 
Burt, Silas W., 101 
Butler, Edward H., 344 
Butterfield, John, 53 

Caldwell, D. W., 238 

Callaway, Samuel R., 250 

Callicot, T. C, 24-26 

Carnegie, Andrew, 377 

Carter, Senator, 180, 181, 187, 188 

Cassatt, A. J., 237, 238 

Cassini, Ambassador, 197, 198 

Catherine of Russia, 197 

Century Club, 372 

Chamberlain, Joseph, 261, 262 

Chase, Salmon P., 65-67, 106 

Choate, Joseph H., 106, 200-202, 381- 

383. 394- 395 
Churchill, Lord and Lady Randolph, 

268, 269 
Civil Service Association, 117 
Clark, Erastus, 83 
Clarke, Horace F., 330, 331 
Clarke, Justice John Proctor, 404 
Clarkson, James S., 135 
Clay, Senator Clement C, 61 
Clay, Henry, 139, 141 
Clemens, Samuel, see Twain, Mark 
Cleveland, Grover, Chapter X, 124- 

128; 285, 387 
Coleridge, Lord Chief Justice, 206, 207 



413 



414 



INDEX 



Conkling, Senator Roscoe, 35; Chapter 
V, 75-86; 99, 100, 103, in, 112, 120, 
122, 123 

Cook, Charles, 28 

Coolidge, Vice-President Calvin, 177, 

342 
Cork, Lady, 291, 292 
Cornell, Governor Alonzo B., 101, 218 
Corwin, Thomas, 321, 322 
Crane, Senator M. W., 183 
Curtin, Governor Andrew G., 31, 32 
Curtis, George William, 17, 70, 79-81, 

3i8, 319 
Czolgosz, Leon, 156 

Daly, Augustin, 363, 368, 369 

Daly, Judge Charles P., 70 

Dana, Charles A., 344, 345 

d'Aumale, Duke, 304-306 

Davenport, Fanny, 364 

Davies, Professor, 47 

Davis, Senator Jeff., 184, 185 

Davis, Jefferson, 62 

Dawson, George, 119 

Depew Club, 376, 377 

Depew, Mrs. [mother of Chauncey 

M. Depew], 10, 11 
Dickens, Charles, n, 12 
Dickinson, Daniel S., 60, 61, 333-335 
Disraeli, Benjamin, 274, 303 
Dix, John A., 95, 96 
Dunn, Arthur, 393 
Dwight, President Timothy, 8 

Edward VII, 276, 278, 282-284, 287- 

290, 292, 293 
Elkins, Stephen B., 138 
English, William H., 376 
Evarts, William M., Chapter VII, 99- 

106; 395 
Everett, William, 393, 394 

Farragut, Admiral, 63, 64 

Farrar, Canon, 306, 307 

Fenton, Governor Reuben E., 34, 35, 

77, 84 
Fink, Commissioner Albert, 234 
Fisher, Lord John, 281 
Fiske, Professor John, 401 
Fitzgerald, General Louis, 218, 219 
Flower, Roswell P., 220-224 



Foraker, Senator Joseph B., 149, 183, 

386, 389 
Forney, John W., 32 
Foster, John W., 139 
Frye, Senator, 178-180 

Ganson, John, 59 

Garfield, James A., Chapter VIII, 107- 

115; 121, 317, 341, 389 
Garrett, John W., 231, 232, 234, 239 
Garrison, William Lloyd, 313 
Gibbs, Frederick, 158, 159 
Gi'.lett, Speaker Frederick H., 342 
Gladstone, 256-261, 263-266, 274, 299, 

379 
Gladstone, Mrs., 260 
Gould, Jay, 350 
Grady, Henry W., 380, 381 
Grant, General Frederick D., 71, 72 
Grant, General Ulysses S., 49-51; 

Chapter IV, 67-74; 75-77. 95. 99, 

in, 277, 278, 379 
Graves, 247 
Greeley, Horace, 12, 23, 62, 63; Chapter 

VI, 87-98; 356, 357 
Gridiron Club, 181, 182, 392, 393 
Griscom, Clement A., 178, 179 
Griswold, John A., 88 
Grow, Galusha A., 34 

Hadley, Professor, 7 

Hale, Senator Eugene, 185 

Hall, Doctor John, 401 

Hancock, General, 107, 108 

Hanna, Senator Mark, 147, 149, 150, 

157, 168, 184 
Harding, President Warren G., 177, 

340-342, 389, 408 
Harlem Railroad, 227, 229 
Harrison, Benjamin, Chapter XI, 129- 

140 
Hastings, Hugh J., 328, 329 
Hay, John, 196, 197 
Hayes, Rutherford B., Chapter VII, 

99-106; 117, 125 
Herrick, Ambassador Myron T., 311, 

378 
Hewitt, Abram S., 216, 217, 299-301 
Hill, Governor David B., 219, 220 
Hiscock, Senator Frank, 134 
Hoar, Senator George F., 122, 181 



INDEX 



415 



Hobart, Vice-President, 156 

Homburg, 282, 283 

Hopkins, Johns, 239 

Hoppin, William J., 191, 192 

Howard, Bronson, 366 

Howland, Judge Henry E., 404 

Hubbard, Gardner, 354 

Hudson River Railroad, 226, 227, 229, 

230 
Hughes, Secretary Charles E., 339 
Hughitt, Marvin, 254 
Hurlburt, William H., 244 
Husted, General James W., 137 

Ingalls, Senator John J., 219 
Ingalls, Melville E., 235, 236 
Ingersoll, Colonel Robert G., 100, 309, 

319-321, 379 
Irving, Sir Henry, 301-303 
Irving, Washington, 361 
Ismay, J. Bruce, 276 

James, General Thomas L., 84 

Japan, 45 

Jefferson, Joseph, 360 

Jerome, Leonard, 268 

Jerome, William, 268 

Johnson [Secretary of State Commit- 
tee], 119 

Johnson, President Andrew, 46-50, 60, 
61 

Jones, George, 67, 68 

Kernan, Senator Francis, 93 
King, John, 239 
Kingsley, Canon, 391 
Knights of Labor, 246-248 

Labouchere, Henry, 260, 261 

Lamar, Lucius Q. C, 386-388 

Larned, Professor, 7 

Lawrence [of State Committee], 80, 81 

Lawrence, Frank R., 390 

Ledyard, Henry B., 235 

Leighton, Sir Frederick, 303, 304 

Leo XIII, 295-297 

Liliuokalani, Queen, 279 

Lincoln, Abraham, 27, 28; Chapter 

III, 52-66; 108, 114, 316, 317, 327 
Lincoln, Robert T., 260, 261 
Livingstone, David, 372 



Lodge, Senator Henry Cabot, 183 

Logan, General John A., 206 

Lord, Chester S., 390 

Lotus Club, 372, 390, 391 

Lowden, Governor, 341 

Lowell, James Russell, 191, 204, 205, 

262, 263 
Lucy, Sir Henry, 308, 309 

McCosh, President James, 405 
McCulloch, Secretary Hugh, 47, 48 
McKinley, William, 137; Chapter XIII, 

147-157; 164 
MacVeagh, Attorney-General Wayne, 

5, 6, 31, 120, 322, 323 
Manchester, Duke of, 285, 286 
Mansfield, Richard, 361-363 
Mayer, Charles F., 239 
Merritt, General Edwin A., 101 
Merry del Val, Cardinal, 296 
Miller, Justice, 388 
Miller, Warner, 131 
Montauk Club, 374-376 
Moore, Charles H., 374 
Morgan, Senator Edwin D., 20, 25 
Morgan, Senator John T., 384, 385 
Morgan, Pierpont, 241, 393 
Morton, Governor Levi P., 147, 218, 

220 
Murphy, Thomas, 69 

New York Central Railroad, Chapter 

XVIII, 225-255 
New York Herald, 345, 346 
New York Sun, 344 
New York Times, 67, 68 
New York Tribune, 93 
New York World, 244, 391, 392, 396 
Newell, John, 235 
Newman, William H., 250 
Nye, Senator James W., 73, 336, 337 

Odell, Governor, 65 
Oglesby, Governor, 385, 386 
Olmstead, Professor, 8 
Orton, William, 355 

Peekskill Academy, 3, 4 
Peekskill-on-the-Hudson, 3, 4, 225, 

326, 402 
Phelps, Edward J., 192, 193, 195 



416 



INDEX 



Phelps, Mrs. Edward J., 195 

Phelps, William Walter, 404 

Philippe, Louis, 304, 305 

Phillips, Wendell, 313-315 

Piatt, Senator Thomas C, 85, 1 12, 113, 

129, 131, 134, 135, 160 
Porter, General Horace, 377 
Potter, Bishop, 391 
Potter, William, 298 
Priest, Major Enos, 253 
Princeton University, 405-407 
Proctor, Senator Redfield, 148, 271, 

272 
Pulitzer, Joseph, 244, 391, 392 

Quay, Matthew, 107, 135 

Ralph, Julian, 346, 347 

Randolph, John, 318 

Raymond, Henry J., 20-23, 33 1 

Reed, John, 81 

Rehan, Ada, 364, 369 

Reid, Ambassador Whitelaw, 198-200 

Richmond, Dean, 22, 35-37 

Roberts, George B., 237, 238 

Robertson, Senator William H., 60, 61, 

112, 113 
Robinson, Governor Lucius, 218 
Roosevelt, Theodore, 156; Chapter 

XIV, 158-174; 176, 199 
Root, Senator Elihu, 117, 156, 385 
Rosebery, Lord, 257, 258, 267, 268, 

286, 379 
Rothschild, Baron Alfred, 269-271 
Rothschild, Ferdinand, 195 
Rutter, James H., 242 

Sackville-West, Lord, 284, 285 

Sage, Mr. and Mrs. Russell, 348-350 

Salisbury, Lord, 298 

Saratoga Conference, 231-234 

Schell, Augustus, 353 

Schurz, Carl, 91 

Scott, Colonel Thomas A., 231, 232, 244 

Scott, Sir Walter, 361 

Selden, Henry R., 92 

Seward, Secretary William H., 42, 43, 

56, 57, 60, 61, 331, 332 
Seymour, Governor Horatio, 17, 23, 

27-29. 35. 36, 38, 41, 42, 64 
Shafer, Senator, 36 



Shah of Persia, 194, 195 

Sheffield, James R., 404 

Sheridan, General Philip, 30, 31, 71 

Sherman, General, 50, 51, 63, 64, 379, 

„ 38 ° 

Sherman, James S., 175-177 

Sherman, Secretary John, 101 

Slocum, General Henry W., 40 

Smith, Alfred H., 250 

Spencer, Earl, 266 

Spooner, Senator John C, 183 

Spurgeon, Charles, 306, 307 

Stanley, Sir Henry, 372, 373 

Stanton, Edwin M., 53-55 

Storrs, Emory, 120, 202-208 

Sullivan, Tim, 399, 400 

Sutherland, Duke of, 194, 195 

Taft, Chief Justice William Howard, 

174, 176, 177, 339 
Terry, Ellen, 358 
Thackeray, William Makepeace, 371, 

372 
Thatcher, Professor, 8 
Thomas, E. B., 239 
Thompson, Frank, 237 
Thompson, Sir Henry, 272, 273 
Thompson, Senator Jacob, 61 
Thurston, John M., 167 
Tilden, Governor Samuel J., 105, 209, 

218 
Tillinghast, 37, 38 

Tillman, Senator Benjamin, 181-183 
Tilton, Theodore, 326 
Toucey, John M., 251, 252 
Trunk Line Association, 241 
Twain, Mark, 72, 291-295 
Tweed, William M., 209 
Twichell, Doctor Joseph, 291 

Union League Club, 400, 401 

Vallandigham, Clement L., 28, 29, 64 

Van Buren, John, 41 

Vance, Zebulon, 126 

Vanderbilt, Commodore, 14, 37, 38, 

91. 92, 97. 227-232, 234, 239 
Vanderbilt, William H., 229, 240-244 
Victor Emmanuel III, 298 
Victoria, Queen, 273-279 
Voorhees, F. W., 251 



INDEX 



417 



Wadsworth, General James W., 23 
Wagner, Senator Webster, 120 
Waite, Chief Justice Morrison R., 106 
Washburne, Congressman Elihu B., 

54. 55. 63 
Washington, George, 305 
Webb, H. Walter, 251 
Webster, Daniel, 21, 22, 328-331 
Weed, Thurlow, 19, 20, 23 
Wellington, Duke of, 309 
Wells, Edward, 14 
West Shore Railroad, 242, 243 
White, Andrew D., 5, 6, 78 



White, Henry, 377 

Whitman, Governor Charles S., 340, 

34i 
William II, 173, 174, 276, 277 
Wilson, Senator Henry, 332, 333 
Wilson, President Woodrow, 158, 189 
Wood, General Leonard, 341 
Woolsey, President Theodore D., 6 
Wyndham, 365, 366 

Yale Alumni Association, 403, 404, 407 
Yale University, 4-9, 313 
Young, John Russell, 88 






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